In Australia with UK credit card debt.

[uktooz]

Hi,

 

I was wondering if someone could possibly help me - I am feeling very scared and am starting to have sleepless nights over my problem.

 

I have a problem in that I have credit card debt in the UK which due to a change in circumstances I am unable to pay. I have been in Oz a while (over 6 years) and a customer of said banks for almost 13 years - with this being the first time I have been unable to meet my financial obligations with them. I have a couple of questions...

 

1) Will I be able to negotiate a smaller monthly repayment?

2) Are they allowed to for e.g discuss my financial circumstances with my husband were they to phone my home number?

3) Are they (Capital One and Barclays) able to pursue me in Australia for payment should I for some reason not be able to pay even the smaller reduced amount?

 

 

We left the UK with 2 kids and have a 3rd that was born here. I kept my cards as initially we werent sure if our move would be permanent, and as a non - working mother, I needed that little bit of seperate financial 'security' (!).

When we left, we had a house which was let out - we religiously did UK and Oz tax returns declaring everything that needed to get declared. We eventually sold, at not a huge profit and declared that too - so ATO got their portion, leaving us with not a whole lot afterwards. We have always rented here in Oz and have moved 3 times in 5 years. I have always notified the banks of our change of address, so they know where I live at all times.

Despite not working for the last 7 years and not having any income other than what my husband gives/gave me, I have almost never missed a payment and have always been open with the banks to my wherabouts, contact details etc. In fact, almost two months ago, I cleared my Halifax card - over $1000 - so at least that one is gone now.

 

I now find myself in a more than likely relationship breakup, with no income, 3 kids under 8, no job (although, hopefully that will change soon) and no family to help me out. We will not return to the UK, I have no family there and the kids father would never allow them to leave anyway.

 

I have read the sticky threa with 27 pages, with regards to DCA'S and Pie and Beer, but am still pretty scared and nervous about the position I am in and was just wanting to know if anyone who has gone through what I am - to possibly give me some advice so I know what to expect.

 

I have written and printed letters to the bank, just need to send them off

- and thought I would gather some opinions before I do so.

 

Thanks very much for your time.

 

UktoOz

 

Edited January 17, 2012 by citizenB
formatted for easier reading :)

[cerberusalert]

1) Will I be able to negotiate a smaller monthly repayment?

Some lenders will & then review after a few months.

2) Are they allowed to for e.g discuss my financial circumstances with my husband were they to phone my home number?

You will have to give them written permission for him to deal on your behalf.

3) Are they (Capital One and Barclays) able to pursue me in Australia for payment should I for some reason not be able to pay even the smaller reduced amount?

They can ask for payment but since recently they won't be able to pursue through an OZ court, see; http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?304615-It-is-now-apparent-that-it-will-be-practically-impossible-to-enforce-a-UK-debt-in-Oz

 

Have they added any unfair charges to these a/cs over the years & was there any PPI?

[uktooz]

Thank you so much for your response.

 

I don't think that I have given him permission to deal on my behalf. I feel ashamed that I am now in this position and dont want anyone to know. With my relationship as it is, he would not be happy with me at all.

 

My accounts were paid in full until end of Nov - I have not yet paid what was due at the end of Dec, I simply do not have the 225 pounds that is required. As I have always been up to date, I dont think that there have been any unfair charges added, other than a 12 pound late payment fee now and then. (Usually because my husband was paid at the end of the month and with international transfer delays, I would miss the payment date by a few days. I rectified this by eventually moving the payment dates to mid month).

 

Thanks so much to anyone that can offer advice - I was up until 3am stressing about this

 

OktoOz

[cerberusalert]

Unless you have given them written permission or the a/cs are in joint names they cannot discuss the a/cs because of the data Protection Act.

 

Was there any PPI on the cards (insurance cover)?

 

Don't get yourself stressed with it, the most they can do is send you a cycle of meaningless threatening letters. As I've said there isn't a great deal they can do.

 

If they telephone you refuse to answer their security questions and tell them you will only communicate in writing. The original creditors will try to collect for a few months and then eventually sell the debt to an outside debt collector who will have even less chance of enforcing collection.

 

Only pay what you can reasonably afford, even if that's only a couple of dollars a month. Don't be bullied or intimidated into paying stupid amounts which would mean that you or your children are doing without things. debts like this ar non priority and in the grand scheme of things come last in the queue.

[uktooz]

I don't recall having insurance cover on these accounts. I know I have had on previous accounts but cannot recall any insurance payments being debited from the accounts. Does this cover make much difference? If so, how do I check - do I ring up the lenders and ask?

 

You mention only paying a small amount each month - I can do this (although would only be small amount - maybe 10-15 pounds a month) - Is this something I need to organise with the bank? I really cannot see my financial circumstances changing anywhere in the near future. Even with a job, paying anything substantial would not be possible with the new responsibilities I will have.

I guess I am also scared of people coming round to my home ie debt collectors and making a rucus in front of my neighbours or coming round on the weekend e.g when there potentially may be a family member here. We were meant to be moving out of here in a couple of months (which will still happen, but into seperate accomodation) and I would hate to have someone looking round here for me especially when my best friends husband is responsible for the maintenance of our building and is here almost every day (or am I under the false illusion that all debt collectors are all steroid pumping gangster types?).

 

How long does the whole process take from threatening letters etc then to the debt sale to a DCA agent this side? I would like to say that I have every intention of paying at least something, but as we know life is a funny thing and you never know what is around the corner - I would never have thought that meeting my partner at 17 and being together for 16 years that I would now be in this position! I would just like to to have all my bases covered and be prepared for any eventuality.

 

Thanks so much for your advice. I know I keep saying it, but I have nowhere else to turn and it is greatly appreciated.

[cerberusalert]

in the UK the vast majority of financial products which had PPI were deemed as mis-sold and the monies + 8% statutory interest can be reclaimed. You have six years from being aware of this to reclaim, even if it is an a/c which is no longer in use. To be able to start a reclaim you would need to send the original lender a SAR which would cost £10. You will receive amongst other things copies of statements, agreements etc which would allow you to determine what PPI payments have been made.

You mention only paying a small amount each month - I can do this (although would only be small amount - maybe 10-15 pounds a month) - Is this something I need to organise with the bank?

You don't have to negotiate a payment with them, just tell them that your circumstances have changed and you are no longer in a position to make the full re-payments but you have determined your income and expenditure and are willing to make a pro rata payment of x amount to them along with your other creditors.

 

No-one will come knocking on your door, although they may send you letters or try to contact you by 'phone. If you move you are under no legal obligation to tell your creditors of your new address. The debt collection laws are stricter in Oz than they are here in the UK, see; http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?307717-Fair-Debt-Collection-Practices-In-Australia

How long does the whole process take from threatening letters etc then to the debt sale to a DCA agent this side?

It's usually many months. They tend to sell the debts to a UK collector first & then eventually they then sell the debts on yet again.

Thanks so much for your advice. I know I keep saying it, but I have nowhere else to turn and it is greatly appreciated.

That's what we're here for, to help when we can. The Overseas Forum is relatively new and was created because we realised that there was very little help available to people living overseas who had problems in the UK, so we are on a learning curve but our knowledge is gradually improving.

[uktooz]

Thank you for your response.

 

I have yesterday paid nominal amounts into both my cards (one being 10 pounds and the other being 30 pounds), not that I can afford it, but because I want to be seen to them to be making some kind of effort. I want to avoid any nastiness or confrontation with them, although I am sure all that is still to come. With regards to the letters, do I state that the amount I can pay is a monthly repayment amount or a final settlement amount?

 

 

Kind Regards

[cerberusalert]

Just tell them what you are willing to pay per month, it's not worth trying to negotiate a settlement with them as they will eventually sell the debt on to a DCA for around 7 to 20% of the debts value and then reclaim tax. If you wanted to negotiate a settlement with the purchaser you will have a better chance.

 

Remember they cannot take any enforcement in OZ, if they tried using CCA 1974 it would be thrown out as the courts are refusing to hear those cases.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?304615-It-is-now-apparent-that-it-will-be-practically-impossible-to-enforce-a-UK-debt-in-Oz

[uktooz]

Hello,

 

Thanks for all the support so far.

 

Well, an update since my last post..

I have not yet posted my letters, to be honest I got cold feet and was also reading some posts on here saying that you shouldnt formally acknowledge your debt with the bank nor put an actual signature on your letters sent to them - both of which I had done. I thought perhaps I would hold off and see what/if I could pay towards the debt when my partner got paid this month. Well, he got paid on the 27th of the month - this month we are actually under, so I can't even fiddle the books (so to speak) and pay the banks even a nominal sum.

In the last few days, I have started getting phone calls late afternoon and early evening, with the latest call being 00.30 am - I have never answered them, just let them go to voicemail - no messages are ever left. I am assuming it must be C*p 1 as one month about 2 years ago, I was late in paying (by 4 days as my partner got paid later than usual!) the landline is the number they rang me on. I had friends over tonight and I had another call, hung up again when they heard voicemail - ended up unplugging the phone from the socket - this may have to become a permanent thing - the obvious time for them to call would be UK daytime which is Aus nightime and I can't have my family being disturbed at all hours - my kids are only 6,4 and 2.

They have also sent me an e-mail saying how when I log onto my online banking, I will find a 'Notice of Default sums' explaining what charges have been added onto my account. I can't bring myself to look at what they have added.

B***clays send my statements by snail mail, so I am yet to find out the disaster than awaits me with them.

Things with my partner are still rocky, he will be going away for a week for work, so that shall give us some breathing space and a week of him not answering the phone to people looking for me (or awkard questions as to why the phone is unplugged.).

What do I do? Do I just wait and see what comes in the post? Do I try and pay even a nominal sum of e.g 1 pound (I have to pay a 26 dollar international transfer fee to send money over - which I dont have ).

I would also like to say, that I have absolutely nothing that anyone could take away from me. I havent worked since 2004, so no income, I own no car, own no home, have no jewellery - how do I prove to them I have nothing and therefore they can do what they want, but in reality the likelyhood is that they wouldnt be able to recover any of the debt from me?

 

Thanks so much. I go through stages of being blase and then the panic washes over me - I finally got to sleep at 4am this morning and with the 6.30 am toddler wake-up call, mummy was very grumpy today. My poor children, they didnt ask for this and it is all my fault.....

[cerberusalert]

There isn't a great deal they can do to you. As I said in post #8 an OZ court will not hear a case which is covered by CCA 1974 which your a/c is.

[uktooz]

Hi,

 

Thank you - Yes, I realise that . What is scaring me is the whole process of what happens now with the bank and how it progresses to when when an Aussie debt collector chances their luck with me. I am aware of the reputation they have as being thugs etc - guess I am nervous of having to interact with these people (even though as you say, they can't actually get the money out of me). I know they have rules and regulations they have to abide by, but it still worries me - these forums have lots of stories about DCA's who don't really care about these rules and regulations and are forever breaking them. I am aware that you can report rogue DCA's to ASIC and ACCC but still a bit nervous

 

Kind Regards

 

OktoOz

[uktooz]

Good Evening,

 

I hope everyone is all well.

 

I am back requiring more advice...

After deciding I was not going to write to the banks, my conscience got the better of me and I did indeed send off two unsigned letters to B***Card and Cap 1 stating that I am not in a position to pay the minimum payment but could pay them 10 and 20 pounds respectively. I got their financial hardship postal addresses from them directly on the phone and sent the letters off on the 1st of February. I did pay them the 10 and 20 pounds at the end of last month (Jan) and have sent over this months payment, just waiting for the payment to clear into my current account so I can transfer into the credit cards.

 

I have not heard from them as of yet - is this normal? I would have expected at least an acknowledgment of my letters. I would have by now received my B***card statement (usually mid month), but notice I havent had anything yet - is this coincidental? I have received my Cap 1 statement by e-mail - havent opened the actual statement, but notice in the preview that they mention a 'Notice of Default' sums (as they did last month).

I definitely will not be contacting them again, I was just wondering what to expect as a 'next step' by the banks.

 

Many Thanks and Kind Regards,

 

UKtoOZ

[cerberusalert]

Barclaysharks are one of the worst banks to try and deal with, they have their own agenda & you will feel as if you're banging your head against a wall.

 

After a period of time both of them will eventually sell the debts to a DCA, as I've said previously they won't be able to do diddly squat.

 

just waiting for the payment to clear into my current account so I can transfer into the credit cards.]

Under no circumstances set up a Direct Debit, if you do that they'll be able to take as much money they like whenever they like.

[steveab1]

Hi uktooz,

 

I am in a situation similar to yours (except they don't have any phone numbers) and please rest assured that they will not be able to do anything to you. You are fireproof so please stop worrying yourself to death over these bloody parasites.

 

Regards

[steveab1]

I also meant to say not to give them any more money. You can't afford it so don't pay it.

 

Regards.

[uktooz]

Thanks for your replies - and to you Steve - I am sure you will get to read about my adventures with this lot as they progress and will more than likely need your advice at times.

 

I did in fact receive a very polite letter from Barclays on Friday, thanking me (!) for letting them know about my circumstances and that they have frozen all interest and fees on my account. They have also stated that they accept my 10 pounds per month offer, however, as we have not entered into a formal repayment plan, my account will eventually be closed and my account sent onto their recoveries team. They also said that should I wish to enter a formal repayment plan, I need to pay them 11.85 pounds a month - does this mean they will let me pay this until the debt is clear and not pass my details onto any debt collectors? Not saying I will pay, but just out of interest....

 

I have still not heard from cap 1 - which is the bigger of the debt.

 

Another gripe I have is Halifax...about 4 months ago, I paid almost 500 pounds to clear my balance - which I thought I had done, but they then added the interest onto the account again. I got the statement - late and therefore paid late so got a penalty of 12 pounds. I have paid 2 x 5 pounds for the last couple of months but due to international transfer times were both late and now my balance is sitting on 45 pounds again - thanks to their fees!!! They have now written to me saying that I have to pay 31 pounds to clear the arrears - I have no intention of paying but I am quite peed off that they are allowed to get away with this!!

 

UktoOz

[cerberusalert]

They also said that should I wish to enter a formal repayment plan, I need to pay them 11.85 pounds a month - does this mean they will let me pay this until the debt is clear and not pass my details onto any debt collectors? Not saying I will pay, but just out of interest....

They will want to review your repayments after about six months & try to keep upping it, eventually they will sell the debt on to a DCA just to clear their books of a toxic debt & to reclaim tax.

I have still not heard from cap 1 - which is the bigger of the debt.]

they will be probably be in the process of selling the debt.

Another gripe I have is halifax

I know how you feel, they bounced an unauthorized direct debit which put my a/c £4 into overdraft.... it now stands at over £800 o/d. i hope they're not holding their breath waiting for me to pay it.

[uktooz]

Hi,

I thought I would pop on with some updates.

 

1) To date, I have not heard anything from CapitalOne. I am still getting their email statements but am yet to open one. Each one does mention Default sums that have been added onto the balance, but no actual letter response to the letter I sent them in the post at the beginning of February.

 

2) Today in the post I have recieved a letter from Mercers (whom I believe are Barclay's inhouse DCA?) stating that a Default has now been registered and that I need to pay xxx xpounds by mid next week. Now, I cannot pay this and even if I could, I cant afford to pay the monthly installments which would need to be paid thereafter. They did respond to my letter in February stating that they would accept 11.85 pounds (sorry, no pound symbol) but to give them that, I would be spending $26 to wire it to the UK. As I dont work, with kids to feed - you can guess which takes priority! The question I have is, do I respond or just ignore? I am moving in 2 months, and will have a mail redirection so I will still get their mail - they will just not know where I am going to?

 

3) I have received a Halifax letter too. Now bear in mind, I had paid this acc off in full about 4 months ago, but they then went and added a few days interest onto the account. I had paid the account off according to their last statement plus an extra to cover the unadded interest, but it wasnt enough it seems . I didnt received the statement until the due date had come and gone so what was about 4 pounds owing, has now become about 60 pounds due to their fees! (60 pounds or so - they haven't sent me a statement, just a letter saying that my arrears are now 30.25 ) I have no intention of paying this as it isnt debt (!), but just want to know at what point will they stop inflating my outstanding balance and move it on?

 

Thanks for all your help.

 

UKtoOZ

[cerberusalert]

2) Today in the post I have recieved a letter from Mercers (whom I believe are Barclay's inhouse DCA?)

Yes it's their in-house collection division. Ignore them, they'll eventually sell the alleged debt to an outside debt collector. The only details they'll receive are your old address.

3) I have received a halifax letter too.

Ignore them too, the vast majority of what they've added are unfair charges. Again they'll sell the debt on.

 

As I've said earlier, they can do diddly-squat so forget about them.

[uktooz]

Well, I logged into my Barclays current account today - I have always had an overdraft of 250 and then a 'reserve' of 1,000 should I go over the 250. Now, I have not had any correspondence from them about this, but my overdraft slipped just over the 250 mark into the reserve and they have charge me close to 200 pounds for this! From what I can see they are charging me 22 pounds per 5 or 6 days that I am in 'reserve' overdraft PLUS interest on this....just looking at what has happened to my account in the last 6 weeks, I can see I am going to be sitting on close to a thousand in no time. I know I have outstanding amounts on my credit cards, but despite this, I have always put a little money into my overdraft via my mother so that precisely this thing wouldnt happen. Any advice on what to do? Gosh, this is turning into such a mess!

[cerberusalert]

If you have credit cards with the same bank they have the 'right of set-off' which means they can use your overdraft facility to pay the credit card charges.

 

As said earlier there is nothing they can do in Oz so really there is no point in continuing to make payments into those a/cs as they will still add charges and interest until they sell the debts on.