Anjipl v NatWest ** WON **

[anjipl]

Hi all, I am helping my daughter claim back her charges which total 1998 plus interest. This occurred because she went 5p overdrawn one day and they piled on charge after charge after charge. Being young and naive, she buries her head in the sand; I just wish she'd mentioned something to me! Anyway, we are now at the same where we have just received the Part 18 request from Cobbetts. I have to say, it frightened me to death when I first read it but after reading the thread dedicated to the subject, I feel much better now. What really got my back up is they said we have to reply by Jan 07! What a cheek! Anyway going to send a letter which I have read in the thread and will stick with this claim through to the end, whatever the result. Soooo scarey though! Especially with all the legal jargon. Cobbetts should be ashamed of themselves trying to scare people this way!

[anjipl]

Thanks for response. Will keep at it to the bitter end!

[Guest NATTIE]

out of interest how old was your daughter when she first accrued charges?

[anjipl]

18 or 19, not sure which. Shes 25 now and we are claiming back 6 years.

[Guest NATTIE]

That's fine I have had dealings where the person has been under 18 which is not only unlawful but contrary to the banking code as you cannot give credit to someone under the age of 18.

[anjipl]

Hi all, we have sent back the Part 18 to Cobbetts, recorded delivery, and have just received AQ from the Court. I have a quick question if anyone can help. Natwest "forced" my daughter to take out a loan to cover her overdraft which occurred because of the bank charges. They told her that if she did not take out a loan, they would take her to Court. The loan was with an APR of something in the region of 29.9!! I am not sure of the exact figures but the loan was for around 2,800 and she has already made payments in this amount. She seems to think that she will have to repay about 6,000? Anyway, can I ask the Court, along with the claim for repayment of charges, to order the bank to cancel the loan seeing as she has already paid the 2,800 of the original amount? It seems a bit unfair that if we get the full amount of charges refunded, 2,500, she will still have to pay back a further 3,000 on the loan anyway unless they cancel it. Any help please guys?

[Guest NATTIE]

I would love to comment on the "forced" bit but nicoteine or rather lack of mean I cannot comment but gizmo a site helper has done this and maybe worth a PM

[gizmo111]

Hi Anj

 

have a look here and see how far I have got. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/natwest-bank/11431-nat-west-3-claims.html

Did you ask for the interest to be repaid on the claim - not to worry if you haven't we can address that seperately. Can you let me know how much of the loan was charges and how much was overdraft debt?

[anjipl]

Will do, need to speak to dear daughter. Will reply tomorrow and look at your thread. Many thanks.

[anjipl]

Hi, have spoken to dd who I'm afraid wasn't much help. She says that she has been forced to take out two loans, the first was for 1,500, then she got into trouble again and had to take out 2,800 loan to consolidate the previous loan and her new charges/overdraft. She says that she's not sure what proportion was for overdraft/charges. It doesn't say on the loan agreement, just that it was cash loan for Refinance Bank Borrowing. They also said she had to take insurance which totalled 963.00 a total credit of 3,763.00. The interest on that is 2,550.80. What I asked for in the mcol was for the loan to be dispensed with as she has paid back the 2,800. Does that make sense??

[gizmo111]

It will show on her bank statements and you can then marry it up with schedule which was her debt and which was charges. Can you post your exact POC here.

[anjipl]

I'm going to submit an amended POC as you did. My original was done through MCOL and, as you know, you are limited to the amount you can put on there. I then sent spreadsheet to the Court. I have to say I am finding this whole thing very complicated and difficult to understand although it has helped me a great deal reading through your thread. I will take a look through her bank statements and hopefully sort out some figures tomorrow. Thanks for your help and your thread has given me loads of assistance.

[gizmo111]

Let us see first so we can help with the wording for the loan amounts.

Glad my thread helped - even the party we had in the middle

[anjipl]

OK, will do. Will need some help in working out the interest on the loan. I have the original customer copy in which it states interest as 2,550.80 but assume this needs to be adjusted. I am not a financial person even though I keep my finances in order and have never incurred any penalties, I find it very difficult to understand how to work things out.

[anjipl]

Hi Gizmo111, the overdraft was for 450.00 and the rest consolidation of old loan (which was for overdraft plus charges) and new charges. Hope that makes sense. I have copied below my amended POC (mostly copied from yours) but haven't said anything about interest on loan as not sure how much I can claim. Hope you can help. Many thanks. Anji

Leanne (claimant) v National Westminster Bank (defendant)

Claim No xxxxxxx

1. The Claimant has an account xxxxxxx with the Defendant which was opened on 9th May 2000.
   
2. During the period in which the Account has been operating the Defendant debited numerous charges to the Account in respect of purported breaches of contract on the part of the Claimant and also charged interest on the charges once applied. The Claimant understands that the Defendant contends that the charges were debited in accordance with the terms of the contract between itself and the Claimant.
   
3. A list of the charges applied is attached to these particulars of claim.
   
4. The Claimant contends that:
    
   a) The charges debited to the Account are punitive in nature; are not a genuine pre-estimate of cost incurred by the Defendant; exceed any alleged actual loss to the Defendant in respect of any breaches of contract on the part of the Claimant; and are not intended to represent or relate to any alleged actual loss, but instead unduly enrich the Defendant which exercises the contractual term in respect of such charges with a view to profit.
    
   b) The contractual provision that permits the Defendant to levy such charges is unenforceable by virtue of the Unfair Contract Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations (1999), the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and the common law.
   
5. Accordingly the Claimant claims:
    
   a) the return of the amounts debited in respect of charges in the sum of £1998.00 and interest charged thereon; £358.16. Total £2356.16.
    
    
   b) Court costs;
    
   c) The claimant claims interest under s.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from 30/09/2002 of £358.16 and interest at the same rate up to the date of judgement or earlier at a daily rate of 0.729p.

 

Amount of Charges £1998.00

Amount of s.69 Interest £358.16

Amount Claimed £2356.16

Court Fee £ 120.00

Total Amount £ 2476.16

 

 

Amendment to claim issued 20/11/06 via HMCS Website in the Northampton County Court.

 

 

I believe that the contents of these particulars of claim are true

 

 

Signed:

 

 

Date:

__________________

[gizmo111]

Have you got the details of the loan

How much was lent?

How much was charges?

Hw much was interest?

 

You need these to work out the interest to claim back and then we can word a paragraph to add in.

 

The daily rate on the claim looks incorrect - should be 0.43 per day?

[anjipl]

Hi all, we got the standard letter of offer yesterday from Cobbetts with the usual stuff about not discussing with any third party. Offer was for a fraction of what we are claiming. We are not inclined to accept. They have given us until next Thursday to answer. Should I do reply or just ignore it?

 

Gizmo111, sorry for taking so long to get back to you. The loan is getting very complicated and I can't make head or tail of it, neither can dd. I am inclined to drop the claim because of the above. Basically from what I can see, 900.00 was paid in on 12 March 2003, this says "Draw down of loan". Not sure what this means? At this point she had 448.00 of bank charges. She thinks the rest was overdraft. Then on 30th March 2004, she got a loan for 1,500 and then on 25th January 2005 a consolidation loan of 2,800 at 25.9 % APR. I don't think I've got a hope of working it all out. Do you think I should drop it and just go for the charges and interest?

 

Quote:

 

The daily rate on the claim looks incorrect - should be 0.43 per day?

 

I used the spreadsheet to work out the interest. Formula is as follows:

(Amount*0.00022)*days since offence. Is this incorrect?

[Guest NATTIE]

Anjipl- "Drawn down "-date is when the loan was opened up or drawn down.

[anjipl]

OK, I think I understand. So I guess she had three loans in the space of two years, each being consolidated when new loan taken out. Oh, I wish she had spoken to me about this at the time! Too late now though.

[gizmo111]

i'll try and workwork out some figures later and see where we go from there.

[anjipl]

Hi all, I'm confused (not difficult in my case!!). Can anybody tell me what the s.69 interest is? I've done the spreadsheet which works out interest on charges, so just wondered if this is something else I should be claiming? Many thanks in advance of your reply.

[RobberBank]

s.69 is the interest the court can apply (8%) to the charges you're claiming back if you win.

[anjipl]

Thanks for your reply. Isn't that the same as the 8% which is on the spreadsheet?

[RobberBank]

Yes, but you cant ask for that back in your prelim etc....it's only something you ask for at court stage as it's only the court who can apply it. You can go for contractual interest at this stage though.

[anjipl]

Thank you. Much appreciated.