VCS PCN Claimform - no stopping - spycar CCTV - Liverpool Airport "offence"

[Hobnail]

File a defense?

 

Is this the "start defence" on the MCOL website?

 

Do I start to work through the 7 steps of this?

 

Which perticular claimform thread? I'm struggling to find one relevent to me.

 

Please don't be vague I know nothing about the law.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

[Hobnail]

Came across this...............

 

I would split point 2 so you both keep prohibition but have a catch-all point about anything that stopped a contract being formed.  So

 

1.  The Defendant is the recorded OR registered keeper of *****

2.  The signage is prohibitive in nature and not a genuine offer of a contract for consideration. 

3.  In any case it is denied that the Claimant entered into a contract with the Defendant. 

4.  The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety.  It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

 

Should this form my defence?

[Hobnail]

Is this defence put in a letter to Elms legal?

 

Or put through the MCOL "start defence" button.

 

 

[Hobnail]

If the claim was issued on the 3rd of november is it not too late to file a defence?

 

From what I can gather we had 14 days acording to the MCOL website.

 

Although I thought I had 33 days?

 

Confused.

 

 

[Hobnail]

Yes got it Aos was done so we are okay until the 6th of December.

 

I'll throw a defence together using something from the forum for the MCOL Defence Particulars box and post it here to get some feedback.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hobnail]

Found this.................

 

1.  It is admitted that Defendant is the recorded keeper of [motor vehicle].

 

2.   As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance.  The Claimant was only contracted to provide car park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner.  Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim.  The proper claimant is the landowner

 

3.  It is denied that the Defendant breached any terms and conditions set on private land.

 

4.  It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant, or broke any such contract.

 

5.  The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety.  It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

 

Please delete the one above.

 

How is this?

 

It is admitted that Defendant is the recorded keeper of [motor vehicle].

 

The driver of the vehicle had not been established. None of the photos give any indication of who was driving.

 

It is denied that the Defendant breached any terms and conditions set on private land.

 

It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant, or broke any such contract.

 

The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety.  It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

[Hobnail]

Confused now.

 

I was right first time? or second time?

 

So many pages to trawl through trying to find a relevant one. Both are off the forum and not from anywhere else though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

First one methinks as I edited one for the second attempt.

[Hobnail]

Ok I'm going to post this on the MCOL website as my Defence Particulars.

 

1.  It is admitted that Defendant is the recorded keeper of [motor vehicle].

 

2.   As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance.  The Claimant was only contracted to provide car park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner.  Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim.  The proper claimant is the landowner

 

3.  It is denied that the Defendant breached any terms and conditions set on private land.

 

4.  It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant, or broke any such contract.

 

5.  The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety.  It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

 

Is there anything else I should doing?

 

I did receive a letter from ELMS over the weekend regarding my CPR 31.14 request.

 

They only sent me 3 photos of my partners car stopped at the airport and 5 of the PCN's from VCS.

 

So none of the document requested in our last letter.

 

Should I post it up?

[Hobnail]

I don't do a counter claim do i?

 

What about any aditional details on the MCOL form.

 

They have partners name, addres and d.o.b only.

 

cheers

 

 

So here is the latest letter from Elms responding to my CPR 31.14 request.

 

They also sent me 3 photos of my partners car stopped at the airport and 5 or 6 of the PCN's from VCS.

 

Plus copies of my snotty letter to them and a copy of VCS's letter to us telling us Elms will be dealing with it.

 

I haven't posted them as the PCN's are already in the thread and the letters are just copies.

 

They cannot send requested documents as they don't exsist. No contract.

 

Cheers

 

 

elms reply to CPR.pdf

[Hobnail]

They have aditional info on the defence MCOL form....

 

Telehone number and email.

 

Do I just leave them blank?

 

 

[Hobnail]

I HAVEN'T given them to Elms or VCS. Can they access the MCOL site?

 

So should I give the MCOL site them details of just leave blank?

 

Please be clear.

 

Ta.

 

 

 

[Hobnail]

Ok cool.

 

Defence submitted to MCOL.

 

Should we be doing anything else at this point or wait to see what Elms/VCS do?

 

Witness statement?

 

Thanks

 

[Hobnail]

Ok nice one and cheers for the help.

 

[Hobnail]

Okay so last week we received the N180 from from the C.Court.

 

Proposed allocation to the small claims tracks.

 

Reading the other threads I can see I respond with the following.

 

Mediation - NO

 

Small claims Track - YES

 

Hearing venue - leave blank as they will sent me to my local c.court?

 

Expert evidence - NO

 

Witnesses - ONE

 

Hearing - NO

 

If these are correct my other half should sign and send back to northampton?

 

[Hobnail]

Where do i find local court? Gov.uk?

 

1 to there are using one (omit phone/sig/email - Do you mean one to VCS?

 

1 for you fule - One for our record?

 

Cheers

 

 

 

[Hobnail]

Okay Do I get proof of posting for forms back to CC?

 

And VCS? the same p.o.p?

 

 

[Hobnail]

Okay will post both in the morning.

 

Also today we received the letter below.

 

From reading another thread I see this is standard now to take the legals away from ELMS and take it in house themselves.

 

I'm I right to now just ignore this letter?

 

2021-12-06 Elms no longer acting..pdf

[Hobnail]

All good but do I ignore then?

 

 

[Hobnail]

Jesus I was told to always ask before sending any letters .

 

So this is what I did. So you give me a crappy attitute for no reason.

 

I have been grateful for all the info & help I have received and I HAVE read lots of threads but sometimes they contradict, or are unclear. Hense why I asked for help.

 

You yourself have sometimes given me vague answers so I have had to ask for clarity on more than one ocassion.

 

If you don't wish to help ignore my post and let someone else answer. Other help has always been much clearer anyway.

 

You have a bad attitute to be working for a help service.

 

 

 

 

 

[Hobnail]

Ok so after I updated and showed my missus, DX's recent replies

 

"she will have a very difficult time understanding and explaining everything infront of and to a judge"

 

and

 

"but if it doesn't sink in...i dread to think of her chances...."

 

My other half has crumbled and will not go to court. Would have been difficult to get her to go anyway and we hoped it would not get this far. Nothing I can do to persuade her now.

 

So does anyone else think it worthwhile to contact VCS (direct or through mediate on the N180 form) to negotiate the figure down from £185 to say the original £100.

 

Or are we on our own now?

Edited December 8, 2021 by dx100uk

[Hobnail]

My other half received the following letter today in the post.

 

Thought at first they had not received her Small Claims Track questionaire that we sent back on the 9th of December 2021.

 

But it looks like a copy of a letter sent to VCS ltd.

 

It would seem they have not returned their N180 form, as it says the Order is to The Claimant.

 

I recon it could be good news but thought I would clarify?

 

2022-01-12 court order for VCS N180.pdf

[Hobnail]

Yes that is what the letter is saying. Looks like they have until the 17th Jan.

 

Do you think they have just forgot or is this some sort of ploy?

 

Cheers for the help.

 

[Hobnail]

Had two lettes recently. See attached.

 

Looks like court (date set for May) and seeing as my missus will not go to court would I best be advised to negotiate a lower amount?

 

A counter reduced settlement charge (see VCS letter) or at least wait until after the 13th April to see if VCS pay the court fee?

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

 

 

N157+VCS begging letter.pdf

[Hobnail]

Okay we will wait to see if he pays the court fee by the 13th april.

 

Court is set for  the 11th of May.

 

If he pays th fee then I will try to get a lower amount.

 

Thanks

 

[Hobnail]

I cannot edit.

 

Could a admin take down the second pdf for me. Cheers.