MBNA...make them an offer?

[TETSUO]

Hi Guys!

I have £10,000 on credit cards with MNBA and Virgin, and pay about £300 a month interest on these alone.

I'm always getting charges, am always over my limit and have had enough!

I am now in a position (due to coming i nto a bit of money) to pay them both off, however, I was wanderign whether any has ever negotiated a reduced sum to clear the debt entirely

I was thinking of offering them £8000 to clear the debt...

Any advise???

:o) Cheers

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello Thomper!

 

MBNA are probably the least most pleasant bunch to deal with, so I really can't see them agreeing to any sort of Pay-Off Agreement while you are still busy Paying them.

 

I would say you should firstly take stock of the situation. Enter every single Transaction into, say, Microsoft Money, or a Spreadsheet.

 

Your Spending if Private is effectively irrelevent for this, so just enter every "Purchase" as just that.

 

Then enter every single one of their Entries, but Categorise them carefully, i.e.

 

01/01/2000 Unlawful Overlimit Charge £20.00

04/01/2000 Unlawful Late Charge £20.00

10/01/2000 Interest 1.3852% £123.98

16/01/2000 My Payment to them £250.00

 

I bet after a while the Interest Charges will change, look at the Rates on your Statements carefully, so enter them to show the New Rate:

 

10/03/2002 Interest 1.4566% £198.25

 

And another jump...

 

10/06/2006 Interest 1.8735% £236.65

 

After getting all the figures in, you may start to see a little pattern.

 

Now try to show when your Credit Limit was changed, and again, you may see another little piece of your Debt Jigsaw Puzzle falling neatly into place.

 

When all in, add up what you have EVER spent.

 

Now add up what you have Paid them back.

 

Now read my post here to see what to do with these Big Numbers!

 

OK, back again, let's continue...

 

Now you should have a handle on where that Debt has come from, so if you still feel like Paying them back 8k, no problem. If, OTOH, you are now feeling just a little bit sick and annoyed, and feel the Debt you thought you owed is much greater than you now feel it ever should've been, then you can tackle this with that firmly in mind.

 

Keep Paying them, but spend £1 and submit a s78 Request, (or £1 for each Card if you have two).

 

If you are mising any Statements, then spend £10 and send them an SAR.

 

Now sit back and wait to see what they come up with in terms of Agreements.

 

If they fail to respond, or produce something that is not Enforceable, then you are starting to get the upper hand, and closer to the point when you can get them to negotiate.

 

Given that you want to Pay them off at a Price that is fair, bearing in mind you now probably know that they have made a tidy sum from you, and have been able to re-loan any Payments you made to other people, you can start to put pressure on them.

 

If no Enforceable Agreement after the 12+2 Working Days, then stop Paying them, and say why (i.e. No Agreement). They will probably switch on the Threats-R-Us machine, so you'll get lots and lots of Calls, and lots and lots of silly Letters saying the World is going to fall out of your Bottom.

 

Steady, steady, don't do anything yet.

 

Let them keep this up for a while, and eventually one or more of the Letters may start to say something along the lines of: "we have a special offer to make, to help you". It could be a con, but they won't really be expecting you to say, here, how about I Pay you £x to wrap this up and close down the Account?

 

Or, let them keep going, and they may well Sell to a DCA, who will hassle you, and then will take a lower Offer, as they will have Paid maybe 20%-25% if that for the Debt.

 

It's up to you.

 

Do also remember that they cannot really lose at this stage, as whatever happens, they will write off the Debt against Tax if no Payment at all, or they'll write off the discount made to reach your Full and Final Settlement...or they'll Sell to a DCA get Paid 20%-25% and write off the rest against Tax.

 

Even if they Baloon the end Total by ramping your Rates at the end (usually to 2.5292% or 35% annual), you still Pay what you want, and they will be even happier, as they'll have maybe an extra +20% paper debt added at the end to increase the Tax write off without actually having spent that last +20%.

 

You could also try to see if they will go for it now, and you may be very surprised. But I would think MBNA will do squat until you make some moves to force the issue via your Statutory Right to see the Agreement.

 

Morals never came into it when they were manipulating Interest Rates behind the scenes (as I suspect will be the case), so keep that firmly in mind when working towards what you feel is a fair settlement figure.

 

I hope this helps.

 

Cheers,

BRW

Edited June 14, 2008 by banker_rhymes_with
Can't spell, still can't Type!

[steven4064]

Hi Thomper

 

I agree wholeheartedly with BRW that you should do this:

Keep Paying them, but spend £1 and submit a s78 Request, (or £1 for each Card if you have two).

 

If you are mising any Statements, then spend £10 and send them an SAR.

 

After this there is a slighly different scheme that you might consider.

1) Firstly, and whatever else you do, reclaim all of the unlawful charges and the interest they have levied on the charges and interest in restitution (see my interest tutorial).

 

Next make them an offer to settle. THere are two options here:

 

2) if they have produced a copy of an enforceable agreement - make them a full and final offer based on the balance left after 1, say 75%. If they refuse, you will have to keep paying them but the amount should be significantly reduced/

 

3) if they fail to produces a coy of an enforceable agreeement, off them 25% of the outstanding balance after 1. That is all they would get from a DCA if they sold it. If they refuse your offer, then stop paying them and follow BRW's scheme.

[TETSUO]

I spoke to them today (after another letter) and they have said they would be willing to negotiate a settlement with me when I have the money in my hand. They wanted to know how much I was getting and where I was getting it from. I wouldn't tell them any of it, just like I won't give them my telephone number.

 

I have already claimed back charges from them at the begning of last year, and am not sure I want to go through that whole process again.

 

I let them know today that I know my rights and that I will go down this route if they refuse to negotiate.

 

The woman on the phone did say that they would run a credit check against me before they did this.... I wonder why this is??

 

I may well apply for a copy of the agreement, as I was being charged for insurance on my Virgin card for a number of months and I don't believe I ever requested it.

 

So, I think I will go down that route...

 

Will keep you informed!

 

cheers

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello Thomper!

 

The woman on the phone did say that they would run a credit check against me before they did this.... I wonder why this is??

 

They just want to have a nose around to see if they can see where the Money has come from, probably. Say, a Mortgage or something like that.

 

I don't want or need to know, so no need to say anything!

 

Either way, them looking at your Debt File won't benefit you. They may also be looking to see what else you have Paid off, to work out how much money you are splashing around!

 

They will be looking to see if any other Accounts have been recently Settled. Or, if they can't see any such activity now, they will note any Balances as of Today and, as you talk to them to discuss your Settlement figure to clear, they will pop back to keep checking your Debt File to see if any other Accounts get Paid Off in the interim.

 

By now, they will know the Balances on any other Card or Loan Accounts, so are already trying to get a feel for how much you can Pay.

 

Their expectations will rise if they spot anything of interest.

 

I'd start to keep things in Writing from now on, and forget the Telephone exists as far as MBNA are concerned. You risk being caught out by them if you use the Telephone. The moment they can find a way around something, or exploit something for their advantage, anything said on the Telephone will be, er, conveeeeeeniently forgotten, or otherwise used against you!

 

Indeed, perhaps consider going quiet on them for a little while, i.e. let them get over the shock of someone offering them money! I doubt they will forget that, as an obsession with Payments of any size is a big thing at Chester Towers.

 

Indeed, now you have whet their appetite, they may even start Calling you if they are very keen to pressurise you into making a nice big Payment.

 

Send them a s78 CCA Request and a £1 Postal Order to go with it to see what sort of Agreement they have (or two). Then maybe also send them a S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and £10 to make sure you get everything you need to make an informed decision.

 

Then work out the best plan following whatever combination of Steven's and my advice fits the details you get back from CCA Request and S.A.R - (Subject Access Request).

 

Cheers,

BRW

[TETSUO]

I will send the CCA letter. They can snoop all they like into my credit files. Anything they see will show that I have more going out of my account each month then I have coming in.

 

The money I am getting is untracable through any of my accounts, and is not through any other form of credit, so their attempts to trip me up will bare no fruit.

 

By paying them as I do now (£150 on each card) am I making a rod for my own back? Should I drastically reduce my payments to them and get them worried?

 

It seems that whilst I am paying as I do, they will probbaly be quite happy to let me carry on. I probbaly made a mistake telling them I am coming into some money....hmm....

 

I am happy with all the CCA and SAR stuff, but ammore concerned with how I play the settlement game. At the end of the day, I want them to think that getting a few grand out of me on each card is better than nothing at all....

[TETSUO]

I haven't used the templates in a little while and I'll be buggered if I can find the CCA template... Can anyone help ?

 

thanks

[steven4064]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/letter-templates/

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello Steven!

 

I always have the same problem, I think the Link below is the direct Link, although yours gets him there in two hops.

 

I can never find the Letter N Template very easily, may be worth re-doing the main Template Links perhaps, i.e. to make the CCA Letter stand out a bit?

 

This should get you straight there Thomper...Here! You need Letter N funnily enough!

 

Cheers,

BRW

[steven4064]

For some reason the CCA letters ared not with the other debt letters. I put that link in so that at least you can find one from the other

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello Steven!

 

I always have trouble finding Letter N...until I saved the URL!

 

But it perhaps needs to be made a little easier to find?

 

Cheers,

BRW

[TETSUO]

I used to be able to find my way around this site really easily, but I can't seem to find anything now

 

Thanks for the links guys! Much Appreciated.

 

I have been trying to find threads along the same lines as my predicament, but without success....hey-didly-hoo!

 

Thanks again!