Help would be appreciated - False claims by DWP and mishandling

[CBLB2012]

First off I'm new and apologise if I am posting this out of context of the forum and in the wrong section.

 

OK a little bit of a back story.

 

I made a claim for jca in may of this year for myself and my wife. Everything was fine until i had an appointment in June this year, the day before said appointment I became ill so my wife phoned the jobcentre to explain this and was told a reschedule of the appointment would be made and i'd have to fill out a sickness form.

 

On attending my next singing date I was instructed by the person signing me that my account had been closed so I wasn't able to sign on. Asking for an explanation of why my account was closed i was told it was for not attending an arranged appointment. I asked what appointment it was as I've only missed one and explained when it was and the reasons I missed it, also mentioned the fact my wife had rang more than 24hrs before to explain my illness to them.

 

I was told that he had no idea what appointment as his just telling me what his computer screen is telling him. He then gave me a phone number to phone (not sure if i can post numbers?) and told me that they would know more. When ringing the number they explained that i had missed the appointment when i was ill, I explained to them that my wife had in fact phoned before hand to let them know I was ill. The person on the phone said they had no record of this so they went ahead and closed my claim down after five days. I asked for an explanation of five days as i was unsure of what he meant. He avoided the question and went back to to saying they have no record of my wife phoning them. I was not happy with this so asked to speak to a supervisor or manager, he then hung up on me.

 

Straight away i phoned back and connected with a different person I asked to speak to a supervisor or manager. Was put on hold and finally spoke to a manager. I asked for an explanation as to why my account was closed as I now believed that the jobcentre had made a mistake in not recording my wifes telephone conversation and also to complain about being hung up on. No explanation was giving although she said she would ring me back in three hours or less to tell me why the mistake happened and also in regards to my complaint.

 

No phone call back but received a letter a few days later apologising for the way i was treated in my first phone call.

Still unhappy with no explanation I decide to take it up face to face at my jobcentre. On arriving I ask to speak to someone who could help me with the mishandling of my claim. I was made to wait for almost 30 minutes to see someone.

 

I sat down explained everything to him in how someone made a mistake over the phonecall. He told me people claim to make phonecalls all the time after not attending appointments etc. I asked him if he was calling me a lier he said no, so i said his admitting to the jobcentres mistake then to which he also said no. now I'm confused i'm not a lier but they never made a mistake? I asked what they are going to do about my claims of mishandling my account. he got me to fill out an appeal for backdated money/complaint. I asked for a pen to fill it out he then told me to move tables to fill it out as he had another client to deal with at 10:45( if i remember correctly) I asked shouldn't he be dealing with me first? to which he replied if i'm finished by 10:45 he will.He then accuses me of being abusive and aggressive towards. I ask how his come to that conclusion to be told its his opinion. So I ask hows his come to that opinion he told me the manner in which i was acting. All this time i'm sat back in a chair speaking in a calm and collective manner. I swore once but apologised straight away and explained i was frustrated. I move to another table fill out the form and right the complaint. During this time his left his desk so I wait for him to return. He does I Give him the the form and complaint and ask what is going to be done about it. he told me his dealing with another client now so i would have to go back to the other table. to fill out the form properly i do this and once again when I've finished his gone, but what i presume to be his next client is sat at his table, i go over place the forms on his desk and leave.

 

still not happy with no explanation and becoming frustrated at the way i'm being treated I ring the jobcentre the next day to ask to speak to the manager. He would not give me a straight answer on anything I asked him always replied could or maybe answers, but he said if i can provide proof from BT that my wife made the call he would look into it, I explained that that doesn't help my family's financial situation at the present time. He told me to go for a crisis loan. So I said when i tell them my crisis is for the DWP's mistake there not going to give me one are they. He told me its not his decision.

 

The day after I phoned CAB and explained all of the above to them. They told me to follow everything they told me to do by doing a reclaim and also that they shouldn't be asking me for proof of the phonecall that the jobcentre should prove to me that the phonecall never took place.

 

I then phoned the manager again and explained what CAB told me, but that i was happy to prove the phonecall was made anyways just for peace of mind on my behalf, but I couldn't do this straight away as BT hadn't processed my bill yet. (I phoned BT before speaking to CAB to be told this.)

 

That the basic story. Also should mention that the manager told me i'd likely win my appeal for backdate as they hadn't notified me of writing to let me know they was closing my claim, I did mention why I have not been told my claim was closed. Since speaking to the manager a second time i have received two letters from them, one being my P45 (but no letter to say they've closed my claim)

and another which goes as follows. (I'll withhold names/dates/locations as i'm not sure its allowed)

 

Dear Mr xxxxxxx

 

I refer to our discussion on the xx/xx/xx regarding your claim to jobseekers allowance.

I am also writing regarding your attendance at xxxxxxx jobcentre plus on that day and also on the xx/xx/xx

 

We closed your claim to jobseekers allowance because you failed to attend an appointment on xx/xx/xx

 

you have told us that your wife contacted us xx/xx/xx. You have agreed to provide evidence of this phonecall. As we discussed in our telephone conversation on the xx/xx/xx,

if your wife did contact us on the xx/xx/xx, you clearly have not received the level of service that you have a right to expect.

 

I am sorry if we have made a mistake in closing down your claim.

 

I am very concerned about to learn that staff at xxxxxx jobcentre were upset by your

attitude when you attended the office on xx/xx/xx and xx/xx/xx. Your manner

was unacceptably aggressive and this behaviour is clearly getting in the way of

our efforts to help you back into work.

 

I am keen to the we re-establish a professional relationship with the staff here at

xxxxxx jobcentre, and that you understand that people working for jobcentre plus have the right

to be able to carry out their work free from intimidation.

 

We are committed to treating you in a fair and polite manner. In return I expect you to treat us in the

same way. Therefore, I trust that you will make sure that this type of incident does not happen again.

 

For your information I am enclosing a copy of the leaflet, 'our service standards', which sets out your

responsibilities to us.

 

If you would like to speak to me about this letter please ring xxxxx xxxxxx during office hours

 

Yours sincerely

xxxxx xxxxxxxx

customer service manager

xxxxxx jobcentre.

 

 

 

 

*NOW I SHOULD ALSO NOTE*

Having signed on a few years back and having had terrible dealings with the DWP in the past i decided this time to record all verbal meetings with the jobcentre be it face to face or over the phone, including all of the above.

 

Now throughout my time i have remained calm all but once when i swore out of frustration not anger and i apologised straight away.

 

So you can imagine my surprise in receiving that letter.

I would very much like some pointers in how or what i can do to sort this matter out as I'm being accused of something I haven't done. Also can i use the recordings to prove this?

Can I request CCTV to back up my claim that i was calm, What information do they hold on me( will they have tagged me as a troublemaker now?)

 

I still haven't had an explanation on how my claim could of been closed ( I suspect i'll receive some letter when i show then proof)

Can they treat me this way?

Should I take this all the way or forget about it?

 

 

Really haven't a clue where to start all help would be most useful

 

many thanks

 

CBLB2012

[CBLB2012]

Sorry for the poor grammar and spelling mistakes, its late and i'm tired.

 

Spent too much time on here reading other peoples experiences with the DWP and the government in general

[hensteeth]

Sorry for the poor grammar and spelling mistakes, its late and i'm tired.

 

Spent too much time on here reading other peoples experiences with the DWP and the government in general

 

That is disgusting, but not surprising.

 

I would tell you to forget the running around they are asking of you and go straight to your MP.

 

Quite honestly, you will be waiting weeks for any money if you allow them to get away with this - appeals, decisions, new claim, etc etc.

 

If what you are saying is the truth, it is they, the DWP that are at fault and will want to ensure that you are blamed for it.

 

As I have said, go and see your MP at his/her next surgery, taking with you copies of your letters, their letters and a print off of your post on here and tell him/her that you want this sorted out pronto!

[ErikaPNP]

I agree that seeing your MP is a good idea - you don't need to wait for his/her next surgery, you can contact him or her by phone, letter, or email and if they want to see copies of correspondence, you can arrange a private appointment with him or her.

 

However you do need immediate financial assistance in the meantime whilst this is dealt with. Do make a new claim whilst you are appealing/complaining against the closure of this one. If your appeal is successful, you would get the backdated monies but in the meantime you have nothing to live on so a new claim is important. As soon as you have made your new claim (by phone if possible as it will be quicker), call crisis loans and apply for a Crisis Loan, stating that you need it as an alignment to benefit. Crisis Loans which are given as an alignment to benefit are not affected by and not counted in the 3 awards rule (a person can only have 3 loans in a rolling 12 month period).

 

I would also encourage you to apply for financial redress for maladministration - raise this within the body of your complaint. More information on this by clicking here

 

The phone bill here is your secret weapon because once you show that you called a departmental number on that date it is then up to them to locate the details of that phone call, which should at the very least be on the notes of your computerised records. If they have no trace of that call but you have a bill showing you called them, then they have little choice but to accept that the details of the phone call were as you have stated.

 

You are correct to with hold personal information from the letter - this protects both you and CAG.

 

In terms of recordings, this is an awkward area really. There is no law that prevents you from covertly recording another individual as such, the laws relate to how such a covert recording may be used. If this were before a court, it would be at the court's discretion whether or not the recording could be admitted into evidence.

 

You could certainly advise them that you have been recording them and have evidence that your behavior was not as they say it was however, be aware that DWP don't like these devices being used in JCP offices because there is always a risk that such a device can pick up discussions between other claimants and their advisors. If they know you are using one, they may well try and get you to agree to stop using it and if you don't, they may seek an injunction to prevent you from entering JCP premises.

 

For the CCTV yes, you can submit a SAR for a copy of this to be sent to you - they have 40 days to comply. They may be reluctant over it - again because it may show other individuals going about their business and you are only entitled to data held about yourself however others here on CAG have successfully obtained CCTV data on themselves not only in DWP but in other places.

 

I hope this helps for now but in the meantime if you have any questions or need further information please just ask - and do keep us posted. Outcomes posted on here helps others who find themselves in similar situations at a later date.

[CBLB2012]

Thanks for the replys.

 

I think i'll contact my mp also how would i go about letting them know that Iam disputing their claims? In writing I gather is best?

 

How should I word this letter?

Should I inform them of my recordings?

Who would I address the letter to?

 

I think from information gathered from here, would it be best to apply for an audit trail, so I can see how they come to the conclussion of my aggression?

 

It seems that if a person claims any sort of wrong doing by the DWP that they use the tactic of saying that person has been aggressive