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    • Please can you avoid posting solid blocks of text. It is difficult for people to read especially when they are using a small screen such as a telephone. Well spaced and punctuated please. I hear what you say about the evidence – but do you have copies of it? And if so can we see it please. That's the point. We want to know what you have. As long as you have the evidence in your possession then you have some kind of control
    • Hi, the vehicle went to Audi Chingford on Thursday 13th May. I did state beforehand that I only wanted a diagnostic. The technician out of courtesy opened the drain letting huge deposits of water escape the seals. Video evidence was provided via AUDI cam. The link for the audi cam has been forwarded to BMW and Motonovo. I spoke to branch manager explained the situation and he stated he would sent me an email outlining the issue. Audi state this is not really an issue and more of a design flaw. However, the seals still have water ingress. I purchased the vehicle with £0 deposit on a 60 months HP plan for £520.00. The vehicle total was £21000. I did not go for any extended warranty. I live almost 70 miles away from the aftersales centre in Peterborough. I have previously uploaded the document I forwarded to BMW however it was in word format. I have had to buy a new tyre almost three days after purchasing vehicle. BMW still have not compensated me for the v62 cost as they said they would. 
    • I would suggest that you stop trying to rely on legal theory – as you understand it. Firstly, because we are dealing with practical/pragmatic situations and at a low value level where these arguments tend not to work. Secondly, because you clearly have misunderstood the assessment of quantum where there are breaches of obligations. The formula that you have cited above is the method of loss calculation in torts. In contract it is entirely different. The law of obligations generally attempts to remedy the breach. This means that in tort, damages seek to put you into the position you would have been in had the breach not occurred. In other words it returns you to your starting position – point zero. Contract damages attend put you into the position that you would have been had the breach not occurred but this is not your starting position, contract damages assume that the agreement in dispute had actually been carried out. This puts you into your final position. You sold an item for £XXX. Your expectation was that you your item would be correctly delivered and that you would be the beneficiary of £XXX. Your expectation loss is the amount that you sold the item for and that is all you are entitled to recover. If you want, you can try to sue for the larger sum – and we will help you. But if they ask for evidence of the value of the item as it was sold then I can almost guarantee that either you will be obliged to settle for the lesser sum – or else a judge will give you judgement but for the lesser sum. This will put you to the position that you would have been had there been no breach of contract. I understand from you now that when you dispatch the item you declared the retail cost to you and not your expected benefit of £XXX. To claim for the retail value in the circumstances would offend the rules relating to betterment. If you want to do it then we will help you – but don't be surprised if you take a tumble.  
    • I was caught speeding 3 times in the same week, on the same road. All times were 8-12mph higher than the limit. I was offered the course for the first offense and I now need to accept the other 2 offenses. I just want to be ready for what might come. Will I get the £100 fine and 3 points for each of them or do I face something more severe?  These are my only offenses in 8 years of driving.
    • I'll get my letter drafted this evening. Its an item I sold, which I'm also concerned about, as whilst I don't have my original purchase receipt (the best I have is my credit card statement showing a purchase from Car Audio Centre), I do unfortunately have the eBay listing where I sold it for much less. But as I said before this is now a question of compensation: true compensation would seek to put me back into the position I was in before the loss ie: that title would remain with me until my buyer has accepted this, and so compensation should be that which would be needed to replace the lost item. But in the world of instant electronic payment, it could be argued that as I had already been paid, the title to the goods had already transferred, and I was required to refund the buyer after the loss. And so, despite my declared value being the retail price - that which is needed to return me to my pre-sales position, the compensatory value should be the value I sold it for, which being a second-hand item from a private seller is lower. I still believe that I should be claiming for the item's full value, rather than how much I sold it for, as this is the same for insurance: we don't insure the value we paid, but rather the value of the item to put us back into the position we would be in if we ever needed to claim. Its for the loss adjuster to argue the toss
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
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    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Bogus parking charges Excel - Moor Centre car park Brierley Hill


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I’ve exchanged letters with them so they know I’m the keeper, and they know I’m not the type of person to simply ignore correspondence.

 

Do you think there is an option make a "without prejudice save as to costs" style offer of say 50p+£10 admin without admitting liability considering I’m:

 

1, unable to ID the driver

2, due to the time that has now elapsed from the date of the incident, it is unreasonable to have expected any alleged driver to have retained the ticket. Therefore I’m unable to verify or defend their allegation

 

Do you think they would go all the way to court based on this approach?

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as every will tell you IGNORE THEM

 

the more you contact them , they more they think they have got you worried and they will keep sending their stupid letter

 

COURT ? you got more chance of winning the lottery ( by the way what numbers you doing tonight :D )

..

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Still in a dilemma on this one, reviewing my options:

A - Pay the invoice £60: Forget all about it, or will they send another speculative invoice just to spite me?

B - Do nothing: probably the best route from day 1, but I’ve already engaged with them they know I’m the keeper and they have produced some kind of evidence which could be used in court?

There evidence is images of my vehicle, I accept this and the times, but it doesn’t prove the driver. The other evidence is a spread sheet of times, payments and vehicle registrations. Looks convincing, but could be easily be fabricated, I always put £1 in this car park, never 50p. Personally I would like to see a duplicate ticket.

C - Request further evidence: such as duplicate ticket?

D - Make them a reasonable Offer: Make a without prejudice offer to save costs of say 50p+£10 admin without admitting liability on the basis:

1, unable to ID the driver

2, due to the time that has now elapsed from the date of the incident, it is unreasonable to have expected any alleged driver to have retained the ticket. Therefore I’m unable to verify or defend their allegation

This letter would be the final one to close of the matter, and in the event it went to court I’ve made a reasonable offer.

Where should I go?

 

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A - Pay the invoice £60: Forget all about it, or will they send another speculative invoice just to spite me?

 

Not unknown for people who pay to be pestered afterwards in the hope of wringing more cash. Plus you'll probably go on their mugs board in their office!

 

 

B - Do nothing: probably the best route from day 1, but I’ve already engaged with them they know I’m the keeper and they have produced some kind of evidence which could be used in court?

 

Still is the best option. So what if you're the keeper? How on earth does that entitle them to £60?

 

There evidence is images of my vehicle, I accept this and the times, but it doesn’t prove the driver. The other evidence is a spread sheet of times, payments and vehicle registrations. Looks convincing, but could be easily be fabricated, I always put £1 in this car park, never 50p. Personally I would like to see a duplicate ticket.

 

So what? The £60 is legally unenforceable. You're losing sight of this and getting sucked into the [problem].

 

C - Request further evidence: such as duplicate ticket?

 

How would 'further evidence' suddenly entitle them to sixty quid?

 

D - Make them a reasonable Offer: Make a without prejudice offer to save costs of say 50p+£10 admin without admitting liability on the basis:

 

Since you owe them zilch, you've immediately just thrown £15 away. And you think that would stop them sending you more junkmail?

 

1, unable to ID the driver

2, due to the time that has now elapsed from the date of the incident, it is unreasonable to have expected any alleged driver to have retained the ticket. Therefore I’m unable to verify or defend their allegation

 

Again, even if you happily declared you parked for an extra hour it doesn't magically mean you owe them £60.

 

This letter would be the final one to close of the matter, and in the event it went to court I’ve made a reasonable offer.

 

Never engage with [problematic].

 

Where should I go?

 

Ignore them.

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they have and lost a few times and hammered by the JUDGES

 

google them

 

Was it once or twice?

 

Never ever seen a paid 'overstay' case in court. Only ever seen one disabled badge cases and the rest have all been parking with no permit or parking on free land every day. Overstay cases are avoided by these companies because the list of charges spells out their actual losses and immediately tells the judge they're only entitled to a quid or two.

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Never ever seen a paid 'overstay' case in court. Only ever seen one disabled badge cases and the rest have all been parking with no permit or parking on free land every day. Overstay cases are avoided by these companies because the list of charges spells out their actual losses and immediately tells the judge they're only entitled to a quid or two.

 

That's really interesting. I've never come across that bit of information on here before. Or I've not appreciated the difference between overstaying and parking without 'permission'.

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B - Do nothing: probably the best route from day 1, but I’ve already engaged with them they know I’m the keeper and they have produced some kind of evidence which could be used in court?

 

I would like to see the evidence for the amount charged. As this is supposed to be freach of contract they are only entitled to damages and those damages do not add up to anything like that, the claimed 50p shortage is all they are entitled to.

 

These companies only go to court if they think they will be undefended and can get a judgement by default. If you have a case, let them take you to court, they wont turn up if they think it is going to be defended because their claim is false.

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That's really interesting. I've never come across that bit of information on here before. Or I've not appreciated the difference between overstaying and parking without 'permission'.

 

Neither is enforceable, but if you pay a pound for an hour and stay an extra half an hour, in theory you owe 50p.

 

Cases like that are more difficult for parking companies because it's obvious they're only owed 50p from the start.

 

No permit cases are the norm, but the parking companies still lose them 99% of the time because the law is quite clear on the issue of contractual penalties.

 

The only way parking companies can win is if someone uses space on somebody's land every day, causing provable loss to the landowner.

 

The blue badge case was an odd one. The parking company lost, but they usually steer clear in case a disabled person turns up in court on the day. Bad P.R. for them.

 

I would like to see the evidence for the amount charged. As this is supposed to be freach of contract they are only entitled to damages and those damages do not add up to anything like that, the claimed 50p shortage is all they are entitled to.

 

These companies only go to court if they think they will be undefended and can get a judgement by default. If you have a case, let them take you to court, they wont turn up if they think it is going to be defended because their claim is false.

 

If I owe 50p, I'd rather wait until I receive an invoice for the correct amount! Strange how these companies never send them though...

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Neither is enforceable, but if you pay a pound for an hour and stay an extra half an hour, in theory you owe 50p.

 

Cases like that are more difficult for parking companies because it's obvious they're only owed 50p from the start.

 

No permit cases are the norm, but the parking companies still lose them 99% of the time because the law is quite clear on the issue of contractual penalties.

 

I know none of these are enforcable from the excellent information on here and I had come across the 50p argument too. I guess the penny hadn't dropped regarding the two 'types' of circumstance. I'm not making myself very clear but I guess what I'm saying is that there is even less chance of Excel having a pop at me. I know you guys always say not to worry but we do you know :D

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  • 2 months later...
  • 2 months later...

I agree. The best thing is to ignore. My family have experienced several encounters with these people in their various guises. One family member made the fatal mistake of paying up. Predictably she received another "fine" for a new offence within weeks. My mother is currently on her final, final, final, final warning of Court action. Strangely enough, the amount has gone down by £60 since her final, final, final warning. Is she worried? To be honest, yes but after every letter she gets all the reassurance she needs. I would relish our day in Court but it won't come to that because its a [problem], ignore it. Put another way, if you received a letter asking for your bank details as you'd won £5,000, would you even bother to send a reply to say "no"? Treat it with the contempt it deserves.

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