FIRST TRUST BANK - help needed

[flojo1985]

Hi all,

 

I sent the DPA letter to the First Trust on 3/4/06 along with the £10.00 fee.

First Trust cashed the Cheque on 6/3/06. They did not acknowlege my letter but were very quick to take my money.

 

I rang yesterday to remind them and was told that they would investigate and ring me back. They did not ring. I rang today and spoke to Fiona who said that they will not be releasing statements as I have already recieved the statements. She said that Bank Statements are not covered under the DPA. She said she will be putting this in writting and sending me out a letter together with a cheque for £10.00.

 

What do I do now?

[flojo1985]

Just an update

 

First Trust have refunded the £10.00 fee into my account.

[jonni2bad]

We're watching, honest!

 

Now that you are waiting, make sure you spend as much time as possible going through the FAQs and case guidance materials.

 

Best of luck

John

[flojo1985]

Just rec'd letter from First Trust. It reads like this:

 

 

 

 

Dear xxxxxxxxxx

 

I refer to your latter dater 3rd April 2006 received in our Lurgan Branch.

 

Your request is not valid under the DPA 1998 (The Act) our Lurgan Branch will be returning your £10.00 fee.

 

You are entitled under section 7 of the Act , to a copy of the personal information we hold on you and if you request this we wil of course send you a copy of the documentation you are entitled. The fee for such a request is £10.00

 

However I would advise that the details of the scdhedule of charges and fees for the past 6 years may not necessarily be included.

 

Please do not hesitate to contact me if you hav any further queries

 

Yours Sincerely

Pat McIntrye

Data Proptection Officer

Regulatory Compliance

 

 

What now???????????????

[jonni2bad]

If you sent the letter from our Library, word for word, then they have mistaken your request.

 

Reply along the lines of..............

 

*******************************************************

 

Data Protection Act disclosure request

 

Dear xxxxxxxxxxx

 

Account Number: xxxxxxxxx

 

I am in receipt of your letter dated xx/xx/xx, stating that you refuse to supply the information I have requested under the Data Protection Act of 1998.

 

My request was for a complete list of transactions and charges relating to my account since xx/xx/xx – in short, a list of charges with dates and amounts.

 

I suggested, alternatively, that a complete set of account statements for that period will be acceptable, but I did not specifically ask for this.

 

I am ready to bring this to the attention of the Information Commissioner should it prove necessary.

 

This letter has been sent by first class recorded delivery, and therefore should have reached you by xx/xx/xx (insert next working day after posting) – as you will be aware, as of this date you have just XX days (insert days remaining since they received your original request) in which to comply with my request.

 

As stated above, a complete set of account statements for the period in question will be acceptable; however, I expect this to be provided within the time period for DPA compliance.

 

Should there be any further attempts to delay compliance, I will be left with no alternative but to escalate this matter into an official complaint to the Information Commissioner and/or the County Court under s.7 and/or s.13 Data Protection Act

 

(If they have already returned your payment, then send it back with this. If not include the following text.....)

 

As soon as I receive the returned payment, I will resend it to you. Please be aware that this will not affect the timescale for compliance.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

********************************************************

 

Hope that helps you

John

[flojo1985]

Thanks a million John - your help is greatly appreciated

[big aid]

i am at exactly the same stage with first trust although it took them 40 days to get to this stage. i am going to send them a copy of john's letter and will let you know of any response

[flojo1985]

http://www.utv.co.uk/newsroom/indepth.asp?id=72798&pt=n

 

 

Please see above link. The Banks in Northern Ireland are behaving badly. This was posted on the UTV news today

[flojo1985]

Hi all

Just to let you kno that I rang the Infomation Commission who informed me that my original DPA request was perfectly valid under DPA.

I sent this letter yesterday. Guess what? They rang me yesterday afternoon, im getting all my information. I'll keep you posted!

 

 

28/04/2006

 

Dear Mr xxx

Account Number: xxx

Subject Access Request (Data Protection Act 1998)

I am in receipt of your letter dated 27/04/06, stating that you refuse to supply the information I have requested under the Data Protection Act of 1998.

My request was for a complete list of transactions and charges relating to my account for the past 6 years – in short, a list of charges with dates and amounts.

(I understand this information is exempt from any non-disclosure provisions as per Part IV exemptions – specifically 35 – (1), 2(a) of the Act.)

I suggested, alternatively, that a complete set of account statements for that period will be acceptable, but I did not specifically ask for this.

I have sought advice from the Information Commission ( telephone number 028 90511270) who were quite frankly surprised by your reply and have advised me that they are willing to take a formal complaint forward but that it might be better to try to sort this matter informally first. Hence, this letter.

This letter has been sent by first class recorded delivery, and therefore should have reached you by 29/04/06. As you have stated, you received my initial letter on the 05/04/06 you therefore have until the 15th May 2006 in which to comply with my request.

As stated above, a complete set of account statements for the period in question will be acceptable; however, I expect this to be provided within the time period for DPA compliance.

Should there be any further attempts to delay compliance, I will be left with no alternative but to escalate this matter into an official complaint to the Information Commissioner and/or the County Court under s.7 and/or s.13 Data Protection Act

I have again enclosed the statutory maximum fee of £10.

 

Please be aware that this will not affect the timescale for compliance.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

(Ms) xxx

NB. This letter has been faxed to your office today (28th April 2006) and to xxx in the local Branch as she was initially dealing with my request.

[jonni2bad]

Good work and well done.

 

How things change eh? Now you're the one doing the bullying!

 

[flojo1985]

Thanks for all your help, Johnny! Keep you posted!

[flojo1985]

Hi All,

 

Just to let you know that the Bank rang me again to tell me they would have a list of charges levied against my account by Friday or Monday. I politely thanked him and told him it was appreciated as they had until the 15th May to comply under DPA. He said that they were not supplying these under the DPA. He added that they were not obliged to supply them under DPA. (Still being awkward). I told him I did not agree with him. So I'll wait and see how he words his letter with a view to reporting them even though I should get my list of charges. No point in letting them off with anything!!!!!!!!!

 

In the meantime I have draughted this letter as my peliminary letter. Any comments would be appreciated:

 

 

REQUEST FOR REFUND OF CHARGES

 

My request

I am writing to ask you to refund the charges which you have levied from my account over the past 6 years. I now understand that the regime of fees which you have been applying to my account in relation to direct debit/standing order refusals, unauthorised overdrafts and so forth are unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent Consumer regulations.

I was not aware that First Trust had an agreement with the UK Government that allowed them to pick and choose the amount of times in a year that they had to comply with contract law.

 

It is my understanding that the laws of this country must be obeyed by all

- The Rule of Law - this dates back to the 1215-1217 Magna Carta.

 

I am of the view that your charges represent a penalty and are therefore unrecoverable at Common Law.

In the Scottish case of Castaneda and Others v. Clydebank Engineering and Shipbuilding Co., Ltd. (1904) 12 SLT 498; the House of Lords held that a contractual party can only recover damages for actual or liquidated losses incurred from a breach of contract.

This is also the position in English law: Wilson v Love [1896]; Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co Ltd v New Garage and Motor Co Ltd [1915] AC 79; Ford Motor Co v Armstrong [1915]; Bridge v Campbell Discount Co. Ltd [1962]; Murray v Leisureplay [2004].

 

Your charges do not reflect any actual loss; instead they appear to represent a lucrative profit-making scheme.

 

UK banks have recently given evidence to the House of Commons Treasury Committee on how bank charges are calculated: "The costs are going to pay for all the people we have who pursue debt, collect debt, speak to customers and chase payments. The way these charges are arrived at is by taking these total costs and making some assumptions about the volume that is going to come through to arrive at the individual charges" (2nd report, 25 January 2005, paragraph 50).

 

Accordingly, the charges applied to my account are not a reasonable pre-estimate of loss in relation to my account. No-one has had to look at my account or telephone me. No one has had to collect anything. Your charges would appear to represent a device to recover global losses (for example, loan defaulters, bad debt write off, including commercial lending in, and out of the UK).

In addition, it is unfair to require me to subsidise your global debt recovery costs and debt write-off.

 

On a separate note, your charges appear to represent an unfair term of contract which is contrary to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 (SI. 1999/2083). My account falls within the scope of Regulation 5 of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 as I am a consumer. Your charges constitute an unfair penalty under reference to paragraph 1(e) of schedule 2 of the said regulations:

Indicative and non-exhaustive list of terms which may be regarded as unfair - 1. Terms which have the object of effect of - (e) requiring any consumer who fails his obligation to pay a disproportionately high sum in compensation

 

0n 26 July 2005, the OFT stated that 'a charge is likely to be disproportionately high if it is more than a court would be likely to award if the lender sued the cardholder for breach of contract'. Because your charges include a large profit margin, in addition to actual loss, they are unrecoverable as an unfair term in contract. I believe that your charges require me to pay a disproportionately high sum in compensation for incurring transactions which were ultimately declined by an automated computer system.

Your responsibilities

I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law.

 

I am frankly shocked that you have operated my account in this way as I had always reposed confidence in your integrity and expertise as my fiduciary.

 

What I require

I calculate that, as at today’s date, you have taken a net total of £XX.XX which you have charged me in unauthorised overdraft fees. I request that you refund this amount in full.

 

Targets to resolve this matter

I hope that you will enter into a sincere dialogue with me about this matter and write on the assumption that you will prefer to do this rather than merely respond with standard letters and leaflets.

 

You have 10 working days, from receipt of this letter (i.e. by {day}, {date}), to reply unconditionally accepting my request in principle and letting me know a date by which I will receive payment.

 

If you do not respond, or do not respond positively, within this time period, I shall send you a further letter before action allowing a further 10 working days in which to reflect. I believe that these targets are more than sufficient for a large company such as yours with dedicated staff and departments.

 

After that will be no further communication from myself and I shall issue a claim at the expiry of the second deadline.

 

I look forward to hearing from you by return.

 

 

 

I'll keep you posted when I get my list of charges. Can't wait to send my first letter!!!!!!!!!!

 

Cheers

[flojo1985]

Hi all,

Just to keep you posted. I received DPA info yesterday.

They have listed fees and the interest is opposite them.

They have listed overdraft arrangement fees & referral charges for 6 years.

 

I have sent my first letter asking for all the above to be reinbursed. I hope I have done the right thing.

They have until 25/05/06 to reply

[big aid]

after some letters back and forth i have today received a letter saying that the first trust position remains the same and i will not be getting a list of charges similar to what flojo got

 

GAME, SET, AND MATCH, FIRST TRUST BANK

[flojo1985]

Report them to the IC. You can get a form online. Let me know if I can help.

[flojo1985]

Hi all

Got a reply from First Trust saying that they comply with the Banking Code blah blah.

LBA sent and should be received today. Has anyone ever been successful in Northern Ireland????

Cheers

[big aid]

there was a person on another thread dealing with BOI who had a court date for friday past, i have sent messages to him but still no reply.

as it stands, i think you are the furthest advanced so far.

[flojo1985]

Thanks BigAid. - By the way they do have a structured filing system as they were able to check my account for the past 6 years and tell me exactly how many days I was overdrawn during that period. They are only trying to put obstacles in your way. Good luck

[flojo1985]

Just an update - Court Papers lodged today

[big aid]

very good flo

 

keep us all posted and good luck

[flojo1985]

Court papers were sent over 2 weeks ago to First Trust from the Northern Ireland Court Service. We got our first letter form First Trust today. Guess what!!!!! More charges for £36 for the quarter. They are a joke. But these will be claimed back.

[big aid]

I Got My Quarterly Charges Letter Yesterday As Well

£40 I Think

[flojo1985]

Hi Bigaid

Do you think they are not taking us seriously? Even when there is court papers issued they are still issuing charges.

[big aid]

I Think That In Firat Trust, The Right Hand Does'nt Know Where The Left Is. These Charges Are Automated At Branch Level.

 

Has Anyone Ever Succeeded With A Claim And Then Asked For A Copy Of All Personal Information Held Since The Initial Dpa Request. I Think It Would Be Interesting To See What The Banks Are Noting Whilst Action Is Being Taken.

[Bru]

Hi Flojo

 

handed my preliminary approach letter into my branch today.

 

will open my own thread now.

 

Thanks to yourself and Big aid amongst others for all your help so far

 

Bru