Barclaycard/Cabot/Mackenzie Hall

[Donel261]

My saga is ongoing, I received a letter out of the blue from Mackenzie Hall saying they were being instructed by Cabot to collect to the sum of £913.00. I obtained my credit file and had two defaults at my old address for this debt, one from Cabot and one from Barclaycard. I assume Barclaycard sold it on.

 

Anyway, I sent the standard letter to Mackenzie Hall, I do not awknowledge the debt, please send me the credit agreement etc and enclosed the £1 fee which was cashed 4 days later on 24th June 2006. They have never sent the details.

I complained to equifax and they contacted Barclaycard who have agreed to delete the entry as they no longer own the debt. I phoned Mackenzie Hall and spoke to the most obnoxious and retarded person possibly imaginable who said I can tell you that the debt was passed to us on XXX and you owe XXX, thats all we are legally obliged to give you, we will take legal action if you dont pay. I said I couldn't give a damn what you do or say, take the action its wholly welcomed, your clearly dont understand your job, targets to hit have we? I said I would complain to trading standards and he said do whatever you like. he said we have contacted Cabot for the information but they haven't responded to us, I said just get on with it and ended the call. I then followed that up with an immediate fax which stated there legal obligations and the fact the request was now in default, I copied it by post and fax to Cabot. I also made a complaint to the trading standards departments of Mackenzie Hall & Cabot and faxed it also.

 

I think I may have cocked up by sending my SAR request to Mackenzie Hall but they awknowledged it and cashed the fee. They also admit they have been in contact with Cabot. Do you think I stand any chance?

[Donel261]

I will thanks, Barclaycard were quite reasonable they have deleted the default entry. The debt is not statute barred, but you are right in that I never received a notice of assignment to say they had bought the debt, I also dont see what right they have defaulting me when I have no credit agreement with them. Following my conversation with Mackenzie Hall on Friday & follow up fax I have received a letter from them (without threat or bad tone) saying:

 

"Thank you for your recent communication regarding a query on the above account. Our company endeavours to deal with all enquiries within a designated timescaled, normally 48 hours. Unfortunately on this occassion we must gather more information to enable us to deal with this query efficiently. This could take up to six weeks.

 

We have placed your account on hold whilst these enquiries are underway and ask for your patience until we can gather the correct information and resolve the matter as soon as possible. In the meantime if you wish to discuss your account please call me on ...... Again we thank you for your patience.

 

Signed: Russell Collins (Accounts Manager)

 

Eejits!!

[Donel261]

I know, I thought that too, 48 hours my @rse, they are being nice to me for a reason, probably know I am not playing with them. I will complain to information commissioner, currently got a complaint with the information commissioner for an issue with Telewest, I have heard they are not very helpful so I wait in suspense for the outcome of there investigation. I have also complained to trading standards about crapbot and mackenzie hall so again, I wait..... ;-)

[Donel261]

Had a letter from East Ayrshire Trading standard, which covers the Mackenzie Hall side of things, looks like the wheels are in motion, it reads:

 

"Thank you for your recent letter concerning the above company. I have written to the company regarding the matter and will advise you of there comments in due course.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

A Stewart

Enforcement Officer"

 

I also wait for the trading standards response for Cabot... the scoundrels....

[Donel261]

Had a letter from Kent Trading standards who cover the Cabot side of things, they want me to call them on Monday but I dont really know what to say to them. There website says they do not investigate individual matters, just log complaints. I feel like they are going to fob me off.

 

Experian have also e-mailed me saying Cabot are investigating the matter and therefore the entry will remain on my credit file. I have responded questioning why they are going in Cabots favour, I complained to them because Cabot have not once ever wrote to me. They got there joeys at Mackenzie Hall to do it. I have never had a credit agreement with this company and do not awknowledge any debt to them. I have said I want the information temporarily removed until it is proved. Am I being unreasonable?

[Donel261]

Have called Kent Trading Standard and the woman was very nice, but I just knew she cant do anything. I explained everything and she said she will call them and try to get things moving on. She said "it would be better if they took you to court you could then argue it out if they cant prove it, at least it brings it to a conclusion" I said "exactly". I also received an e-mail from equifax saying we cant remove it without permission, even though I explain they are not responding or awknowledging my posts.

 

Can anyone help me, they are clearly in default of the CCA request, I want to lodge court action to get this data removed from my credit file. I want to get a mortgage next year, I just dont know how to go about it or what to write on the court claim form...... (mods or anyone with legal knowledge, do I have a leg to stand on, if so I am prepared to test it out) Mackenzie Hall and more inmportantly CABOT are ****!

 

This has been going on for months now with no sign of them providing the documents or awknowledging the fact that they cant prove it. :-|

[Donel261]

Two more updates: (1) Equifax & (2) The Legendry Cabot:

 

(1) Equifax

 

Dear Donel261,

 

Thank you for your recent correspondence, details of which have been

passed to me for investigation and resolution.

 

I acknowledge your request for sight of the original agreement between

Kings Hill and yourself and must advise Kings Hill are a debt collection

agency and I can confirm this debt was passed from Barclaycard therefore,

your original agreement lies with them.

 

I have had regard to your comments regarding your Equifax Credit File and would

like to advise although the credit agreements are held by the credit

reference agencies, the owner of the information continues to be the

financial institution, and not the credit reference agency. The credit

reference agencies are unable to amend or delete information, unless

they have been advised to do so directly from the data owner.

 

Therefore, with regards to the Kings Hill entry which is currently

appearing at the address of xxxxxxxold addressxxxxxx, a Notice of Dispute

was raised on 21st August, whereby we requested Kings Hill to investigate

and confirm the accuracy of the information provided to Equifax.

 

On the 30th August, Kings Hill responded and advised they are

currently investigating this matter. In view of the further

investigation which was required, Kings Hill did not at this time,

request Equifax to amend or delete this account from your Credit File. To

date we have not received a subsequent response from Kings Hill regarding

your dispute.

 

In view of this, we have today raised a second Notice of Dispute

regarding this account, whereby we have advised Kings Hill of your

concerns.

 

Although the Notice of Dispute process can take up to 28 days, I will

endeavour to maintain regular contact with Kings Hill in order to

expedite a response.

 

Should your require further assistance with this matter please contact me

on the telephone number provided below.

 

Kind Regards

 

Angela Sludds

Escalation Advisor

 

and

 

(2) Cabot (First correspondence from them EVER!!!!)

 

Dear Donel261

 

We refer to your letter dated 13th September 2006

 

We would like to point out that we responded to you on 25th August 2006 explaining that we contacted barclaycard to investigate your query, and had requested copy of the application form and statements on the account.

 

Unfortunately at that stage we were not aware of your current allocation at a different address (plebs!! ) we apologise for this and have now updated your records accordingly.

 

We would also like to tell you that as we are not the originators of the account it can take up to 8 weeks if the information we require from barclaycard has been archived and therefore we request you show some understanding in this matter. (Bloody cheek, 8 weeks? remind me when I sent my CCA request)

 

In the meantme we would really greatly appreciate if you could forward a copy of your driving licence, passport toegther with a signed letter, also utility bills to show where you were living at the time the account was taken out. (dont have the bills but no bloody chance am I sending them anything, for all I know they could be stealing my identity)

 

I would reassure you these are normal procedures when a customer disputes ownership of an account. Once again we would apologise for your confusion and any upset caused. We look forward to hearing from you in due course.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

Emma Robertson

 

***************************************************

 

Am i requesting everything I should, what about a notice of assignment, the original credit agreement, statements??? I am going to write to them basically saying "do one" on the proof of identity.... should I say anything else?

 

Gosh this one is really dragging out, but in for a pound and all that......

[Donel261]

Responded With:

 

Dear Madam,

 

Thank you for your correspondence of the 14th September 2006.

 

I am somewhat confused as to how you can allege you were not aware of my current address given I have written confirmation contradicting that statement from 'Mackenzie Hall' who state you were notified in July 2006 when my original CCA request was submitted.

 

I also note that your "normal procedures" do not correlate with a legal right to shun your duties under the legislation irrespective of whether you are the original creditor or not.

 

I have previously told you on numerous occasions that I have no credit agreement or account with your company and have never received any correspondence from you until your letter of 14th September 2006. I do not acknowledge ANY debt to "Cabot Financial" and will never pay you any money.

 

On the 24th June 2006 I requested specific documents, which you are obliged to supply whether or not you are the original creditor under S.189 of the CCA 1974. Non-compliance is a criminal offence under the above Act, I have therefore lodged complaints with the relevant authorities, I will furthermore be raising this matter further when we go to court, as I fully intend to vigorously defend and contest this matter. You will furthermore know that as you are in breach of my original CCA request the debt is totally unenforceable. Even if you could now supply the documents I requested over three months ago, you would have to obtain a court order yourself in order to try and enforce it. I am sure the judge will not be best pleased when your breach becomes apparent.

 

Furthermore, as you are aware, a credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the CCA and therefore is a complete defence to any court claim that is issued.

 

1. You have failed to provide me with a true copy of the alleged agreement you refer to. Which is my right under S.78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (S.77 (1) for fixed sum credit) - you have also failed to supply a statement of account.

 

2. You have failed to provide a signed true copy of the deed of assignment relating to this alleged debt.

 

3. You have failed to provide me with a signed true copy of any default notice issued in relation to the referenced agreement you allege exists.

 

Please note that I still await all of these documents, or alternatively I respectfully ask that you close the account you refer to, remove any reference to it from my credit report (or I WILL seek a court order to have this done) and refrain from contacting or harassing me further.

 

I also refuse your request to provide; (Quote) "a copy of your driving license or passport together with a signed letter, also utility bills to show where you were living at the time the alleged account was taken out." You have so far failed to substantiate any alleged debt and are in clear breach of your statutory duties under the act to do so. I can therefore only assume that you are attempting to demand money from me by deception, a matter that I will be asking the police to investigate. You have not proved to me that you have any legal right to demand money from me (i.e. deed of assignment), let alone request documents from me, which could allow you to steal my identity, I will be asking the police to investigate this also. Would you send these documents to a shoddy company likes yours? I don’t think so!

 

I again ask that you provide clear confirmation as to when you are likely to obtain the requested documents from the "originators" you refer to in order to substantiate this debt. Alternatively confirm that this matter has been closed and the relevant references deleted from my credit reference file. Failure to supply these documents within 14 days of this letter will prompt me to instruct my solicitor to initiate county court proceedings compelling you to do so. You have had long enough. You will also note that should I need to take this action, you will be liable for my costs given you are the party in breach of your statutory duties under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, you have no defence on this matter!! I will furthermore lodge an application for damages regarding the stress caused by the defamatory data placed on my credit reference file.

 

I look forward to hearing from YOU for a change.

 

Yours Faithfully

[Donel261]

I think it is probably going to come to that, Cabot are stubborn buggers!!

[Donel261]

Well, a development from the Mackenzie Hall side:

 

Letter reads as follows:

 

Dear Donel261,

 

Thank you for your recent communication regearding a query on the above account.

 

Due to the nature of your dispute, Mackenzie Hall, after discussions with Cabot Financial, have made a decision to return the account back to Cabot Financial, who will continue to deal with and communicate with you on this account.

 

If you have any further queries regarding this please contact Cabot Financial on 0845 0700 116 quoting your reference.

 

Yours....

 

Russell Collins

Accounts Manager

 

Looks like they have had enough of me and can't be r'sd anymore, perhaps I should now rename this thread Barclaycard/Cabot...... 2 down anyway, barclaycard have deleted entries from credit report, mackenzie hall have backed off so just cabot to kill off now.... wish me luck!!

[Donel261]

I know its really petty, but I am having a silly moment and want to make them work a bit longer.....

 

Russell Collins

Accounts Manager

Mackenzie Hall

30 The Foregate

Kilmarnock

KA1 1JH

 

Reference: XXXXX

 

25th September 2006

 

Dear Mr Collins,

 

Thank you for your correspondence dated 19th September 2006, the contents of which have been noted.

 

As you will be aware, you have failed to provide the documents I requested under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and have now returned the debt to cabot Financial.

 

I therefore seek an IMMEDIATE REFUND of the CCA statutory fee totalling £1.00, which you happily cashed without being able to honour my request.

 

I expect to receive a cheque or postal order within the next 7 calendar days.

 

Please note that each letter thereafter in respect of your failure to pay will be charged at £30.00.

 

I will furthermore happily initiate county court proceedings against you for non-payment including an application for my costs under the small claims track.

Yours Sincerely

Donel261

[Donel261]

Oh these people, not feeling the best and now CABOT are playing stupid again:

 

They have still not provided the documents or honoured my CCA request, yet Cabot write:

 

Dear Donel261,

 

The account you held with Barclaycard was purchased by Cabot Financial and currently has an outstanding balance of £883.64. Please contact without delay to discuss repayment of this debt.

 

We at cabot understand how easy it is to fall behind on month payments with credit cards loans and the other credit available in the market today.

 

We want to WORK WITH YOU to enable you to clear this deby in a manner which suits your individual circumstances. We will help you calculate your income and outgoings so that you are able to pay off this deb without unnescasary hardship. We offer easy payment options blah blah blah... we want to listen call us.......

 

Anyway, now for the back, which is a bit more interesting, are they being sly with the wording??? Are they trying to get around the CCA request by issuing this letter, can this be classed as a deed of assignment, they have already lodged a default on my credit file 2 years ago. They refer to the terms of the credit agreement but have never provided it. What should I do? I would love to hit them with court action. Any suggestions on a way forward?

 

(1) Kings Hill is the legal owner of he account referenced overleaf.

(2) Kings Hill is part of Cabot Financial Ltd.

 

(3) THIS LETTER ACTS AS YOUR NOTICE OF ASSIGNMENT OF YOUR ACCOUNT TO KINGS HILL LIMITED AND SHOULD BE KEPT?????????????

 

(4) As the groups servicing company Cabot are entitled to receive payment of the full amount outstanding n behalf of Kings Hill.

 

(5) INTEREST IS ACCRUING IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE TERMS OF THE ORIGINAL CREDIT AGREEMENT.

 

(6) You may want to take legal advice and should do so as a priority.

(7) All correspondence should be sent to Cabot....

(8 Cheques should be made payable to......

(9) We accept visa mastercard.....

 

(10) INFORMATION ON THIS DEBT WILL BE PASSED TO CREDIT REFERENCE AGENCIES!!!!!!

 

(11) This communication is an attempt to collect the debt and any information obtained in this correspondence will be used for that purposed.

 

:mad: :mad:

[Donel261]

Another lette from CABOT today:

 

Dear Donel261,

 

As you are aware we do not receive consumer credit agreements at the point of sale. We have contacted Barclaycard again today regarding the requested information, which has been duly chased.

 

Unfortunatly you have no legal right to a copy of the deed of assisgnment document itself, you have been notified of our ownership by our notice of assignment; this is our "hello" letter. A copy of which has been sent under seperate cover for your attention. (the letter above!)

 

We would like to add that we have acted properly at all times; we are doing everything in our power to obtain a copy of the agreement and statements on the above account.

 

I can confirm that once we are in receipt of the requested documents this will be forwarded to you.

 

We hope this clears the questions raised in your letter of 19th September 2006

 

Yours Sincerley

 

Emma Robertson

 

[Donel261]

Letter received from Mackenzie Hall:

 

" Please find encosed a cheque for the sum of £1.00 in refund of the statutory CCA fee. Please note that Mackenzie Hall are no longer dealing with this account, you must therefore direct any further enquiries to Cabot Financial."

[Donel261]

Had a call today from Kent Council's Trading Standards Department. She said Cabot have e-mailed her and said they are waiting for the documents from Barclaycard. She then said, but I have some bad news!! I have spoken with our credit expert and he has said that because Cabot are trying to get the documents they are doing nothing wrong and that can go on indefinatly!! she also said if they get the documents they can then start claiming the money again so you will have to pay. she said I am shocked that this situation can go on have you tried writing to Experian and lodging a notice of dispute???? yes, and Cabot told them the information was correct so they removed it!! She said "oh", perhaps you should let them have a bit longer and then write to them again and keep on top of things....

 

She basically said there is nothing they can do. :(

[Donel261]

Thanks guys,

 

Still a stain on my credit file though (anoth 3 years), its seriously affecting my abillity to get a decent mortgage as I have had a far from perfect past with. Do you think I should negotiate with them to pay perhaps half on the basis that they mark it satisfied in full and remove the default entry? or perhaps leave them more time to try and get the documents.... :-|

[Donel261]

A very interesting update from the scoundrels at Cabot.

 

I had a letter in the post today which included a photocopy of my original barclaycard application form, I therefore accept the money owed to Barclaycard, I guess if it has been sold on I owe Cabot aswell

 

Anyway, I am thinking of making a full and final settlement on the understanding that they remove the default. Perhaps for around £400 which is about half of what is owed. My barclaycard limit was only £500 the rest has been interest and bits added on by Cabot. Anyway, do you think this is enough or too much to offer. I am going to state this is a one off offer being made because of the generosity of my parents and will not be increased. Should they choose not accept it then I will enclose an income & expenditure form and make payments of £2.50 per month until the debt is cleared....... do you think they will go for it? am I approaching this right?

 

I would pay the full amount if it meant removing the default from my credit file but if they have paid peanuts for the debt why the hell should they get it.

[Donel261]

Nothing to suggest Cabot have added money, just me assuming they would. No, now going to send them a letter agreeing to pay about £400 in full and final settlement and ask that the default be removed, this will clearly be awknowleding the account so is this the right thing to do? Also, do you think they will remove the default? if not, I am not paying them £400.

[Donel261]

No statement of account, they said they dont have to issue a deed of assignment, I have no right to that document, they sent me a letter saying we are now collecting this debt and this letter is our introduction to you and acts as a deed of assignment.

[Donel261]

Provided all the details (eventually), now trying to negotiate a reduced settlement as cant afford to pay full amount. Refused twice even though I have told them 50% of what they claim is as a result of charges.

[Donel261]

right, I am now in a position to start arguing with these buggers again. Am going to try them on the full and final settlement again, knowing "our underwriting department" will refuse the offer again.

 

In relation to the charges to the account, I am a little confused to say the least how do I deal with them. I have a statememt of account and around 50% are charges but how do I get them knocked off the debt? its not like I can write and ask for the money back, it is a debt.

 

Any advice you could offer is greatly appreciated.

[Donel261]

Thanks Nailpost,

 

I have all the gubbins from Barclaycard, (1) Copy of signed agreement, (2) Statement of account and (3) the notice of assignment to Cabot. I just dont know what to do with the information as it is not money I am owed or can reclaim, it is money they have added to a debt and then sold on to Cabot. I am trying to argue with Cabot that I do not owe the full amount, I have made them an offer in final settlement and they should accept it because of that.

 

You know what they are like though, you cant reason with them

[Donel261]

No they are penalty fees, it is a very old debt and they come to about £400. I ignored the payments for ages and accrued penalty charges every month which just mounted as nothing was being paid, they then defaulted me and sold the debt on with its current balance including all the penalty charges. (if that makes sense... confusing myself now, lol) I therefore offered them £400 in final settlement as that is the money I actually owed them.... prior to all the charges.

 

Will pull out my paperwork....

[Donel261]

Hi Rhia, they have provided a copy of the application form, which is the only document I would have signed, I thought that was the credit agreement.

 

Will look up the other threads, thanks!

[Donel261]

No its not signed either, I just want to get these bloody fools off my back once and for all. They are screwing my credit report big style with the default! aggghhhhh