Firstly, I'd like to apologise for not updating info as promised, my mother has recently been diagnosed with alzheimers and had a rapid decline at the same time, so my life has been consumed with her and her difficulties. I went into the bank with my daughters bf, and got him to enquire about why a dca had been brought in when the account hadn't yet been closed and he'd offered to make payments directly to the bank. The manager we spoke to said the repayment offer wasn't acceptable, although once I pointed out that the OFT says that creditors cannot refuse a debtors offer of repayment, the offer suddenly became acceptable ( I think showing the dca letter offering of 55% reduction of a debt the bank still own might also have had something to do with it!). So he is now paying the bank direct. Thanks for the advice and info given. Gem

No idea about limits at the post office, nor indeed, how he took it out as he isn't here. I know I took £600 out of PO last week when I got mums pension for her, but that's a different type of account. Gem

I'll get as much from him as I can/he has, dx, and get it scanned for your perusal. It is difficult dealing 2nd hand with this, to be honest, it's not made any easier by the language barrier! I've been trying to explain to him, he thinks I'm trying to find a way out of him paying, which isn't what he wants! I think I have managed to explain I just want him to only pay what he should, and to the right people, lest the 45% Freds aren't asking for atm come back and bite him on the rear with another DCAs teeth in a years time! Gem

I see, thanks for that. Will get onto the SAR and come back when he has a response from RBS. Thanks for the advice so far Gem

I asked him the same question, to which he replied "the bank said they will only accept full payment" so he thought he HAD to deal with them...until I told him otherwise. The discount letter was the reason I posted, I've read so often that these are usually sent when the debt is questionable. I know he owes them money but that just set warning bells ringing in my head.

Thanks for all the replies. I've told him to go into his bank on Monday and cancel the DD (I only found out about this today, so couldn't advise him to not deal with DCA before). Not sure about who owns the debt at the moment, I believe it's the bank still, as they sent the original letter saying they had passed his detials onto AIC, and then sent the other stating passed on to Freds...not sold on. It is definitely a discount letter (he'll be paying back 55%) Bazza...yes, he had a payment sent to him from abroad, he'd withdrawn a large amount a few days before, and when he checked his balance and saw that amount, it seems he assumed he'd been sent more than he originally thought. Yes, maybe you or I would have thought about checking a bank statement rather than just the balance, but he didn't, he assumed the payment he was sent by his family was larger than he'd expected. It was a genuine mistake by him after a genuine mistake by the bank. ...so yes imo it's their fault and they should have allowed him time to repay them, but they wouldn't enter into a repayment agreement, passing his details on pretty much as soon as he told them he couldn't repay it in one installment. No-one is saying he shouldn't pay it back, he is more than willing to, at an affordable rate, he doesn't know about DCAs in this country, so made the arrangement with Freds out of ignorance (there are plenty of English people making the same mistake as that daily!) He has never, (and neither did I) made any reference to it being "a gift from the bank" . So SAR the bank, okay, will get onto that. What are we looking for on his credit file though? It's not a credit agreement..... Gem

Hi everyone, I'm looking for a bit of help if possible for my daughter's bf. English isn't his first language, so I'm attempting to help him out. He had £3000 in his bank account two years ago, he banks with RBS. He took out the money through the post office. It turns out the bank had made a mistake and the money wasn't his. He had no overdraft facility arranged either. The bank wouldn't accept a payment arrangement and, according to their letter they 'passed account details to AIC' He didn't reply to any corespondance from AIC and now his account details have been passed on to Fredriksons. He has made a repayment plan with Fredriksons, to begin at the end of this month, for £16/per month, however, as this is a direct debit, I'm sure it won't be long until they change the amount, and I advised him to go to his new bank on Monday to cancel it. Now, obviously, we can't ask for a CCA as there won't be one, and I've seen on the forums that these discounted offers (which this is from Fredriksons) mean the debt is on dodgy ground. The debt is in fact RBS' fault surely, as they allowed the post office to pay out money that shouldn't have been in his account in the first place, although he is willing to pay it as he doesn't want people banging on his door or a trip to court. I'd just appreciate any advice on what steps to take. Thanks Gem.

Thank-you outlawla, that is extremely useful to know. I paid the arrears I had before this years bill cam through, but my neighbour can use this definitely. Gem.

I had a similar problem last year, the number to input on the council's website to make payments, is exactly the same year-on-year. When this is put in, there are two balances that come up; this years balance and any arrears. Any payments made automatically reduce the 'this years bill' total and only reduce the arrears total if this years is at zero, regardless of separate payments made or not. I tried for months to get payments alloted to my arrears and not my current bill, without luck and had to resign myself to keeping windows shut during the summer, untill I cleared the bill and all subsequent payments went off the arrears. The prosecution threat, is only in regards to not providing financial info, not for non-payment, but I know what you mean about commital proceedings being a rare occurence.

Thanks for both replies. Joseph, my thoughts were, that as the regulations make no mention of the billing authorities agents, then the request would have to come from said billing authority and not an agent? If the bailiffs could request this information under the regulations, surely the regulations should state that? She cannot be breaking those regulations if the LA haven't requested her details? The accompanying letter makes no mention of it being a request from the LA. I also thought no-one had a legal obligation to deal with bailiffs whatsoever on these matters? That all they can do is eventually refer it back to the council? If they can cite the regulations and it then be a criminal offence not to give them the info, the wrong advice is being given when telling people not to deal with bailiffs. (The form is a crudely put together offer of arrangement form, with a note along the bottom declaring if the debt isn't paid in full, the charges as listed overleaf may apply, with said charges listed on the reverse, nothing like the actual forms our council uses.) Sorry, just a little confused. My neighbour is writing to the council outlining the extra payments she is making weekly, stating that these are off the arrears but the system has been taking them off this years bill, that she is most definitely not refusing to pay, and that she is willing to send THEM a copy of income/expenditure if they request one in writing. Gem.

Hi all my neighbour has received the following this morning, from a bailiff company. Notice of Required Financial Information. As you have failed to make payment arrangements on this account I am formally serving upon you a request to complete the enclosed financial information document. This request is made under regulation36 of the council tax administration and enforcement regulations 1992 statutary instrument 1992/613. You must complete and return the form within 14days of the date of this letter. If you do not comply with this request, please take note of the INTENTION to PROSECUTE under regulation 56 of the above regulations because failure to comply with this request is an offence which on conviction carries a FINE OF UP TO £1000 and a criminal conviction. If you fail to contact US to deal with this matter before the above date the local authority reserves the right to present this correspondence to the magistrate as evidence of your continued failure to pay your council tax. Now, she has said she has checked, and she she does owe the amount they state, that isn't in disagreement. She has ignored all correspondence from the bailiffs to date. She spoke to the council and put it in writing that she is paying them through their online payment system, although they haven't acknowledged this, as to do so would be agreeing it's a payment arrangement. Her payments for this years council tax are around £25 per week, she is paying more than this to pay off the arrears too, but as the arrears have the same account number, whatever she pays is automatically deducted from this years bill and the arrears won't appear to reduce until that is cleared, if that makes sense? She is worried that not filling in the income/expenditure form is an offence, although can the council submit a letter which was sent through the post from an agent not themselves and certainly not "served" on her in person, as evidence? To be honest, my first instinct was that they are chancing, hoping the threat gets a response, but I've not seen or heard of, this kind of letter before. I know the council say it's an offence to not fill in their requests for income/expenditure, but can a bailiff company claim the same (the letter states "I" am serving, not "the council" or even "on behalf of the council"? *edited* all I can find looking up the regulations, is; Duties of debtors subject to liability order 36.—(1) Where a liability order has been made, the debtor against whom it was made shall, during such time as the amount in respect of which the order was made remains wholly or partly unpaid, be under a duty to supply relevant information to the billing authority on whose application it was made. (b)the billing authority requests him by notice given in writing to supply it; Thanks Gem.

Thanks UB, I didn't know you could use TPS with a mobile. She's had the same number for 8 years and never had any marketing calls before, she is a panicer and is now panicing, this will help put her mind at rest. Is the compliance manager obliged to give her the info or is it at their discretion to do so? Gem

Hi everyone, looking for a bit of advice please. (hope I'm in the correct sub-forum) My daughter got a lot of missed calls from an 0845 number, she just had a phonecall from a different, landline number, with someone saying they were from First Assist on behalf of *her bank name given*. They were trying to sell sickness/injury insurance. Because they used her middle name which she only ever uses with the bank, she confirmed her name and address, told them who she works for and that she has a child and the childs age. Luckily I came in and found out it was a 'sales' call before she agreed to take out their insurance and give her bank details to them and I got her to hang up. I rang the 0845 number also and got a recorded message stating they were calling on behalf of the bank. I then rang the bank to find out if First Assist were affiliated with them in any way and they said no and they never pass on any customer info/details. I googled the number and found lots of people have been getting calls from the same numbers for a couple of years now. Is there anything she can do, anyone she can report this to, she is now worrying about ID theft even though she didn't give her bank details. Is there anyway we can find out where this company or agent got her details from? Thanks Gem

Ok, so I never heard back from Rossendales although I both wrote and emailed them. The bailiff came back and hey-ho 2nd visit charge now applied. He returned again this week, I wasn't in (three times he has been, same day same time diff weeks, I'm guessing even a bailiff isn't stupid enough to not realise he's coming at the wrong day/time, so he's not coming in the real hope of catching me in). Here's the situation again, 2 LO's already with Rossendales, after complaining to the council about the bailiffs attitude and charges, cases back with Rossendales office and payment arrangement of 50 per week arranged and currently being paid. 2 further LO's now with Rossendales (diff bailiff than the first) and he wants a second payment arrangement made to pay those, no response to email and letter sent to their offices *rolls eyes* This weeks visit left me with a payment plan application form stating if I don't send wage slips (I'm self employed!) then the time allowed for repayment would be restricted, 8 giro slips to make payments, 2 letters saying if payment not made in 5 days then they're coming to take goods and a form with half-info about what happens next, charges they can apply, the threat of the council sending me to prison if I don't pay etc etc. The only contact I have for the bailiff is a mobile number but their form states not to ring, but to make arrangement by writing only!! So, my doors and windows are locked, I pay 50 per week and screenshot the account info after every payment in case they don't pass all payments onto the council (their fees consisting of 1st and 2nd visits only are also listed on this screen, so any change in those I will have documented) and I've paid small amounts every Friday directly to the council (only a tenner but will pay them the 50 p/w too when I've cleared the one I have the arrangement on). I hope he doesn't come again with more poor dead trees containing bullpoop, all this eye rolling and head shaking in disbelief is making me dizzy! Gem

No, he explained everything to his boss, showed him all the paperwork etc and his boss authorised an advancement of wages to the amount required to pay off the CT, repayable at the rate he would have been paying CT installments over. Interest free thankfully, great boss! Gem

I hope the answerphone message which of course my daughter has saved, plus the bailiffs letter with the attempted overblown charges on mean this bailiff will lose her certification, but I doubt it, the system seems to work in their favour with them getting the benefit of the doubt but hey, stranger things have happened, I'll update should anything come of their complaint, someone else may find it useful someday... am I allowed to post the bailiffs name when I get it off my daughter, again in the hope it could help someone else? Gem

Thanks for the heads up on that, I'll let my children know not to answer the door if they don't know for sure who is on the other side. A couple more questions if you don't mind: Can he levy against my goods without my signature if they mistakenly let him in, can he get my adult children to sign if I'm not there or if I arrived home to his presence could I refuse to sign paperwork? I live on a street front terraced block, our alleys are gated and locked, too high to climb as a few drunks have discovered lol, my dog also pretty much lives in my back yard, she loves fresh meat and a good bone to gnaw on, so he may dangle his legs over the back wall as much as he likes once he has scaled the alley-gates!! The way I see it, if he's on my property or attempting to get on it without permisson, it's his look out!! Gem

After realising just how bad things can get for people through reading these forums, I wanted to share a tale that ends pretty well. My daughter, for the past few years has had an arrangement to pay her CT at the end of the month rather than on the 8th/15th as per norm for our council. She has never had any problem with this arrangement. She spoke to the CT collections in December 2011 asking for an extension as she had been off work ill due to finding a lump in her breast and they agreed to defer Decembers payment to February (normal payments being due from April - Jan inc). Whilst on that call, she asked if she was still ok paying at the end of the month and was told yes. So, April she made a payment and in May recieved a summons for non-payment. She rang them from my landline and explained about her arrangement and told them she had made Aprils payment. She was told there was no record of her arrangement and they couldn't recall the summons unless she made full payment there and then. She didn't have 900.00, so she asked if she could make payments at her usual rate and dates (ie the end of the month) and make an extra payment of 80.00 in February 2013 for the cost of the LO. She was told yes. She made payments May June and July, then came home from work one night in August to the standard Equita threatening letter. (Having never been in debt for CT, and never having her arrangement questioned despite it not being in writing, she hadn't realised she didn't have an agreement with the council due to her verbal arrangement with their call centre and recieved no letters off the council after the summons). The bailiff had added hundreds in charges, as the outstanding amount was in the region of 680 including the 80 charges, but the bailiffs letter stated over 1000 owed. Obviously she queried with the council, equita and the individual bailiff, who reduced the amount to 950 after my daughter mentioned she was ringing the council to find out if the amount was correct and why it was that amount if so. Then my daughter rang CAB, they told her to lock doors etc and contact the bailiff telling her it was now with them. The bailiff then left answerphone messages on my daughters phone upping the charges and threatening immediate removal of goods for going to the CAB. My daughter and my son-in-law then went to the council and demanded to see someone from the complaints dept, refusing to be fobbed off with a form to fill in, and explained everything. It turns out the council had employed temps during May and although a call was logged, no details of the call had been recorded hence the agreement not being recognised by them. They called off the bailiffs but my son-in-law got a loan and paid the full amount of council tax left (plus 24.50 for bailiff visit) as he was afraid after complaining, that he might return home to no door or car, not knowing bailiffs don't have the powers they claim to have. They are waiting for written confirmation that the bill is now cleared in full and then are going to complain about both the council and equita to whoever they can. The good news....out of the blue this afternoon, the guy in charge of the complaints dept at the council rang my daughter and told her he is refunding 104.50, the charge for the LO and the costs of the bailiffs first visit, they have sent a cheque out today. It wont stop them complaining as my son-in-law says, how many more have they tried and succeeded in doing this to? But at least sometimes there can be a kind of good ending Gem

Thanks UB, email sent, going off previous experience I will get a snail mail letter reply around Wednesday next week. Now, my household currently consists of myself, 16 year old daughter, 18 year old son (college student) and 22 year old (today lol) daughter with her 2 year old daughter. None of my children are mentioned on my CT bills or the bailiffs paperwork, am I correct in thinking that should the bailiff call and there be only my children home, even if they are over 18, they have no authority to grant access to my home? I'm reluctant to mention the possibility of a bailiff visit as my daughter is of a nervous disposition and my son would possibly get aggressive if confronted by aggressiveness. Thanks for your advice, every response puts my mind at ease a little Gem

That's a problem with my council too, I only have one council reference number for all outstanding .If tyour council had put this years account on hold until December, the amount should surely have gone off your previous amount. Instead of speaking to the person in the council call centre, who by nature are unhelpful and uninformed in my experience, try their complaints dept as this worked for my daughter and son-in law. Gem

I spoke to the council, in their usual helpful manner they said they cannot discuss it as it is with the bailiffs and I need to speak to them and request that they add the accounts onto my standing arrangement with them. Rossendales reply to that request....you need to speak with the individual bailiff as it is with him. I can keep up with the 50 I am paying Rossendales and at least for the time being, pay the council something direct for the 2 lastest bills, I just dont want this bailiff banging on my door constantly and we all know, the minute I ring him, he will be angling to come round and put a levy on my (ancient) T.V. and sofas! Thinking I might email Rossendales complaints dept and ask why it cant all be consolidated as I haven't missed an agreed payment with them and I am showing willingness to pay. 50 a week is more than a nominal amount and I can still pay extra directly to the council as and when I have it (obviously I wont be mentioning that part to Rossendales). At the rate I'm paying, the total amounts from all 4 cases will be paid by the end of this tax year anyway. What do you think? Gem

Hi, I recieved that info about the first 2 cases which I am already paying off through Rossendales, when the council looked into my complaint. They broke down Rossendales charges for me too, after they made them remove the levy fees and costs of the levy they put on my neighbours car. These stand at 42.50 for two alleged visits although I only ever knew of one visit, when they levied my neighbours car. As they are from 2009-2010 and 2010-2011, I asked the council for a breakdown of what I owed for last and this year which they also sent me. As I am self-employed and my income varies massively from week to week, I couldn't make an acceptable definate payment arrangement with them, so I was aware they would be passed over to bailiffs at some point. The letters I recieved today are for those 2 cases and include one visit fee of 24.50, as the letter was hand delivered, those charges are valid. The letters I got today say that I can make a weekly arrangement, if I pay 150.00 immediately (which I don't have), however I take it as the letter has the bailiffs number as contact, that this agreement will be with him not the office and he will want to come round to accept the offer and levy against goods which I am not willing to do. I already have an arrangement with Rossendales, I don't understand why they have issued these new cases to a bailiff without contacting me? Gem

Hi all, I had such great advice yesterday, I'm back for more! I have, including this year, 4 outstanding CT for differing amounts. In July I heard from Rossendales for the first time regarding two of the accounts. I wasn't in when they came and I rang the bailiff when I got the letters through the door (I had'nt read the forum then!). The usual, I'm not letting you have an arrangement, well I don't own anything that will cover the debt, conversation ensued, which ended when he told me I was just going to go to prison then. I rang the council and made a complaint against them. That got my account put on hold while the council looked into it, they came back with "there are some overcharging mistakes which appear genuine (yeah ok) and we have said you can pay by installments". (He also put a seizure notice through for a car I dont own as I dont drive and charged me for that). I didn't know about still being able to pay online to the council, so entered into a 50.00 a week agreement with Rossendales which I have stuck to. I have just got home, and there was an envelope with 2 more letters for the rest off what I owe (I have kind of been expecting them but had decided to pay them through the council site after having read things here, from tuesday next week at a further 50.00 a week). These are in a different bailiffs name, but, when I log into Rossendales payonline site, all four debts are listed together, although I can only login using the ref number of the first debt I'm paying off. Any advice on how to proceed, whether to speak to the bailiffs or just continue my arrangement for the first 2 cases (unless they barr me from the site) and pay the second 2 off via the council site (which would take the payments off this years bill first and therefore be better by my understanding?) would be appreciated. Gem

I don't have a scanner or any means to connect my mobile to my laptop to upload the letter unfortunately but here is the content. Dear xxxxxx Re: British Telecommunications PLC Balance 450.68 We have been instructed by our clients to collect the above amount owed by you. This amount includes a debt of 360.00 to our client and our costs and charges. To prevent further action pay this amount immediately using one of the methods below. The second letter. Dear xxxxx Re: British Telecommunications PLC Balance 555.68 IMORTANT INFORMATION - LITIGATION To prevent the above possible action please send payment before 29/09/12 or telephone xxxxx immediately. If you do not contact us following reciept of this letter we may have no alternative other than to recommend that solicitors issue legal action against you which may follow. Please note if legal action is necessary and if the solicitors instructed are successful in entering judgement then your debt may increase as follows current balance 555.68 solicitors costs for issue of claim 50.00 court fees for issue of claim form 30.00 solicitors fees for entering judgement 25.00 total debt if judgement obtained 660.68 I have no intention of contacting them or paying any moneys to them, on the BT website my debt still stands at the original amount, and I will be making payments direct to them through there, so if court papers do appear I will be able to show intent and actual payments to pay the debt off, hopefully that would prevent a CCJ judgement. Gem

Hi, thanks for the welcome and reply. I don't know what a letter of assignment is I'm afraid. I recieved a letter off BT Debt Recovery Unit after I had made my offer which neither acknowledged nor referenced my offer. It was a standard letter saying to ignore if I had paid in the last 7 days and if I hadn't, to pay within the next 10 days. At the bottom of the letter it said; " If you don't pay right away, we'll hand your case over to a debt collection agency, you will need to pay aditional costs and they might take legal action." I don't know if this counts as a letter of assignment. That letter is dated Sept 4th and my first call from Moorcroft was on Tues 18th Sept, which is 14 days apart but only 9 working days. I thought only a comapny I had an agreement with could take it to court and a DCA had no rights to do so as I have no agreement with them? Gem