Motor Mart Ltd. returned Faulty Car Court Claim Issued

[BreadAndButter]

Hi,

I would like advice on how to proceed with a garage my father in law purchased a car from.

In a nutshell it was bought over the phone, delivered and was not as described. Things were broken, oil came out the exhaust every startup, oil was pooling round the engine head, to name a few issues.  

It was reported and requested a full refund within my a) coll off and b) 30 days not fit for purpose or as described. 

The firm collected the car, i left a list of issues in the car for them and £20 fuel was put in it.

After ringing for a refund they said they'd fix it all and send it back to him, by now the FIL had purchased a new car expecting a refund, he refused and said no, keep it, im entitled to a refund.

A day or two pass, no refund. He rings them up they shout down the line saying he wasn't getting his money any time soon and he is a liar.

This was followed up by his daughter calling and emailing about this and been told again, liars, obscenities and hung up.

 

They now dont respond to calls.

They dont respond to emails

If you do get through on a friends phone they tell you the business owner is off sick, on holiday, got covid, to name a few.

They have my FIL's money, the car is back on sale on their website and so they have the car too. So either they are selling his property or they are withholding his funds

 

Ive tried the motoring ombudsman but they havent responded.  Frustrated, the FIL is planning to go down there this week and cause a fuss face to face but this could go horribly wrong

Reviews online of the garage see others, same issues, terrible cars, then the company change names once taken to court.

Police were informed of the theft, and told its not a police issue.

 

How would you proceed?

 

 

 

 

[BreadAndButter]

Bank transfer.

 

It has been taken up with the bank however they have lost all the evidence - father in law is going into the bank today.

(yes, many mistakes have been made - we know this, but he went and did it all himself)

[BreadAndButter]

Name of the dealer  Motor Mart Ltd.11 Woodgate, Leicester LE3 5GH

Advertised on Facebook for sale

Make and model is a 2013 Kia Picanto they are re-selling it here 

2013 Kia Picanto 2 £3,495

WWW.MOTORMARTLTD.CO.UK

---

2013 Kia Picanto 2, Manual, In Red. DELIVERY AVAILABLE*.

Paid £3400 for it and it was delivered.

They're in Leicester about 40 minutes away, longer from milton keynes where he resides.

To add the car was delivered  January 12th 2024 and sent back on 16th  with a note:

"The discs and brakes are rusty the car is not stopping properly and is juddering this maybe due to issue with ABS.

One wheel nut is missing.

Cigarette lighter is not working.

The boot doesn't open properly,

my dad has fixed this however, the boot cover where the button is, is missing which means water can get into the boot.

There is also an oil leak at the top of the engine and black liquid coming out of the exhaust"

 

[BreadAndButter]

Quote

. I suppose he could pack it up very quickly and avoid judgement.

Yep - hes done it twice before since people made court claims against him
 

Quote

Does he have an established premises? Are all the other cars in the background of the photo belonging to him?

yes ,they do. and yes, its fairly well established. 

Im sure if a debt collector turned up asking for the value of the outstanding money he'd have stock we could drive away and sell

Quote

Did the car have an MOT? What date was the MOT and who issued it?

It did, its valid until june however it is unknown who issued it as its in the paperwork which we never got anyway,

I have to send a letter of claim - i dont see a template so I presume i make one up  including what is set out in the protocol?

Excuse my ignorance, pre-action-protocol-for-debt-claims (2).pdf  do I send this to them also or is this step 2?

Thanks

[BreadAndButter]

thanks for your help, Ill get a draft organised.

I dont think he's at the stage yet where he wants to pack up, he's so far happy to tell us to go away and block numbers, he has plenty of ebays listings and so-on.

If we cool our chase he will think we've gone away until he gets his LOC of course.

I have new information.

The payment was made using a debit card, not a bank transfer.

I dont think this changes much

 

Letter before small claims court claim

[My address]

[Supplier's address]

Dear Guy WhoRipsOffOAPS

Reference: Refund of Kia Piccanto NL13 AHC

As it has not been possible to resolve this matter amicably via multiple emails or attempted phone calls, nor will further phone calls be accepted by you to resolve this matter, I write in compliance with the courts Pre-Action Protocol to notify you of court action if you fail to settle the outstanding sum in full.

Amount outstanding: £3655

 Requested action: Full Refund.

This should be returned to the original form of payment: Debit Card.

From you I am claiming a full refund for the Kia Piccanto reg NL13 AHC which is currently in your possession and currently available for sale. You have an obligation to refund immediately the initial payment made for this car in January 2024, which has already been verbally agreed multiple times on the telephone yet has failed to materialise.

I look forward to hearing from you within the next 14 days.

Should I not receive a response to my letter within this time frame and having given you sufficient time prior to this letter then I anticipate that court action will be commenced with no further reference to you.

Court documents and evidence have already been prepared will be submitted to the courts on 27/03/2024

Yours faithfully, 

 

[BreadAndButter]

Yeah it doesnt say where unless you prove its your vehicle. 
 

so, bank method first or both? Hes been there today for a good couple of hours sorting it out and giving all evidence at the bank today

[BreadAndButter]

Thanks

As previously mentioned this is already underway with the bank, he visited yesterday and filed the payment reversal

The letter will be sent today.

 

Thanks for your help all

[BreadAndButter]

hmm, his bank want evidence before reversing it, they need to now speak to the vendor.

I see the chargeback process now ill follow this up too.

[BreadAndButter]

Frustrating isnt it.

He's been IN the bank and theyve asked for all evidence and will decide once speaking to the other end. They already closed the case once because they didnt get all the evidence needed. Had to reopen it!

Ill run him through the process tonight, he's more than overwhelmed with information and processes so Im doing it all for him to get things moving

 

Cheers

[BreadAndButter]

virgin money

[BreadAndButter]

unfortunately we called them, they put us through to disputes and then we go around again, they ask us to email and send them the evidence for the dispute

 

Unsure how to get what we need here.

Which.co.uk have a chargeback tool, you send off the letters requesting it to the bank and they process it. Maybe thats a better shot as the telephone people havent got a scoobie

[BreadAndButter]

Rang them AGAIN today

They have closed the original dispute !  Reopened it.

Told them I want a charge back they said they cant do it until its been investigated and would not budge.

Looks like they are useless!

Im going to demand one by postal mail

[BreadAndButter]

nice ideas guys, but its not me, the father in lw was on the phone for 2 hours and then told them to  - he wont be calling back.

On with court then!

[BreadAndButter]

Ok ,letter sent asking to make a complaint, the police crime number attached, demanding a chargeback, escalation to financial ombudsman etc. etc.

 

Also, phones Leicester police, reported dangerous car resale and fraudulent garage - they now have to make a visit

[BreadAndButter]

RBS have come back, they have decided there is insufficient evidence and will not be processing any chargeback.

Ive checked and its not a legal right and so i cannot quote any laws to that effect.

All because they have asked for proof the car has been returned (a dodgy bloke with a trailor?) 

RBS are terrible!

 

[BreadAndButter]

Letter before small claims court claim

[My address]

[Supplier's address]

Dear Guy WhoRipsOffOAPS

Reference: Refund of Kia Piccanto NL13 AHC

As it has not been possible to resolve this matter amicably via multiple emails or attempted phone calls, nor will further phone calls be accepted by you to resolve this matter, I write in compliance with the courts Pre-Action Protocol to notify you of court action if you fail to settle the outstanding sum in full.

Amount outstanding: £3655

 Requested action: Full Refund.

This should be returned to the original form of payment: Debit Card.

From you I am claiming a full refund for the Kia Piccanto reg NL13 AHC which is currently in your possession and currently available for sale. You have an obligation to refund immediately the initial payment made for this car in January 2024, which has already been verbally agreed multiple times on the telephone yet has failed to materialise.

I look forward to hearing from you within the next 14 days.

Should I not receive a response to my letter within this time frame and having given you sufficient time prior to this letter then I anticipate that court action will be commenced with no further reference to you.

Court documents and evidence have already been prepared will be submitted to the courts on 27/03/2024

Yours faithfully, 

[BreadAndButter]

Still no sign of any contact nor money.

Time to get ready for court claim tomorrow

[BreadAndButter]

Yep, 11th posted here originally and sent out on the 13th recorded

[BreadAndButter]

Defendant - is it the individual or the company Im claiming against?

erm.

I checked google maps it shows a corner of grass

no such address

also nothing on here but a london address match

Access Denied

WWW.PARCELFORCE.COM

So the director is a scam then, one for later.

The only address i can use then is the garage address?

Luckily i sent a notice to both addresses before claim.

Ill send it to the office address in Leicester as thats now the only one i have.

[BreadAndButter]

Initial short statement

Refund of Kia Piccanto NL13 AHC .

I am claiming a full refund for the Kia Piccanto reg NL13 AHC which is currently in your possession and currently available for sale.

You have an obligation to refund immediately the initial payment made for this car in January 2024 Amount outstanding: £3655
 
Requested action: Full Refund.
This should be returned to the original form
of payment: Debit Card.
 
The car was immediately returned when it was found to have multiple faults, within 30 days Under Consumer Rights Act 2015
This refund has not been completed under this act after multiple attempts to make contact and multiple promises.

Ok thats been filed.

So, now onto the detailed POC

 

POC ready but i do not yet know the court

 

XXX County Court

Claim no. Lxxxxxxxxx

 

Between

xxxxxx (claimant)

 and

 Motormart Ltd.

 

Further and Better Particulars of Claim

 

 

1. The claimant purchased a car, Kia Piccanto, for delivery, registration NL13 AHC described as good condition and good working order with MOT over the telephone. He paid the asking price.
2. The car arrived on 12^th January but had multiple issues and was not fit for purpose.
3. The faults included:  The discs and brakes as a whole are rusty, the car juddered heavily under braking and would not stop properly. A wheel nut was missing (dangerous). Cigarette lighter was not working. The Tail would not open properly and the boot cover for the release is missing meaning water can come into the car. There is also an oil leak at the top of the engine and black soot is coming out onto the driveway. None of this fits the original description of the car.
4. Motormart Ltd.accepted the claim and picked up the vehicle on the 15^th January with a note from Richard with all of the faults.
5. As a gesture of goodwill on his part he has put £30 fuel in the car and did not wish for this back.
6. Since then, multiple phone calls have been made in an attempt to retrieve the funds for the car. The claimant was told he would have to wait a long time for this refund, that he was a liar and now the company have blocked his phone calls
7. Family members have since tried to converse with the company but received either verbal abuse themselves and/or blocking of their number also.
8. The company display on google maps a picture of an AA registered garage scheme poster, however they are not registered with the AA after making a formal complaint.
9. The claimant wished for a refund of the returned vehicle which has never been processed.

 

 

I believe that the facts stated above are true

[BreadAndButter]

so i need to send this to the defendant by post?

[BreadAndButter]

ok thats where the process QA confused me it says 

 

Q. If I check that box, when do I send detailed POC?

A. You must send the full POC within 14 days of the claim having been served. You send it to the defendant directly. You must then file a certificate of service with the court within a further 14 days.

 

That contradicts what you say?

 

 

I havent done anything with the FURTHER POC as I dont know the court name

- i guess i upload this to the MCOL if they are sending it to the company

 

 

Edited April 5 by BreadAndButter

[BreadAndButter]

Ive just logged in and its status is 'issued'

but nowhere to add further details of the poc?

[BreadAndButter]

41 minutes ago, BreadAndButter said:

so i need to send this to the defendant by post?

"I will provide the defendant with separate
detailed particulars within 14 days after
service of the claim form."

is on the base of the poc the court has sent them so I guess i must send them on asap

 

[BreadAndButter]

can i clarify the detailed poc must be sent to the defendant If so it needs to go today 24 hour post as time is up tomorrow

 

cheers