Toon Army Vs Littlewoods/Debt Managers LTD

[oz4725]

I need guidance on how to attack this please guys!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Hi all

This post could be War and Peace but i will endevour to keep it clear and concise. For a while now i've been at home on sick leave (soldier) so to beat the boredom i got engrossed in this site and decided to help the Dragon-in-Law out with her finances coz she's useless with that kinda thing. Everything going great on several other Accounts/Cards, then i came across Littlewoods!!

The Dragon took out a catalogue in Jan 04, a few months later her health nose dived and for the last 2 1/2 years she has been at home living on benefits. Long story short, Acct in arrears (£528 Acct handed to a bunch of ignorant Ejits at a DCA in August 06.

 

Unknown to me after much harrassment by this DCA, she pays them £5pm, (sometimes £10pm as she is ashamed of the situation and wants it paid ASAP. I recently found her sat in cold and dark to save money coz DCA rang and said if you can pay £10 one month, pay it every month!)

 

In January when i became aware of this situation i submitted an S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) to Littlewoods on behalf of the Dragon and yesterday she received a nice big envelope with all her info it and a letter saying "any further correspondance to go thru' Ejits R Us DCA".

 

The DCA claimed the following when i rang yesterday and mentioned disputing the Acct amount. 1. Any acct with a DCA is fact and is not open to dispute. 2. Failure to pay could lead to baillifs ect AND House Repo!(Try it, its council) and then part way through a mini lecture about charges and how the Dragon wouldn't have them if she wasn't in arrears i put the phone down. Whats the point in even speaking to these people.

 

Problem No.1 Via the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) i have found £185 in charges. Littlewoods will not acknowledge this Acct anymore so who is the Prelim, LBA ect directed too? The DCA? I have trawled the site for similiar scenarios but to no avail. I want no verbal correspondance with them as they have proved how dumb they are already.

 

Problem No.2 Via the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) i found out the Dragon has been charged each month upto Aug 06 (All charges stopped being added when handed to DCA)for Extracare 500. (£178 in total). This is an Insurance policy that covers among other things making payments in the event of illness. The Dragon had no idea she had this, as from day 1 of sickness she would have been elidgable to claim. (She has a barclay loan currently being paid off thru a similiar policy).I know its a policy holders responsibility to make a claim, but would L'woods have any responsibility as a responsible lender to suggest using this policy. They were told on numourous occasions the arrears was down to illness and inability to work. I didn't see the point in a CCA request to see if the Dragon had signed for the policy as she did it all over the phone and i think its along the lines of accepting goods at your home is like accepting there T&C's???????? Can this policy be retrospectivly claimed on, or can all the charges be claimed back as the Extracare T&C's state the policy is null and void after 3 months in arrears. So if its a null and void policy why keep charging her for it for another 2 years, is this the norm??

 

I really want to get my Sh*t together on this one and send L'Woods/DCA some bulletproof arguments as there ignorant attitudes and mis-information has wound me up and as i've read many times on the site, revenge is sweeter, in the form of a cheque!!

There's also a default notice on the dragon coz of all this too which i'd like to fight.

 

I'm wide open for guidance/help and idea's guys.

 

Thanks

 

Oz

 

PS

Just read it back and it aint far off War and Peace!!!!!!!!

[InKogneeToh]

Hi,

 

I have just come across your post but as it's now 1.00am I'm too addle-brained to think straight and address all the issues. I will take a look on Monday.

 

Also by my responding now I have bumped your post up near the top of the list again so other members will also help I'm sure.

 

Regards, Pam

[oz4725]

Thanks Pam

Could really do with some inspiration on how to approach this one!!!

[InKogneeToh]

Hi again

 

Well, there is a lot going on here so I will try to answer issues one at a time.

 

Do you know if the debt has been bought by the DCA or are they just acting as agents for Littlewoods? This makes a difference as to who to send these requests etc. to.

 

Firstly, your mum-in-law must send a CCA request to whoever owns the debt immediately, requesting a copy of the original executed agreement uder s77/78 of the Act. Many catalogues do not even have credit agreements in place and even if they have sent one to a customer it is often not signed and returned but the account is set up anyway.

 

If no copy credit agreement is forthcoming then the debt is unenforceable without a court order.

 

1. Any acct with a DCA is fact and is not open to dispute. (NOT TRUE)

 

2. Failure to pay could lead to baillifs ect AND House Repo!(ONLY IF A CCJ HAS BEEN OBTAINED AND ANY REPAYMENT PLAN DEFAULTED ON)

 

It is Littlewoods who applied the £185 charges on the acc. so it's them you have to send the LBA to- ignore any subsequent response that the acc. has been passed on etc. - they still owe you the charges, not the DCA.

 

The insurance part I am not really sure about - it depends on what was in the contract. Does she have a copy of this in her SAR bundle?

 

Regards, Pam

[oz4725]

Hi Pam

 

I did think about sending off a CCA request but i know that it will bring nothing up as the Dragon is adamant that everything to do with setting up the acct was done over the phone. Iread on this site somewhere about accepting goods at your address is you adhereing to their T&C's, Distance Selling Act spings to mind but i will try and find that thread again and double check it.

 

As far as the DCA go, i put the phone down on them thanks to reading this site for the last three months and i knew it was standard bully tactics that works on the vunerable and scared and having had brain surgery i didnt want my rehab affected by the cr*p that was coming down the phone line! By the way the debt hasn't been bought by them, just passed to them

 

Yes it was Littlewoods who made the £185 in charges so i shall prelim them today and wait for no reply!

 

The insurance one is leaving me stumped. I downloaded the T&C's off Littlewoods site and went thru them last night and i believe that there are three angles it could be looked at:

 

1. Goin back to CCA request, surely insurance is seperate to a credit agreement and would require the policy holder to sign up to it?? If the Dragon hasn't signed up for it why have they charged her for it each month, is this allowed (is there any Mods,SH's, or insurance guru's out there that could clarify this for me please??????)

 

2. In my opinion had she been aware she had the cover (signed for or not she has been charged monthly for it) she would have been elidgable for it to pay out and none of this mess would have started. Can this be done retrospectivly? Could/should this have been pointed out by littlewoods when they phoned her and asked for payments. They knew the arrears were thru illness and the insurance payments are on their printouts every month?

 

3. In the T&C's it states that the policy becomes "Null and Void" on reaching the 3rd month of arrears. So why have they continued to take money every month until it was handed to the DCA? I've worked out that of the £178 charged for extracare insurance, £160 of it is when the policy is "Null and Void" according to the T&C's. Should she have carried on paying for a policy that was void? Is it reclaimable?

 

Any clarity on this Pam (or anyone else for that matter!!) would be hugely appreciated.

[InKogneeToh]

Hi Pam

 

I did think about sending off a CCA request but i know that it will bring nothing up as the Dragon is adamant that everything to do with setting up the acct was done over the phone. Iread on this site somewhere about accepting goods at your address is you adhereing to their T&C's, Distance Selling Act spings to mind but i will try and find that thread again and double check it.

 

Hi the Distance selling regs. may apply in part to this situation but a credit agreement entered into with a catalogue such as Littlewoods is covered by the CCA 1974.

 

There must be a properly executed agreement in place between the borrower and the creditor and if not the agreement is unenforceable without a court order.

 

If you are sure the debt has not been sold to the DCA (i.e. they are only acting as agents) then the CCA request should go to the original creditor - Littlewoods, and they must

comply otherwise they will be in default and are not allowed to enforce.

 

As far as the DCA go, i put the phone down on them thanks to reading this site for the last three months and i knew it was standard bully tactics that works on the vunerable and scared and having had brain surgery i didnt want my rehab affected by the cr*p that was coming down the phone line! By the way the debt hasn't been bought by them, just passed to them

 

A short letter to the DCA telling them that the agreement is in dispute with Littlewoods should shut them up for a while. Otherwise just ignore them unless the threats become serious.

 

Yes it was Littlewoods who made the £185 in charges so i shall prelim them today and wait for no reply!

 

The insurance one is leaving me stumped. I downloaded the T&C's off Littlewoods site and went thru them last night and i believe that there are three angles it could be looked at:

 

1. Goin back to CCA request, surely insurance is seperate to a credit agreement and would require the policy holder to sign up to it?? If the Dragon hasn't signed up for it why have they charged her for it each month, is this allowed (is there any Mods,SH's, or insurance guru's out there that could clarify this for me please??????)

 

2. In my opinion had she been aware she had the cover (signed for or not she has been charged monthly for it) she would have been elidgable for it to pay out and none of this mess would have started. Can this be done retrospectivly? Could/should this have been pointed out by littlewoods when they phoned her and asked for payments. They knew the arrears were thru illness and the insurance payments are on their printouts every month?

 

3. In the T&C's it states that the policy becomes "Null and Void" on reaching the 3rd month of arrears. So why have they continued to take money every month until it was handed to the DCA? I've worked out that of the £178 charged for extracare insurance, £160 of it is when the policy is "Null and Void" according to the T&C's. Should she have carried on paying for a policy that was void? Is it reclaimable?

 

Isn't there a copy of the Insurance application or policy document amongst the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) bundle? Did she do a FULL SAR request asking for everything they hold ? As regards continuing being charged after the policy becomes null and void, I really don't have an answer for that one. Someone with contract law knowledge is needed. I think Littlewoods have been very negligent in not reminding her about the insurance because they were, as you say, taking the instalments from her and they were visible on her account. Yes, there should be a signed document relating to the insurance. She needs to get a copy of this!

 

Any clarity on this Pam (or anyone else for that matter!!) would be hugely appreciated.

 

Regards, Pam

[oz4725]

**Bump**

 

Any insurance guru's who could give me a pointer or two??????

 

thanks guys:)

[surprise]

Just come across this thread as my account has been passed to NDR for collection. With reference to the item on EXTRACARE, I can confirm that this is done verbally over the phone and I did accept this initially but when I realised how much it was costing I cancelled it.

Advice please- do I CCA NDR or do I SAR Littlewoods or should I do both because I know there are a lot of admin charges added on.

[oz4725]

Hi Surprise

 

I CCA'd and SAR littlewoods as I contacted the muppets at the DCA and Littlewoods and had it confirmed the debt was passed not sold. DM Ltd as far as i know are "in house" debt collectors with an attitude. CAB have had a look at the extracare and yes its verbal but should/must be enforced by a signed policy. My argument is a bit easier as the policy was void on the 3rd default so why charge my M I L for another two years.

 

From the day it was passed to DM Ltd there were no further admin charges applied by them or Littlewoods.

[surprise]

Hello

 

I have decided to CCA NDR and SAR Littlewoods. I think this might get NDR off my back for awhile. I think the reason they do it verbally is because people say yes to get them off the phone thinking it won't cost much. However, when you look at the the amount they do charge its extortionate. Will be interested to see how you go.