Adult on child ticket FGW/TPE - ** SETTLED **

[johnvic]

Hi

 

I'm 16, will be 17 in the coming weeks. I was caught travelling on a child ticket on the return leg of my journey recently (TOC was First Transpennine Express), and the RPI wouldn't excess my ticket, so I had my name, address, dob, etc taken down in his notebook.

 

He advised that I would receive a letter from the Prosecutions dept.

 

Should I pre-emptively write to the department offering to pay the fare+admin costs or should I await the letter?

 

Also, what region should I be looking at for the total cost with admin fee (just an estimate)? It was approx £28 for the child return, so the adult fare would have been double that.

 

Also, what timeframe should I be awaiting a letter in? I rang the Prosecutions dept yesterday and was told it 'may take 2-3weeks' but I've seen up to 6 months on CAG?

 

As irrelevant as it is, I did genuinely believe that 16 year olds could travel on a child ticket, but I accept it was my fault for not checking and at the first opportunity will offer my unmitigated apologies to FGW(?) for this.

 

I was issued a Zero-Fare excess for the journey and had my ticket retained by the rpi. The reverse of the zero-fare says that the original ticket was kept due to a ticketing irregularity.

 

I can't have a criminal record for my future career, hence why I am keen to ensure this doesn't go to court and I plan to outline this in the letter I send to FGW.

 

Thanks for your help.

[sailor sam]

I would await the letter to sere what their position is. They will no doubt ask you for an explanation to which you can offer what you have said above. Be as remorseful as you can saying that it was purely down to your ignorance of the age restrictions.

 

If it's you first 'offence', I doubt that they will prosecute.

[johnvic]

Will do, and yeah it's my first 'offence' and my first run-in with the law.

 

Anyone got any views on: "Also, what region should I be looking at for the total cost with admin fee (just an estimate)? It was approx £28 for the child return, so the adult fare would have been double that.

 

Also, what timeframe should I be awaiting a letter in? I rang the Prosecutions dept yesterday and was told it 'may take 2-3weeks' but I've seen up to 6 months on CAG?"

[Stigy]

Because of your age, it's unlikely you'll be taken to court over this, as TOCs seldon use Youth Courts. If you were 17 a three quarters or above, you could have been summons to attend big boy court, as you would have been 18 by the hearing date. As has been said, awair FTP's letter to see what they intend to do, but it'll more than likely be a slap on the wrist and an administrative penalty, plus the difference in the fare avoided.

[johnvic]

Do you think it'll come addressed to me, or "To the parent or guardian of _________" as I have yet to inform the dearest parents as they're on holiday at the moment!

[firstclassx]

Firstly, I am quite sure you knew what you were doing. The fact you mention being "excessed", which is a fairly specific industry term, implies (to me) that you've had this issue before, but regardless of this, it makes little difference to the end result.

 

If you have purchased the ticket from a self-service ticket machine then it makes it even more likely that you will face some pretty heavy consequences. Additionally, if you initially provided a false DOB or address then it makes it even worse.

 

Firstly, the letter will be addressed to your parent/guardian. In the unlikely event that it isn't, then you must ensure you show your parent or guardian immediately, as an out of court settlement isn't guaranteed, and you may find yourself in court.

 

Secondly, the "amount" to settle out of court is likely to be between £150 and £300. However, as you are a youth, another option could be offered, where you to attend an interview with a prosecutor, with a parent, for a stern talking to, and being given an internal reprimand and probably charged a small admin fee around £50-£75. The TOC is not obliged to offer an out of court settlement, although it is good practice to take steps for an alternative disposal.

 

Finally, your parents may want to review the following:

 

Section 5(3a) of the Regulation of Railways Act 1889

Railway Byelaw 18(1) - derived from S219 - Transport Act 2000

 

You should only find yourself in Youth Court if:

 

1) You did not co-operate fully with the Inspector or conductor at the time of the incident, i.e. false details/ bad attitude.

2) You do not pay the out of court settlement or attend an interview, if offered.

3) You commit a similar offence in the future, or have previously been reported for the offence.

Edited June 24, 2012 by firstclassx

[johnvic]

Firstly, I am quite sure you knew what you were doing. The fact you mention being "excessed", which is a fairly specific industry term, implies (to me) that you've had this issue before, but regardless of this, it makes little difference to the end result.

 

If you have purchased the ticket from a self-service ticket machine then it makes it even more likely that you will face some pretty heavy consequences. Additionally, if you initially provided a false DOB or address then it makes it even worse.

 

Firstly, the letter will be addressed to your parent/guardian. In the unlikely event that it isn't, then you must ensure you show your parent or guardian immediately, as an out of court settlement isn't guaranteed, and you may find yourself in court.

 

Secondly, the "amount" to settle out of court is likely to be between £150 and £300. However, as you are a youth, another option could be offered, where you to attend an interview with a prosecutor, with a parent, for a stern talking to, and being given an internal reprimand and probably charged a small admin fee around £50-£75. The TOC is not obliged to offer an out of court settlement, although it is good practice to take steps for an alternative disposal.

 

Finally, your parents may want to review the following:

 

 

You should only find yourself in Youth Court if:

 

1) You did not co-operate fully with the Inspector or conductor at the time of the incident, i.e. false details/ bad attitude.

2) You do not pay the out of court settlement or attend an interview, if offered.

3) You commit a similar offence in the future, or have previously been reported for the offence.

 

Thanks for your reply,

 

This is my first 'offence', I knew the term excess because a) the RPI issued one to my friend on the same train, and b) I've been researching this (hence how I found CAG train section).

 

I'm not sure if this constitutes bad attitude, but the reason the RPI didn't issue an excess is because when he told me I could 'xs'(as i heard) my ticket I asked him what that meant, he said it meant I could 'xs' it, I again asked the meaning, and he explained and told me he was no longer prepared to issue one. I'm sure it'll be mentioned in the statement, but I (hope) think it wasn't major enough to warrant any additional punitive measure or addition to the settlement if offered.

 

But heyho, no point in worrying anymore, I've started saving, and there's nothing more I can do until the letter arrives.

 

Thanks all for your replies, I shall update when the letter comes.

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

By all means come back to us when the letter arrives and hopefully someone will tell you what to put in the letter. The tone of what you send will be important.

 

My best, HB

[johnvic]

My friend recieved their penalty 2 weeks ago, so I rang the pros dept yesterday. It turned out I wasn't on their system and they had lost my report somewhere in a pile, they found it and set me a letter out 1st class. Letter does not state a specific statue or byelaw, merely 'did not pay the correct fare for the journey made'.

 

The matter has settled with predjudice, to the amount of: the excess of train ticket + admin costs of £20.

 

Sorted.

 

Can a mod edit the thread title to indicate a settlement has been reached please

Edited August 14, 2012 by johnvic

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

Thank you for letting us know, I'll amend your thread title.

 

fwiw, if you want to contact the mods, click on the black triangle on the relevant post. I happened to see this request, but it's faster to let the team know via the triangle.

 

Take care, HB