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    • Oh I see! thats confusing, for some reason the terms and conditions that Evri posted in that threads witness statement are slightly different than the t&cs on packlinks website. Their one says enter into a contract with the transport agency, but the website one says enter into a contract with paclink. via website: (c) Each User will enter into a contract with Packlink for the delivery of its Goods through the chosen Transport Agency. via evri witness statement in that thread: (c) Each User shall then enter into its own contract with the chosen Transport Agency. Packlink does not have any control over, and disclaims all liability that may arise in contracts between a User and a Transport Agency I read your post at #251, so I should use the second one (and changing the screenshot in the court bundle), since I am saying I have a contract with Evri? Is that correct EDIT: Oh I understand the rest of your conversation. you're saying if I was to do this i would have to fully adjust my ws to use the consumer rights act instead of rights of third parties. In that case should I just edit the terms and stick with the third parties plan?. And potentially if needed just bring up the CRA in the hearing, as you guys did in that thread  
    • First, those are the wrong terms,  read posts 240-250 of the thread ive linked to Second donough v stevenson should be more expanded. You should make refernece to the three fold duty of care test as well. Use below as guidance: The Defendant failed its duty of care to the Claimant. As found in Donoghue v Stevenson negligence is distinct and separate to any breach of contract. Furthermore, as held in the same case there need not be a contract between the Claimant and the Defendant for a duty to be established, which in the case of the Claimant on this occasion is the Defendant’s duty of care to the Claimant’s parcel whilst it is in their possession. By losing the Claimant’s parcel the Defendant has acted negligently and breached this duty of care. As such the Claimant avers that even if it is found that the Defendant not be liable in other ways, by means of breach of contract, should the court find there is no contract between Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant would still have rise to a claim on the grounds of the Defendant’s negligence and breach of duty of care to his parcel whilst it was in the Defendant’s possession, as there need not be a contract to give rise to a claim for breach of duty of care.  The court’s attention is further drawn to Caparo Industries plc v Dickman (1990), 2 AC 605 in which a three fold test was used to determine if a duty of care existed. The test required that: (i) Harm must be a reasonably foreseeable result of the defendant’s conduct; (ii) A relationship of proximity must exist and (iii) It must be fair, just and reasonable to impose liability.  
    • Thank you. here's the changes I made 1) removed indexed statement of truth 2) added donough v Stevenson in paragraph 40, just under the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 paragraph about reasonable care and skill. i'm assuming this is a good place for it? 3) reworded paragraph 16 (now paragraph 12), and moved the t&cs paragraphs below it then. unless I understood you wrong it seems to fit well. or did you want me to remove the t&cs paragraphs entirely? attached is the updated draft, and thanks again for the help. WS and court bundle-1 fourth draft redacted.pdf
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Argos Gift Card Expiry


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Hello there, we have bought Argos e-gift cards (worth of £350 around) and we saved them for a reason to buy a nice gadget for children. Unfortunately, we have not checked the dates and those cards are expired now. Spoken to Argos customer services and they are not helpful.

 

How do I escalate this issue and get the value of cards back. 

 

Let me know should you need more details. thank you 

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I'm afraid that it's highly likely that if the gift cards were sold with an expiry date – then they may be very little you can do. Post up a link to their gift card system and we can have a look.

However you have probably better know that all of these gift cards and vouchers and tokens et cetera which one buys from places like Amazon, Argos – et cetera – are predicated in part on the fact that a certain percentage of people will lose them or not use them and so it becomes money in the bank for the retailer. It's a practice that is really unfair and it should be outlawed.

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Thanks for your swift response.

 

Just to provide further information I have purchased these e-gift cards from completesavings.co.uk and not from Argos directly. 

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Still will you please post up the links – to the place that you bought them from and also the terms and conditions relating to the gift card please.

Secondly, how much trouble you prepared to make about this. I can imagine that Argos have this often and as I say they depend on profits generated by and used gift cards which is disgracefully unfair. I expect they would be prepared to put their heels in – would you be prepared to bring a small claim in the County Court?

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Thanks for your swift response.

 

Just to provide further information I have purchased these e-gift cards from completesavings.co.uk and not from Argos directly. 

 

here is the link where I bought Gift cards https://www.completesavings.co.uk/Benefits/GiftCards

Link for T&C https://www.completesavings.co.uk/terms-and-conditions

 

Thanks for the small claim details, will go through it and come back to you later if I can take this hassle  

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middle man making money out of you and removing the protection that argos give if you purchase them directly.

 

argos send out reminder emails to tell you that the cards are about to expire, they allow you to renew them so it doesn't expire, but you must act.

using a 3rd party middleman removes that AFAIK.

 

you have a total of 540 days to do a chargeback to your bank.

sadly I expect that boat limit has sailed 

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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What a complicated mess it all is. If you had bought these gift cards directly from Argos then I think there would have been a way to reclaim them even in the event of expiry – although it would have been sporty.

Now it is very difficult to see who your contract is with.

It seems to me that you've gone through a succession of brokers. You've gone through a company called Complete Savings – which I can tell you has a pretty poor reputation around the Internet, particularly for taking £15 per month membership from people with apparently many people thinking that it is simply a £15 fee in respect of a particular item. This has been referred to particularly on the Which? Website.

It turns out that Complete Savings are not a British company at all – they're simply the trading name of a Swiss company Webloyalty International SARL which is comfortably out of the jurisdiction of the British courts

Then Complete Savings (Webloyalty) acting as broker for another outfit – who apparently are a "partner"  SVM Europe Ltd ("SVM") (Company number 06748892), registered office Ibex House, Baker Street, Weybridge, Surrey KT13 8AH but trading from Rotherham are roughly speaking brokering  on behalf of various companies but in fact sell you gift cards redeemable at Argos amongst others.

What you have here is a complicated series of companies which all act as barriers to each other, protecting each other – offering benefits if you fulfil their conditions correctly which basically as far as I can make out means buying something every month so that you are getting some value out of your £15 subscription – – otherwise it is all money in the bank for Webloyalty and their partners – and of course for Argos if you happen to lose the vouchers or allow them to expire. And the problem here is tracking down who exactly your contract is with which may be with SVM who themselves have a website which can scarcely be reached if at all www.svmglobal.com . (I expect they like it that way)

I'm afraid it's all about Piggy in the Middle – and you are Piggy.

If this had been directly from Argos then I would have fancied your chances. I think there are some weaknesses in the terms and conditions although they attempt to prevent people recovering from expired gift certificates – but I think I see a way round it.

However, here, it is so tangled it becomes very difficult and although £350 is certainly a worthwhile chunk of cash, it may not be worth taking any further action on it. If you could get me the terms and conditions that you'd entered into when you actually bought the gift vouchers from SVM then maybe we could come up with an idea.

I'm sorry, it sounds very pessimistic. I'm afraid that a much better way to save your money is to put it in a bank account even at the crappy interest rates they pay nowadays. A savings account with anyone of the bank such as Nationwide would have meant that the money was building up for you. It wouldn't expire. You might get a fraction of a percentage of interest. I'm afraid that by buying E vouchers, E coupons, E certificates, E gifts, all you are doing is giving companies an interest-free loan. There is zero benefit to you

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