RBS - Lewis Debt Recovery - CCA

[SHERLOCK]

May use yours in my other letters, ta HNY

[SHERLOCK]

Reply received.......investigations underway.......response in 10 days.

 

Thank you once again for bringing this to my attention.....hmmmmmmm.

 

SHERLOCK

[sarahpp]

Was this from RBS or Lewis Group?

[SHERLOCK]

this was a reply to my prelim to RBS.

 

HAVE PLACED LDR WITHIN MY DMP

[sarahpp]

Well, I suppose it is better than the usual "give us 4 weeks" that the banks I have dealt with so far have asked for! I presume you will be sticking to your timetable and sending your LBA next week

[SHERLOCK]

I really do try to keep to deadlines, its only when I have to pay 100's, as my A&L claim (MCOL due now) it becomes a bit of a stumbling block.

 

Hope i'm doing these right, have claimed their APR rate over the term of the account using one of the spreadsheets and I think that maybe, unless you are careful, the next parts of the claim can get a bit messy.

 

Its only a smallish claim but I don't know if they view them ALL with the same distaste

 

SHERLOCK

[SHERLOCK]

Received a letter this morning from RBS and it states:

 

They have lowered their fees to £12.00 from 28th June 2006!

 

It is not our policy to refund late payment/overlimit fees that were charged previously at a higher level at the time that the fee was incurred.

 

However, after due consideration and as a gesture of goodwill , I have refunded the £###.## direct to the account. We will not be refunding any interest that you refer to.

 

Any refund made, which relates to charges levied on the account prior to the sale of the debt must be refunded directly to the account in question. Subsequently we have to legally advise the agents that they have bought a debt with an incorrect balance on it. The balance that LDR can legally collect on is reflected by the refund of chargs made in 2004 which we have refunded, thus leaving a balance of £###.## still to be repaid.

 

We have therefore had to forward the £###.## on to LDR to correct the outstanding balance they can collect on. This complies with RBSG 's legal requirements regarding debts that have been sold.

 

The file will be left open to ensure you have sufficient time to consider my comments.

 

YOUR COMMENTS PLEASE.

 

questions: Do I,

 

1) Continue claim for interest at their contractual rate and allow them to repay it to LDR?

 

2) Continue with my threat to leave claim open if it is not paid to me?

 

3) Send my LBA with requests as before.

 

# Not sure on debt related legal requirements for creditors?#

 

SHERLOCK

[SHERLOCK]

This is what I based my theory on, have I read it correctly?

 

'The account’s Terms and Conditions specify the interest payable on unauthorised drawings from the account. The Claimants hold that this applies to unauthorised drawings by the Defendant as well as to unauthorised drawings by the Claimants. Should the court deem this incorrect, the Claimants claim the rate to be justified under the principle of mutuality and reciprocity, and is based on the Defendant’s unauthorised overdraft interest rate that would be applied under the terms of the above mentioned account'.

 

SHERLOCK

[SHERLOCK]

bump

[sarahpp]

Not ignoring you Sherlock - I am just looking through the deed of assignment which I have for C L Finance to see if there is anything in there which may help you.

[SHERLOCK]

sorry, a bit impatient there.

This was with cl finance previously, are the companies linked?

 

see, the bit about their legal obligation irks somewhat bcoz I have no contract with LDR, THEY JUST PURCHASED A DEBT.

My beef is with RBS who the debt is with and with whom I have an agreement.

 

They also state that LDR have bought a debt with an incorrect balance, the balance is correct if as the banks are claiming the charges are lawful, they can't have it both ways??

 

Thanks for your help,

 

SHERLOCK

[MARTIN3030]

I would seriously question the RBS reply.

We are well aware that Debts are bought and sold for a fraction of their original value to dcas.

It is not your problem that the dca has to be refunded and its likely to be nowhere near the figures they are trying to offset.(or the figures they tell you )

You should continue for the whole amount in your claim.

[SHERLOCK]

Hi Martin,

 

and should this payment be to myself as Sarah also states this?

[sarahpp]

Sorry - I have been cogitating on this.

 

RBS can't have it both ways can they? On the one hand they seem to be admitting no liability "gesture of goodwill etc...". On the other hand they are saying that they sold a debt with the wrong balance on it. It is their responsibility not yours.

 

I have looked at the deed of assignment which I received from GE/C.L.Finance (which is Lewis Group) and nowhere on it is there any recourse for C.L. to go back should the balance be incorrect. The balance is, as stated as at the date of assignment. I would imagine that these deeds are pretty standard in terminology especially since, as it is Lewis Group buying the debt, they probably drew up terms.

 

Hope this helps a bit

[SHERLOCK]

I will have to type up a letter and run it past you guys/girls if that is o.k.

 

Was thinking of proceeding with a LBA with additional replies to their letter above, e.g. NOT MY PROBLEM ETC?

 

Also is it standard to refuse the interest that was added, came to around 50% of claim?

 

any suggestions welcome

[SHERLOCK]

Please feel free to amend if letter may be 'legally' challenged or other??

 

 

Account Number: #### #### #### ####

 

 

Dear Madam,

 

I am disappointed that you imply you have the right to contact third parties on my behalf and to make payments on accounts that you no longer have legal entitlement.

You no longer have ownership rights to this alleged debt and are under no circumstances to make payments to third parties.

 

On date of assignment of the debt amount to The Lewis Group, one assumes any contract between RBSG and myself to be terminated.

 

As such I state that you are no longer given permission to exchange or discuss any details regarding the above account with any third party, failure to respond to my request may lead to possible legal proceedings.

 

Your contract with The Lewis Group has no bearing upon any communications with ourselves.

 

I request that all data regarding the above account be deleted from your system.

 

Please find enclosed my Letter Before Action as stated in my previous letter of ##th December 2006.

 

 

Yours Sincerely

 

 

SHERLOCK

[SHERLOCK]

bump #sorry# impatience got the better of me :o

[sarahpp]

Sherlock - have you decided whether or not to continue with your contractual claim? I am having a look at your letter but, this needs to be included somewhere.

[sarahpp]

Ok - on the assumption that you are carrying on - how does this sound:

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

 

I acknowledge receipt of your letter dated ***** and have noted the contents therein.

 

I am disappointed that you have decided to ignore my request for direct payment and

I now require clarification please regarding your assertion that funds must legally be remitted to LDR rather than to me. I can find no legislation which substantiates this assertion and would be grateful if you could provide reference to the relevant statutory provision(s).

 

You have also made payment excluding the contractual interest which I requested in my preliminary correspondence. Please note that this claim was not for statutory interest which is payable should matters progress to court but, rather contractual interest which I believe is payable immediately on the basis of a mutual and reciprocal relationship with your organisation. It is not up to RBSG to decide whether I am entitled to this rate of interest but, rather is at the discretion of the court should it remain unpaid before litigation.

 

To clarify my position, I will not consider this matter resolved until I have received payment personally which includes interest at the contractual rate mentioned in previous correspondence.

 

You have 14 days in which to reply in a satisfactory manner before I commence litigation.

[SHERLOCK]

Sarah that is wonderful, was going to reiterate my claim for contractual in LBA as per prelim.

 

Will add my details and send first thing in the morning, u r a STAR

[sarahpp]

No problem and good luck!

[SHERLOCK]

Received reply.......they will contact me within two weeks to let me know how it will be resolved??

 

Keep you posted,

 

SHERLOCK

[SHERLOCK]

Here it is folks,

 

RBSG sold the account to the Lewis Group and no longer have any legal rights to the account and the Lewis Group now own the debt. We have to pass the refund to them direct. No clarification of why? Are they breaching Data Protection Act Rules by contacting LDR when they have no longer, any legal rights over the account (is this claim anything to do with LDR).

 

As the account was a debt owing to the RBSG, any agreed refund would be applied direct to the account to reduce the debt. If we had not sold the debt, RBSG would not have given the refund to you direct, as this refund would not have left the account in credit. Agreed, but is it relevant to my claim?

 

The OFT agreed that we did not have to refund any interest in cases such as these. However, as a gesture of goodwill I have refunded the interest that you quoted. This has also been passed to LDR and they will be collecting a balance of £000.00. They have gone from 'we will not pay any interest showing', to refunding at contractual rate!

 

Leave file open, give me opportunity to address any concerns, also contact Ombudsman.

 

What do you reckon, REPLIES WELCOME

 

 

They have stated they will refund all the claim, now the issue is do they refund to me??

[SHERLOCK]

bump

[sarahpp]

Here it is folks,

 

RBSG sold the account to the Lewis Group and no longer have any legal rights to the account and the Lewis Group now own the debt. We have to pass the refund to them direct. No clarification of why? Are they breaching Data Protection Act Rules by contacting LDR when they have no longer, any legal rights over the account (is this claim anything to do with LDR). Exactly, your whole point was that they had no legal rights over this account! It would seem that they are unable to quote any legislation which legally obliges them to do this .

 

As the account was a debt owing to the RBSG, any agreed refund would be applied direct to the account to reduce the debt. If we had not sold the debt, RBSG would not have given the refund to you direct, as this refund would not have left the account in credit. Agreed, but is it relevant to my claim? NO

 

The OFT agreed that we did not have to refund any interest in cases such as these. However, as a gesture of goodwill I have refunded the interest that you quoted. This has also been passed to LDR and they will be collecting a balance of £000.00. They have gone from 'we will not pay any interest showing', to refunding at contractual rate! Isn't that interesting ?- I would be interested to see that particular OFT report

 

Leave file open, give me opportunity to address any concerns, also contact Ombudsman.

 

What do you reckon, REPLIES WELCOME

 

 

They have stated they will refund all the claim, now the issue is do they refund to me??

 

 

I am in a very similar situation as I have just found out that GE Group have refunded charges (but, no interest) to LDR and not me. I sent a letter out which was very similar to your own. It is up to you how you proceed from now on. I don't think that they are able to back up what they have done legally and yes, I would imagine that if they have been liaising with LDR about a debt they no longer have rights over, there is a data protection issue involved as well. The fact that they have paid you out at the contractual rate without going to court suggests that they are worried about being able to justify the way they have gone about this. I know that you wanted to be in a position to negotiate with LDR yourself (as I do) but, you have been paid out at contractual without going to court. I guess, what I am trying to say is that you have the option of refusing to acknowledge the payments as they have not been made to you personally as you have specified or forgetting about the fact that they have not complied with your request but, that your debt has cleared (and you managed to get the contractual rate).

 

Hope this helps