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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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A bit lost & confused!


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Hi everybody,

 

This is my 1st post although have been reading avidly through others.

 

I sent the preliminary letter (16th March) and also the follow up one (30th March) to Nationwide with no response, although over the weekend I received £80 back into my account, I received a letter finally today which is the same standard one that everyone else seems to be getting where they stated the £80 was a good will gesture. I dont know what to do now though, should I ignore it and try and claim against them? Or is the law different in Northern Ireland, I've noticed that is states quite clearly over this site that it's english law and I'm not sure where I stand being in Northern Ireland?

 

I'm getting really confused reading through all the information on the templates page too and dont really understand how to complete the next stage,

 

Any advice is greatly welcomed!

 

Cath

Build a bridge and get over it!

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Hi

 

I am new here too and just about to start the battle. Somewhere on here - round near the FAQs is a Step by Step Guide posting. I have been reading avidly and I am sure it says something along the lines of, accept all monies offered but advise them that you will be claiming the full amount. I think it said verbally (perhaps if they offered you the part refund verbally) and in writing.

 

It is worth having a look for the the Step by Step instructions posting as it is very helpful. If I can find it, I will post again pointing you to it.

 

Good luck.

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If you get any money without strings then take whatever you can get. If it is with strings then only take it if you want to be bound.

 

Not a problem being NI. Only the procedure changes. Have a look at the NI court service linked in the library.

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Cheers all!

 

I did phone them last friday as they didnt tell me why I got the £80 back until 2 days ago and they said it was goodwill so I advised them I would be proceeding further for the full amount. I received a letter today saying they where passing my intial emails to some other department, so will just sit back and wait now. Court action isnt due to start till 13/04 so will keep you posted.

 

Thanks again

Cath

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Hi everyone

 

I was suppose to start my court action against Nationwide yesterday but received a letter from a different department than all the other letters. This letter is from member services basically states that she is investigating my claim as the next step from customer services, if i'm not happy with her I have to go to Financial Ombudsman. It says in the letter though that she's allowed 8 weeks to do this, so am completely confused as to what to do.

 

Should I give her 8 weeks and see what she says or should I proceed as I have already given them 28 days (the preliminary letter & follow up).

 

Thanks for the advice guys I really want to nail these 'beeps' lmao

 

Thanks

Cath

Build a bridge and get over it!

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If you have given them 2X2 weeks to action your request then proceed with your claim. They are trying to derail your timetable...and you don't want that to happen.

 

Good luck.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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They have 8 weeks to investigate a complaint as allowed by the Ombudsman.

 

You didn't make a complaint - you requested your money back.

 

If you gave 14 days - in accordance with the CPR's - then, if it were me, I would follow the threat through.

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Advice & opinions of Dave, The Bank Action Group and The Consumer Action Group are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability.

Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified insured professional if you have any doubts.

 

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Your claim, your deadlines.

 

Don't let them take control, or they'll run rings round you till you give up or die, whichever comes first.

 

To give you an example, I just got a letter yesterday from Cust Svces at Halifax giving themselves till 10th May to deal with my complaint... 2 days after their legal dept settled my total claim out of court! (it makes me laugh every time I think of it:D )

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"I need to give you details of the Financial Ombudsman Service and I've enclosed their most recent leaflet, which you may find useful.You'll notice if you decide to pursue your concerns with the Ombudsman, you should do so within the next six months."

 

Was "Our approach to applying charges is in accordance with the Banking Code and is also in line with other financial institutions." mentioned ? Followed by "In light of this, and as our charges are levied in an appropriate and transparent manner, we regret that we can't agre to refund the charges incurred on your account. You did after all, accept this (as part of the terms and conditions) when you opened your account."

 

Talk about trying to send people in the wrong direction.

Fiduciary?

I think not.

Dave

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Ha Dave that sounds like the letter I received from Nationwide yesterday morning, they are completely defending their charges, well everywhere here (NI) is closed until wednesday morning, so will be proceeding with the courts then. Actually there letter has really riled me so cant wait!!! Bring em on

 

Goodluck & thanks to all

Cath

Build a bridge and get over it!

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They all seem to be creating a new "Put them off" book of excuses and statements.

 

Maybe this is an opportunity for me to get some more print business!!!

..

.

 

Opinions given herein are made informally by myself as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice, you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

 

 

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They all seem to be creating a new "Put them off" book of excuses and statements.

It is also a good opportunity for us to gather all these excuses into one place, and create an 'objection handling' FAQ...I'll volunteer, but it isn't going to happen in the next couple of days...

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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It appears to me that the best way to get action from Nationwide is sent all correspondence regarding your claim to Charles Bacon by recorded delivery. He is obviously aware of the legalities of the situation and there will no conflicting messages from different parts of customers services (sic)

Brian

Claim against Nationwide

6 years charges £1973

prelim letter 10 April

Charges refunded 15 April

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  • 3 weeks later...

I merged the 'starting claim tomorrow' thread with this one - they were both dealing with the same claim :)

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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  • 12 years later...

This topic was closed on 03/07/19.

If you have a problem which is similar to the issues raised in this topic, then please start a new thread and you will get help and support there.

If you would like to post up some information which is relevant to this particular topic then please flag the issue up to the site team and the thread will be reopened.

- Consumer Action Group

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