Main Dealer will not accept cancellation of New vehicle order

[arddodo]

Hi All,

Ordered a new car yesterday (completed a new car vehicle order form), in stock at dealer at about 5PM, when returning home I found that the cost of the vehicle on the paperwork was actually £1600 higher than we originally talked about. This meant that a used car exactly the spec I wanted was cheaper... grrrr

 

I called the dealer the next morning .. Sunday... and was told that I could cancel but they would be keeping the deposit (significant amount) because they had another possibility to sell the same car that day and they have sold my part exchange who in turn have sold it on - so it can't be returned ... loss of earnings.... Now I left about 5PM and the dealer closes at 6PM, so they would have to be one very efficient dealer to have done all that in that small amount of time !!

 

Isn't there a cooling off period? I have received no goods, and the vehicle in question was on site, already in stock(old stock that is).

 

Where do I stand? Do they have to give me the deposit back?

 

Thanks,

Bob

[sailor sam]

It depends.

 

They are allowed to charge for their losses. In the circumstances you describe, it's unlikely they have incurred any at all. I would suggest you ask them to explain on what basis (and how much) of your deposit they are keeping. If their position remains as it is, then you may have to write formally to demand a refund to which if they don't, you will take them to court.

[Surfer01]

Is it a new car or a new to you second hand car? Is it being bought on finance or cash. If on finance phone finance company and ask them to cancel finance and give them a reason i.e. cash flow problem.

[arddodo]

It depends.

 

They are allowed to charge for their losses. In the circumstances you describe, it's unlikely they have incurred any at all. I would suggest you ask them to explain on what basis (and how much) of your deposit they are keeping. If their position remains as it is, then you may have to write formally to demand a refund to which if they don't, you will take them to court.

 

Thanks for the pointers, do you know if there is a legal limit to what would be deemed as an acceptable amount for their losses? I spoke to them today and they still didn't want to budge they even threatened to counter sue for loss of earnings ?

 

Very disappointed considering this is a main dealer of a large motor manufacturer. Also very sad that people have to be like this.

 

Thanks

Bob

[arddodo]

Is it a new car or a new to you second hand car? Is it being bought on finance or cash. If on finance phone finance company and ask them to cancel finance and give them a reason i.e. cash flow problem.

 

New car, but have not got to the point of arranging finance with them for it yet, need to take in some paperwork - but that's obviously not going to happen now...

[sailor sam]

I suggest therefore to see what CAB say. As far as I can see all they could claim is admin charges. They won't have even registered the car in your name in the time scale you described.

[Surfer01]

New car, but have not got to the point of arranging finance with them for it yet, need to take in some paperwork - but that's obviously not going to happen now...

If you cannot get finance, then they have to refund. If a new car, how many months do you have to wait for delivery? I would say that their losses would be negligible and they are trying to use scare tactics. If they tried it on in a court they would be laughed out as they haven't suffered any losses in 24 hours. Pity you didn't pay the deposit by phone.

[heliosuk]

If you cannot get finance, then they have to refund. If a new car, how many months do you have to wait for delivery? I would say that their losses would be negligible and they are trying to use scare tactics. If they tried it on in a court they would be laughed out as they haven't suffered any losses in 24 hours. Pity you didn't pay the deposit by phone.

 

Actually they don't based on the above statement. It was a new car order that was filled out. How the car is financed is a seperate issue. As sam points out they would have to show losses incurred. Now this is where you need to be carefull as if the dealer missed the monthly target by one car, which was your order could theoretically be a considerable number of thousands of pounds.

 

I don't think a cooling off period would apply hereeither as it was an order, not finance.

 

The fact the dealer said it could have been sold.........well that's a bit weak but the fact they had technically sold your car on is very reallistic as they would have called a used car dealer to underwrite the price they gave you for the part exchange.

 

The details you see re the cost are often shrouded......it's the bottom line figure that counts.

[crem]

if the dealer missed the monthly target by one car, which was your order could theoretically be a considerable number of thousands of pounds.

deal was done on the 19th of the month, cancelled on the 20th. I don't think the dealer would be able to claim this one deal screwed his monthly target. Indeed, he wouldn't even know yet that he has missed it.

 

The fact the dealer said it could have been sold.........well that's a bit weak but the fact they had technically sold your car on is very reallistic as they would have called a used car dealer to underwrite the price they gave you for the part exchange

That would mean he has attempted to sell a vehicle that he didn't even own yet. I doubt that would be a viable claim either.

[heliosuk]

Missing the point crem. It seems it was a signed order. Orders are usually binding obligations and entered as such and are entered each night. It was a legally binding order it seems.

 

As regards the underwriting of a used car value it is as said, an underwriting that a trader will buy same said vehicle when it comes in. I did not point out that the new car dealer could claim this as a loss, onlypointing out that technically the car to be exchanged can be "sold" within minutes and is usually done prior to the actual deal for the new car to be done.

 

The dealer has not attemted to sell a vehicle he did not own, he merely underwrote the price he gave. The OP has nowhere to go with this aspect as it is common practice. If the dealer does not want the part exchange but takes it, they phone traders who will and get a price. Once agreed then it's deal done. Hasno legal standing but there is a "gentlemans" agreement between dealer and trader that the car the dealer takes will be off loaded at the price agreed previously over the phone.

[sailor sam]

I have to disagree that the "OP has nowhere to go with this". The dealer is only entitled to charge for his losses and if necessary, prove them in court. In the time scale the OP describes, the losses will be almost non-existent as there would be simply no opportunity for the dealer to have commenced the delivery process which starts with registering the vehicle. I'll bet the car never even left the storage area as it was 5pm on a Saturday when the car was 'ordered'. The OP dosn't say what deposit he put down but i'm sure he would have a decent case to recover 90% of it back. In my mind (and speaking from experience), in the time scale the OP describes, the dealer has incurred no losses at all. The fact that they may have had 'another potential buyer' would be irrelevant I think.

[Surfer01]

Either way, if a dealer has this sort of attitude, then they do not deserve any business. We got caught the same way in 2006 and eventually went ahead with the deal. The wife hated the car and after about 3 months it was traded in at a considerable loss to ourselves. Best to walk away if the deposit is low as better than losing thousands a few months later. However ask the dealer in writing to identify their losses as a first step.

[oddjobbob]

To add to what was stated earlier in this thread, car dealers do indeed phone the trade with a part exchange whilst you are sitting there trying to decide, it's normal practice and I used to do it (as 'the trade' i.e. underwrite) all the time, probably 3 or 4 times a day, out of which probably 1 would actually be dealt.

[crem]

it's normal practice and I used to do it (as 'the trade' i.e. underwrite) all the time, probably 3 or 4 times a day, out of which probably 1 would actually be dealt.

 

... so no actual "loss" on this bit of the deal either as the I presume the dealer only offered the OP what he was offered to move it on (unless he was trying to double profiteer by offering the OP less than he was moving it on for) and the underwriting dealer was probibly more expecting the car NOT to turn up than would.

[oddjobbob]

Hi Crem

 

Yes, that's absolutely correct, no actual 'loss' incurred as most of the undersrites do not come.

 

And no, the normal practice is that a trader will underwrite the car at say £1500 and the dealer will give the customer £1800 for it in p/x as this makes the customer feel better and they just wipe £300 profit out of the car the cusotmer is buying.

 

Its psychological, too: dealer asks customer 'what do you want for your car in p/x?' Customer '£1800' Dealer 'OK if we can give you than in p/x can we deal?' Customer (usually) 'yes'

 

Then the dealer buys the pcx for £1800 and 'sells' it ofr £1500 in theory losing £300 but giving little or no discount on car being purchased so still well in front.

 

That's how it works folks!

[crem]

yep I've bought a fair number of new cars and know the dealer is always doing "double maths" so to speak, offsetting one bit against another. As you say, as a customer what you must remain focused on is the "bottom line". i.e. is the deal you are getting and what you're are going pay per month the deal you were after.

 

Again, another big part of the dealer's profit can be his monthly bonuses. I have had one of my dealers telephone me on 30th of the month offering me a "good" deal if I can take a car out of his showroom by 31st of the month. Now I knew, and he was honest enough to tell me anyway, that any loss of profit he was offering me on the new car was dwarfed by the kick-back he would be due for meeting his targets. I got a decent deal on the car, and he got his bonus. Both happy

[Customer Angry]

If you want to really want to give the dealer something to think about, then start a website with your complaint. As soon the search results start showing the dealer name with a customer problems and car, they will think twice about being difficult. A one page website with photos, facts with links to YouTube, Twitter and Facebook should cost not more than £100 to set up.

Edited March 2, 2013 by ims21

[Surfer01]

If you want to really want to give the dealer something to think about, then start a website with your complaint. As soon the search results start showing the dealer name with a customer problems and car, they will think twice about being difficult. A one page website with photos, facts with links to YouTube, Twitter and Facebook should cost not more than £100 to set up.

 

 

????

Edited March 2, 2013 by ims21