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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Welcome Finance and settlement figure


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Hi Guys, I wonder if someone can help me please? Recently lost my job/business and have now decided to sell my house and get a fresh start. Unfortunately I have a couple of secured loans with Guess who? First Plus (2nd charge) and Welcome Finance as a (3rd Charge) which I took out some time a go for my business.

 

I have now sold my house but unfortunately there is a shortfall owing to Welcome Finance and I have prepared a letter to send offering them a full and final settlement which I believe is totally fair. This is based on the fact that in early 2005 I borrowed £22k and as of their recent so called settlement figure I still owe £21k even though I have paid them back more than £21k since 2006. The strange thing is that I believe their figure is wrong as in mid 2006, 17 months after I took out the loan I asked for an early settlement and they came back with an initial figure owing of £56k - £29K interest reversal and minus £5k for payments made, this left a balance of approx £22k which I can partly understand. However after a further 5 years and paying an additional £16k (total £21K) back. their latest settlement figure shows still £21k approx???? Is it me or am I going mad!!!

 

I have spoken to a very unhelpfull lady who said that they are not accepting short settlements, however she was not in a position I believe to say yes or no anyway.

 

If they do not accept this it means I will not be able to sell my house and will have to hand back the keys to the mortgage company and then proabably bankruptcy. I have explained to Welcome that if they do not accept my offer they wil end up getting nothing as a quick sale by the mortgage company would not get then anywhere near the sale I have accepted leaving them with nothing. Can they be that stupid???

 

Any help or advice on this guys would be appreciated. I have heard that postppj is a superstar when it comes to sortig this bunch of morons out, if so I could do with your help.

 

Cheers

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At the end of the day they will have no option other than accept the shortfall. Although they may pursue you later. However if the property has gone there is lttle they can do.

 

Welcome get hit with this one a regular basis as they regularly provided secured loans on a inflated valuation. The other thing is that they did not always register the security and this is something you should check.

 

Perhaps someone could come in and advise you how to check if the security is registered as I am Scottish based and not familiar with procedures outwith.

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Hi Crocdoc,

 

Thanks for the reply, the property has not gone yet and will not be able to go unless they release their charge on the property which is on the land registry as I have checked. The girl was adamant that they would not accept this as it is now not their policy to accept shortfalls? Which I think is absolutely bonkers. I have offered them over 50% of their over inflated balance, which still gives them a very healthy profit over all. These guys are a law unto themselves and I am seriously thinking about challenging their settlement. The only prob is it costs money to do this!!!

 

Thanks again for your help.

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Hi Guys, I wonder if someone can help me please? Recently lost my job/business and have now decided to sell my house and get a fresh start. Unfortunately I have a couple of secured loans with Guess who? First Plus (2nd charge) and Welcome Finance as a (3rd Charge) which I took out some time a go for my business.

 

I have now sold my house but unfortunately there is a shortfall owing to Welcome Finance and I have prepared a letter to send offering them a full and final settlement which I believe is totally fair. This is based on the fact that in early 2005 I borrowed £22k and as of their recent so called settlement figure I still owe £21k even though I have paid them back more than £21k since 2006. The strange thing is that I believe their figure is wrong as in mid 2006, 17 months after I took out the loan I asked for an early settlement and they came back with an initial figure owing of £56k - £29K interest reversal and minus £5k for payments made, this left a balance of approx £22k which I can partly understand. However after a further 5 years and paying an additional £16k (total £21K) back. their latest settlement figure shows still £21k approx???? Is it me or am I going mad!!!

 

I have spoken to a very unhelpfull lady who said that they are not accepting short settlements, however she was not in a position I believe to say yes or no anyway.

 

If they do not accept this it means I will not be able to sell my house and will have to hand back the keys to the mortgage company and then proabably bankruptcy. I have explained to Welcome that if they do not accept my offer they wil end up getting nothing as a quick sale by the mortgage company would not get then anywhere near the sale I have accepted leaving them with nothing. Can they be that stupid???

 

Any help or advice on this guys would be appreciated. I have heard that postppj is a superstar when it comes to sortig this bunch of morons out, if so I could do with your help.

 

Cheers

 

Hi mateback in 2006 I was in exactly the same situation. Mortgage with Northern Rock, 2nd charge also with Northern Rock, 3rd charge with Welcome Finance. I was in financial dicciculty and sold my property too. I paid the mortgage, first charge and most of the second charge but was left with around a £5k balance with Welcome Finance.They had no choice but to accept this and in the end the remaining balance was paid as an unsecured loan for a period of time. Its worth noting however that after paying it back for a couple of years, I managed to get £3k of this written off, because I claimed the PPI from the loan against Welcome and won. Have a look and see if your eligible.Best of luck

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Hi Edinburgh 7,

 

Thanks for the reply, do you mind me asking did Welcome release the charge with out any payment and then turn it in to an unsecured loan? As I was led to believe that they could stop the sale of the property? Or do they have no choice but to release the charge?

 

Cheers

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Hi Edinburgh 7,

 

Thanks for the reply, do you mind me asking did Welcome release the charge with out any payment and then turn it in to an unsecured loan? As I was led to believe that they could stop the sale of the property? Or do they have no choice but to release the charge?

 

Cheers

 

In all honesty mate, they didnt even question it. I told them if I didnt sell then Id go bankrupt, the house would be reposessed and they would get nothing. As it is I wold the house and paid them about £22k with the £5k being left over. No unsecured loan was drawn up, it just sort of worked out that way. There were no additional charges and the interest on the remaining balance was frozen.

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Hi Geezey

 

I spoke to my local branch of Welcome yesterday and wanted to speak to them about a settlement ( i owe just under 4100 in arrears which is the total debt). I was wanting to offer them about 50% but got told by the office that they were not accepting settlements anymore....Is this the case or do you think it is worth offering them a figure...

 

Really want to get rid of this debt!!

 

Thank you

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Hi Jimjo,

 

I know how you feel as have had mixed messages from Welcome regarding settlement figures. All I can say is that in my situation if they don't accept the settlement and release the charge on my house then I will go bankrupt and they will get absolutely nothing.

 

I have spoken to my solicitor who is dealing with my house sale and he thinks it would be absolutely crazy for them not to take up my offer, knowing that the alternative is £0 instead of over £10K. Plus the fact that their parent company is in serious financial trouble.

 

However I would say to you that unless you are in a position that if they do not accept a reduced settlement it would mean you going bankrupt or doing a debt relief order, then there is no advantage to them in accepting your offer they may as well just carry on pursuing you.

 

 

I would also look at the thread response below from Edinburgh 7 as he has had some joy doing this.

 

On a final note I am in the process of trying to get my settlement figure worked out correctly in acccordence with the consumer credit act relating to settlement figures as I believe Welcome may be trying to pull a fast one with many of its customers. Will keep the forum up to date.

 

Good luck.

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