Kay against Alliance & Leicester***WON** POST OFT

[jansus]

Hi Kay

 

sorry to hear about your troubles - as I said to others today the money is not everything by any means- we have to keep it all in proportion.

 

We are just doing our best to put right an injustice.

 

Hope your case goes ok

 

jan

[dewhit20]

Thanks Mimi, got the form now. Thanks to you too jan. I'll let you know what happens.

Power to the People!!!!

Love KX

[dewhit20]

Hi all,

I rang the court today and was told that they havent recieved anything from Wraggs. So they've missed the deadline! Horray!! BUT they "may still put in a request for a 'stay'. So she advised me to do nothing until next Wednesday, the day before the court case, when I should call to see if it has been stayed, saving me the trip to Redditch.

Thats not fair is it???

Love KX

[MimiJane]

I've never read of Wragge submitting anything yet, so you should win by default (eventually:rolleyes:).

 

Good luck with the court next week.

 

I've provided the Judgement Form link a few posts above and, if there is a "Stay", you can appeal. See this link :-

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/17065-application-removal-stay-updated.html#post1046820

 

Let us know how you get on and good luck!

 

Mimi x

[dewhit20]

Received "standard" letter from A+L today.

 

I have scanned it but this system wont let me insert it. However it basically is telling me (us) that "they have asked the courts and FOS not to proceed with any other case they are hearing until the test case is resolved"....and to "retain your bank records as this will make it easier for us to support your complaint on resolution of the test case. Once legal proceedings finish, we will resolve your complaint as quickly as possible applying the test case principles, which may result in a different outcome to the one communucated to you in our final response." They enclose Frequently Asked questions paper about the 'test case' on charges for unauthorised overdrafts.

 

On Mimis' wonderful advise I have already submitted a "Request for Judgment" form, and just hope to God that the court will look favourably upon this request "especially as the defendants have ignored the Judges directions" i.e. not submitting their bundle on time.

Having said that, I must admit I dont exactly know what they were supposed to submit, is it the same as my bundle?, with explanations of how they came to charge me all this money?

 

I am really not good with all this legal jargon, but have gone about this claim with the help of money-expert and CAG. and I cannot thank you all enough for all the support you have given me. I know we are all in the same boat, but for some it has paid off, others are still left hanging in the balance. I know I am so very close but realise I may be just a tad too late.

Court date Thurs Aug 16th 14.00hrs.

Bye for now.

Love KX:???:

[jansus]

Which court is it again - there is a list in "general " section as to what the courts are doing in respect of stays.

 

there is one case where the court did not accept the stay and the claimant won (barclays)- and another where the request for judgement had been filed by the claimant but the court gave the stay to the bank.

 

I have read in one thread that the reason it can be hard to win by default ( although several here have done so) is that as long as the bank put in their defence documents they are not obliged to lodge any other papers - they can rely soley on the defence papers in court ( and as they have never appeared then that explains why they do not produce further papers.) Also a court often allows the defendant extra time to produce paperwork - but not the claimant (if you were in the defendants position in a court case no doubt you would appreciate this) this is not favours to the banks - just the way the system works.

 

 

Therfeore lets hope that you have a court/judge who is sympathetic.

 

I have had my official stay from the court ( not the bank) and have appealed by N244.

 

I get the feeling that if the court date goes ahead they will be on the doorstep waiting to settle:)

 

Hope it all goes ok

 

urgent help now pls. stay refused in court rt now

 

Barclays Refused Stay - We Won Today! 07/08/07

 

Find out here if your local court is staying claims

 

Jan

[dewhit20]

Jan you're brilliant!

I am half expecting a letter from the court tomorrow to stay my case, but hope my letter will make them sympathetic.

Thankyou so much for the advise, I'll be ready for them no matter what!

Really appreciate your time in sharing all your knowledge with me and others.

Its so good we are all watching out for each other.

Love KX

[dewhit20]

Just got a call from a nice lady from Redditch county court.

They have just recieved A+L's application for stays on all their cases. However, the judge will make his discision at the hearing. So I have to attend as normal.

Oooeeer!!!

Nerve wracking or what??!!! I didnt think it would come to this.

Is my court hearing going to be about ME and my CLAIM or will it be just about whether to Stay or not to Stay? .........This is the question.

Love (A very anxious) KayX

[dewhit20]

.........Also the nice court lady said she hasnt seen my "request for judgement" but it may be filed. Even so it wont be looked at until the decision of the "stay" is made.

KX

[MimiJane]

On reading a couple of other threads about "Stays", a couple of people's cases are being looked at individually, so hope this is the case with you. Each court seem to be taking their own approach though:rolleyes:

 

Good luck!

 

Mimi

[jansus]

I would just be prepared to argue against the stay by handing the suggested document to the judge and the defence for them to read - bet the A&L wont be prepared at all - then you will have to rely on the judge - if it is not stayed then I bet a&L will ask for an ajournment- because they wont want to argue case

Stays still being ordered by the Courts

 

keep reading - especially general section - to see if any other recommendations

 

I will post you any other threads I find:)

 

jan

 

Case guidance notes - bringing your case to court

 

 

Legal Arguments in support of Claim

[dewhit20]

Thankx Mimi and Jan!

Love KX

[dewhit20]

Notice of Hearing of Application. Recieved this morning from the court.

"The hearing of the defendants application for Claim to Be Steayed Generall (see copy attached) will take place at 13.00 on the 16 August 2007 at Redditch County Court...

Cases are listed in accordance with local hearing arrangementts determined by the Judiciary and implemented by court staff. Every effort is made to ensure that hearings start either at the time specified or as soon as possible thereafter. However, listing practices or other factors may mean that delay is unavoidable. Furthermore, in some instances a case may be released to another judge, possibly at a different court. Please contact the court for further information on the listing arrangements that may apply to your hearing."

The attached Application Notice from Wroage & Co is a form which on the question of: How do you wish to have your application dealt with, they have marked an X beside "without a hearing".

Part A says " We intend to apply for an order that a) This claim is stayed generlly and b) That all claims issued against A+L in this court, where the claimant is seeking to recover what the claimant alleges are unauthorised bank charges, are stayed generally.

because

A test case is being brought in the High Court by various banks and the OFT to seek to resolve the uncertainties concerning the level, fairness and lawfulness of unauthorised bank charges. It would be appropriate to stay this and all other cases in this Court invoiving the Defendant pending a final resolution of the test case.

Part B

We wish to rely on: and they have crossed the box that says "evidence in Part C in support of my application.

Part C

We wish to relay on the following evidence in support of this application - See witness Statement attached.

Should I go on quoting the Draft Oder and Witness statement of Susan Martina Land of Wragg & Co LLP which is attached?

I am sending off the letter objecting to a stay, by special delivery today.

What more can I do?

I feel absolutely gutted that they are using my hearing as an application to stay all cases.

[dewhit20]

Bumpety bump bump. Any advise or comments would be sooooo appreciated. I am really really nervous tonight.

[jansus]

It sounds like there are going to be a few of you there in the same position. If you take some copies of the appeal against the stay with you (if you dont understand the document post again and we wil try and get you help or pm Michael Browne he is very helpful) If A&L turn up hand them a copy of your appeal letter.

 

If I get to court I will be nervous as well - everyone is - the worse that can happen is that the judge rules for the bank and approve the stay - which will delay the case - it does not mean it is all over . the best that can happen is that they refuse the stay.

 

I am sure the court will realise that you are a lay person and allow for that.

 

A few people on this thread have been to court and I dont think any of them had a nasty judge.

 

I will try searching Redditch court to see if anybody else is there with you

 

 

We all will be thinking of you

 

 

Jan

[squarebob]

HAS NO ONE GIVEN YOU ANY WORDS OF RE-ASSURANCE?

Put yourself together a letter which gives you the whys and wherefores of why your case should be heard and why any proposed stay would affect you etc. There's loads of info out there, take a pinch of this and a pinch of that, put something together, it's your fight, think of some one drowning, they'll fight to survive and so will you. Male or female it matters not a jot, it's how you come across that counts.

Good Luck

Badger xx

Nerves is wallking down a 'Dark Alley'....the courtroom is brightly lit!

If they don't, or Won't, give you a chance to speak your piece...........don't leave until you do!

Let me know how you get on.

[jansus]

Now that it is official

 

read the last post on this thread - may help

 

I am sure that squarebobs post has put your mind completely at rest:p

 

As he would say - worse things happen at sea:) ( bobbing about in a pineapple)

 

jan

[dewhit20]

THANKYOU SOOO MUCH FOR YOUR SUPPORT. I really needed that!

Squarebob, you are a strange one, but in the end you are really on the ball!! Yes you have have made me feel so much better. And Jan, again I cant thank you enough for the info.

I am scared of going to court and maybe having to actually SPEAK up. Aaaagh. Everthing in writing up to now, but will I just freeze like a frightened rabbit in the headlights???????

Its so important what happens, to me and others after me.

Lots of Love

Kayxxxxxxxxx

[jansus]

read a few more threads mentioning Redditch and as they are a big court it seems they are very used to all this messing about by the banks and there seem to have been mostly wins to the claimant.

 

Think about it like going to the doctors - you may be nervous or embarrased - but they have seen it all before .

 

Unlike my court who I dont think have seen hardly any cases at all:rolleyes:

 

jan:)

[alice-rose]

Hi there Kay

 

You're going to be FINE AND DANDY tomorrow.

Don't worry.

We're all here batting on your side !

 

If you haven't done so already,

have a read through this link

listed below

 

If you are questioned by the judge,

or given chance to speak/give your opinion by the Judge

 

then the information contained within this link will give you a little ammunition to fire at the other side - A&L defence !

 

If I were you I would print it off tonight,

have a read through

and take it with you to the court tomorrow.

You can refer to it in the court.

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/17065-application-removal-stay-updated.html#post1046820

 

take care

nightie night

 

alice xxx

[dewhit20]

I posted this letter today special delivery, based on the template you mentioned. Hope it does the trick.

Thankyou!!

Claim Number:xxxxxx

In the Redditch County Court

 

Between:

 

Kay Whittaker

Claimant

-and-

Alliance and Leicester PLC

Defendant

 

 

I have today ( the day before my hearing ) received an application for stay on my case from the defendant. This last minute plea to stop my case from going ahead comes after the defendant has already offered part settlement to my claim.

I strongly object to the proposed order of a stay in respect of the claim detailed above upon the following grounds;

Human rights

It would infringe my rights under the European Convention on Human Rights directly and as enacted in the Human Rights Act 1998.

2 Art.6 1. Of the Convention provides that, in the determination of their civil rights everyone is entitled to a fair and public hearing within a reasonable time.

Alliance and Leicester Plc are not involved with the High Court Test Case, however, the 8 banks that are, have recently published identical statements on their websites informing customers that they expect the test case to last for over a year. Given the importance of the issues there will almost inevitably be an appeal from a first instance decision and any stay could endure for two years or even more.

It is thus submitted that the period of any proposed stay cannot be accurately predicted and would therefore in effect be indeterminate.

This is plainly not a reasonable time within which to resolve the vast majority of claims before the Courts, which like mine are small claims.

This case will not be expeditiously dealt with if delayed for up to 2 years. Alliance and Leicester have had years to invite the OFT to issue their case against them. It is very rare when they bother to argue any defence. In other words, they treat cases like mine as another commercial decision. They have never sought to see a case through, take it to appeal if necessary and seek to establish certainty over the principles they assert are so crucial now, they necessitate a stay of all claims.

Many hundreds of cases have gone through the Courts already, arguing the same points that are set out as preliminary issues in the OFT case. I should not be deprived of the same opportunity that all those other Claimants had, simply because Alliance and Leicester have elected to take this route vis a vis the OFT.

It is submitted that the ordering of a stay as proposed is not reasonable.

The Overriding Objective requires that my case is allowed to proceed speedily so that a just settlement may be obtained by the parties to this case. Dealing with cases justly includes ensuring that this case is dealt with expeditiously and fairly and in a way that is proportionate to the amount of money involved.

It is submitted that the imposition of an indeterminate stay in a small claims track case involving a relatively small sum, at such an advanced stage in proceedings, is not just, nor is it expeditious, nor is it fair on a claimant who has outlaid sums by way of court fees in pursuit of a legitimate right to seek a remedy.

 

Balance of convenience.

In my case, I claim £2,434.74 in charges and interest unlawfully levied by the Alliance and Leicester Plc. This is a large sum for me but a negligible sum for the Defendant. It is of no consequence to the Bank that I may be deprived of an opportunity to resolve my dispute for a further year to two years, as they already have my money and in any event they are under no financial pressure to resolve the case fairly and speedily. I on the other hand am extremely anxious to have my case determined as speedily as fairness permits and the comparatively low amount of money involved, so far as the Bank is concerned, does not warrant the resolution of the dispute being delayed further.

It is submitted that a stay may potentially mean great difficulty for me and yet be insignificant for the defendant bank. In fact a stay is supportive of the banks litigation strategy which is to frustrate justice by repeatedly taking the claimant to the door of the court, and then to settle the claim.

 

The Status Quo

The stay does not maintain the status quo. As submitted above, a stay favours the bank by preventing the claimant’s pursuit of its legitimate remedy without placing any restriction upon the banks activities which I submit are unlawful and retaliatory.

 

Furthermore, as submitted above the present case concerns a relatively small sum and is at a late stage in proceedings, and therefore I submit that to impose an indeterminate stay is unnecessary, inappropriate, not in the interests of justice and further, is detrimental to my rights in a way which is unfair and inequitable.

 

Expense would be saved by allowing my case to proceed in the normal way.

I, the Claimant, believe all facts stated to be true.

Signed:

Dated:

 

[dewhit20]

Jan, its funny you should mention the doctors... I was there today! Had to have a skin-tag taken off... my bum!!! So I know exactly what you mean.

Thanks

Love KX

[dewhit20]

Yes, still up and worrying. (but thats my nature)

Just had a thought.

Wragges have attached loads of copies with their witness statement, of other cases from around the country, that have been stayed.

Is there anywhere I can find counter information on cases that have gone ahead (and been won) since the OFT announcement???

Love K X

[alice-rose]

Good Morning Kay

 

You can find the information where

Alliance & Leicester Cases have been won,

by doing the following:-

 

Go to the very top of this page

Click on Site Map

this will take you to another page, where you click on

Bank Action Group

this takes you to another page where you

click on LITIGATION SECTION at the top of the page (in Red letters)

Scroll down the page

check all the different sections have been completed

ie. Show all CONCLUDED Cases

Show results for ALLIANCE & LEICESTER

there are 79 concluded cases for Alliance & Leicester

complete with Claims Numbers

 

you could print this off,

Print off THREE copies, one for you, one for court, one for A&L

and take them along with you.

 

 

GOOD LUCK KAY

will be thinking of you today.

 

let us know how you go on

 

alice xxx

[alice-rose]

morning Kay

 

hope you are still there

 

regarding Settlements after OFT

 

JESS68 or in lower case ? Jess68

 

received settlement on 1st August 2007

 

 

alice xxx