Pub wouldn't serve me and kicked me out despite me providing valid ID

[Tom87]

I was in a pub the other day. I asked for a pint, and knowing I look younger than I am, I had my driving licence ready to show the barwoman, and she duely asked for it. After 'examining' it for about 15 seconds and continuously looking from me to the licence and the photo/DOB on it, she tutted and said "that's not you mate, you'd better get out before we call the police."

 

I have had this particular photo licence for the last three years and have never ever had a problem before with anyone identifying me from it. I calmly denied her allegation and asked to see the manager. She went and got the manager (her father) and he also looked at my licence and agreed with his employee that that was not me on the licence and I was trying to use fake ID and purchase alcohol underage.

 

I got cross at this point and explained frustratedly to the manager that there was nothing fake about my driving licence, and it is perfectly obvious from the photo that it is me. Then I remembered that by chance I had my passport in my pocket as I had recently returned from a weekend abroad. I produced my passport and the manager said although he agreed the passport was genuine and had the same DOB, name etc., because I had tried to "fob them off with a fake driving licence", they would eject me from the premises.

 

Before I could reply, the manager had beckoned two bouncers and they physically dragged me out of the busy pub, in full view of all the other customers. When I tried to resist, one of the bouncers kicked me on the back of the shin to make me bend on my knees then they continued to drag me. When I was on the street the same bouncer made a point of pushing me to the ground rather than just leaving me there.

 

I went straight to the police station and reported the incident. They said they could probably charge the bouncer with assault but weren't sure they could do much about the bar staff if they genuinely thought it was fake ID (even though it isn't).

 

To top it off, the staff even had the nerve to produce a photo of me taken from their CCTV and stick it up on the outside window of their pub saying I am barred from the pub. This is very humiliating and completely unfair. I would love to see the manager and barwoman fired, their premises closed down and them sent to rot in jail along with the bouncer though obviously things will never go that far in reality.

 

My question is, is there anything I can do about the manager and barwoman for (in my mind) perfectly consciously (i) refusing to serve me even though I had ID and there was no reason to throw me out i.e. I was not behaving badly etc., (ii) embarrassing me and tarnishing my reputation by putting up this poster; and (iii) this is possibly "race"-related as the pub is in Wales and I am English, I have since learned that the manager and his family are well-known around the area for having known anti-English feelings (although it has never gone this far) and I suspect he and his daughter saw on my driving licence that I'm from England and decided to make my life difficult because of that, I really cannot see any other reason.

Edited May 12, 2009 by Tom87

[Tom87]

Not wishing to be unhelpful but reading between the lines..

 

you were asked to leave , you continued arguing , you were forcibly ejected.

 

I appreciate your viewpoint but can't you understand the reason why I "continued arguing"? So if you were asked to leave for a completely invented claim of fake ID for a reason, you would just do so and not challenge it?

 

I am aware that any pub/restaurant/shop is allowed to refuse to serve and/or ask a customer to leave the premises. BUT doesn't there have to be a decent reason? Surely a supermarket etc. can't just refuse to serve you because "they don't feel like it"? Or can they?

 

The staff at this pub (which is an independent pub, not a chain unfortunately) knew full well that there was absolutely nothing wrong with my ID, they just consciously fabricated a reason for kicking me out. I have since discussed my experience with several prominent local figures who are familiar with, and have informed me of, the landlord and his family's beliefs, and I am 99% sure my crime was being an Englishman in Wales. I love Wales and it is such a shame a small minority of prehistoric thugs like these put such a stain on this wonderful country and its rightfully proud people.

 

The force the bouncer used was not reasonable, and I have just learnt he has been charged with assault. I am slim, 5 ft 8, in my early 20s. They were both well-built men, in their 30s or 40s, well over 6 ft, and they were pulling me out without difficulty, my resisting made no difference.

 

Thank you for the advice about the picture, I shall follow it up. For as long as I see my picture in the window I will spread the word verbally that this is a pub run by racist bigots who employ violent thugs to deal with any dissent. I have already got an article in the free local paper so look forward to that going on thousands of doormats later this week.

 

If they had a valid reason for ejecting me, fair enough. But to deliberately fabricate a makebelieve reason (and in doing so accusing the DVLA of issuing me with a fake licence) is a step too far and I will push for the severest punishment for all involved.

[Tom87]

Well I can't wait for the day I no longer get ID'd. I have looked young long enough, it is annoying and patronising.

[Tom87]

Yes - I'd leave and not challenge it. You learn this with age.

 

Well if that's the case, and if I may be frank for a minute, I'm not sure why you're a member of the CAG. The CAG actively encourages people to exercise their rights and not to "put up and shut up" after being mistreated. I apologise for my bluntness but I can't understand how you can have this opinion yet be a regular member of this group whose aim is to give more voice to consumers and to stand up against companies which tread all over us.

[Tom87]

Don't worry, I'm not going to go in that one again! Especially not with a 'wanted' picture of me on their window!

[Tom87]

My sincere thanks to all those who understand!

 

I for one am in the CAG because I also will stick up for myself whenever I am treated wrongly by an individual, business or company. I reckon any doubters would quickly change their "put up and shut up" opinion if they were treated in this way and then publicly slandered.

[Tom87]

I was going to do a long reply but Bookworm graciously had all of it covered and I echo those comments completely.

 

One last thing: I did provide proof of age to their satisfaction - they knew it was genuine, they just deliberately pretended it wasn't so as to provide themselves with a fabricated excuse for throwing me out.

 

As to a pub 'not being respectable if it needs to employ bouncers' (or something along those lines, as mentioned a few posts ago), this is unavoidable in many student towns because the vast majority of pubs in these towns have bouncers as a matter of formality, even those in the majority that have no reputation of 'trouble' whatsoever.

[Tom87]

What I cannot comprehend, is that how - with a passport and d/l bearing the same details that a conclusion is reached that one of them was 'dodgy' for some unspecified reason.

 

By inventing the allegation that my ID was fake, they had already decided they did not want to serve me. They knew both IDs were perfectly genuine but yes I should have realised by then that it was all an act and I would not be served.

 

Whilst I agree the use of photos etc in a 'rogues gallery' is distasteful, if the OP left when requested, this would not be an issue. Life IS unfair, but there's no point being a professional 'victim'. As I pointed out, all the can be usefully done won;t right the wrong

 

All this completely goes against what the CAG is here for: to protect consumers against unfair practice and treatment by businesses and to encourage them to stand up and exercise their rights rather than giving in and letting the businesses walk all over them. What you wrote just there is a complete contradiction and embarrassment to the CAG and its cause to be honest. It's just as bad as those PPC people who trawl the parking tickets section telling users to stop moaning and just pay up.

 

and, frankly, wanting to drink in an establishment managed by a bunch of misfits (allegedly) continues to defy belief.

 

I don't want to drink there. I am not Mystig Meg, how am I supposed to know before entering the pub what the owners/bouncers will be like?

[Tom87]

For my stress levels and sanity, I will only ever fight the battles that I'm pretty sure I will win or where winning will acheive something.

 

Once again, that's not what this group is for. It exists to challenge unfair and unacceptable treatment of consumers, not to lie down and let them win. Just look on the parking offences thread, how many people are led to believe by those tickets that they should give up and pay up when they should not have to, that is an example where the CAG really excells and encourages us to take a stand against these rogue companies and businesses. In my opinion the same stance should be taken here, not just to advise users to stop moaning and walk away.

 

If a train conductor forcibly pushed you off the train despite you showing him a valid ticket, would you just accept it?