Advice Please

[greyhound advocate]

I am hoping someone can advice me as to where i stand legally.

 

I purchased a 2006 Vauxhall Corsa on 5 November 2010, which clearly stated on their website (which i have printed off) that the car came with a service history. On viewing the car and requesting the service history i was advised that as the car had only been received by the dealer two days previously they were awaiting the documentation and it would be forwarded to me on receipt.

 

On 4 December 2010, one day from one month of purchasing the car, i started to have problems but the dealer failed to respond to my phone calls and e-mails and due to the adverse weather i could not travel to the dealer. Today i managed to get the car recovered and a diagnostics test carried out and i have been left with a bill of in excess of £400 for the repairs alone.

 

I was asked about the service history but explained the background and was advised these repairs should not have been necessary if the car had a current service history but i can get no response from the dealer who sold me the car so it would be appreciated if you could advise me if there is any recourse i can follow up with the dealer?

 

Thank you in advance for any advise you can provide.

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Hi and welcome to CAG.

 

Can you tell us exactly what you said in your emails and have you got paper copies?

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Hi Sailor Sam

 

Thank you for your response.

 

I originally requested the promised serving documentation reminding them that the car was advertised as such - no response.

 

I followed up, after advice from Trading Standards, quoting the Sale of Goods Act as the car to be sold not as advertised. Prior to this i did telephone and was adviced by one of the sales staff they would let the salesman know and get him to contact me but they have just ignored me to date.

 

I do have hard copies of the e-mails and ensure i called the garage from my mobile so they cannot deny i called.

 

Thanks again

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Ok, your problem is that under the SOGA the seller should have the opportunity to inspect and rectify any faults which occur within the first 6 months of ownership before yopu arrange any repairs yourself. By doing so, you give the seller the opportunity to dispute the costs. However, you appear to have a claim that the car was not as advertised. At this stage you should write formally to the seller that as he has so far not provided the service history, you consider that the car has been miss-sold. In addition, the car has developed a fault within 1 month of ownership and due to circumstances beyond your control, you were unable to return the car to them and as such you have obtained a independant report which suggests that the car is not of satisfactory quality. You therefore offer the opportunity to the seller to either; A) recover the car and rectify the defects to a satisfactory quality as per pre-sale condition. B) Allow you to arrange repairs yourself and agree to cover the cost in full. C) Accept the car back and refund all monies paid for the purchase of.

 

Give a time limit of 7 days to respond with their intentions indicating that you reserve the right to refer the matter to trading standards and/or institute legal proceedings after that time. send by recorded delivery and keep a copy. Let us know if and when anything happens.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Thank you Sailor Sam.

 

We managed to contact the salesman today and i have to phone back tomorrow morning.

 

The faults found on the car were the accelerator cable had gone and the voltage on the battery was wrong, which had consequently damaged the electrics.

 

The dealer said today that i should have given them the opportnity to rectify the faults but after 3 phone calls and 3 e-mail messages, i received no response or no return calls. They are saying there internet connection has been down and that no message was passed on to the salesman concerned. As i was paying £25 per day to work and an additional 3 hours travelling on train/bus, how long did they expect me to wait? the whole point of buying the car was to have something reliable to get me to and from work.

 

I admit i went ahead and had the car repaired, pick it up tomorrow, as i could not wait any longer for the dealer to contact me - surely two weeks should have been sufficient time.

 

Where do i stand in relation to the car being repaired without them having seen it, remembering they had made no repsonse to my attempts to contact them over two weeks and i could not drive the car to the garage as the roads were blocked due to severe weather?

 

I will have to see what they say when i phone back in the morning, any idea of what my arguement should be, considering they have also failed to present me with the doumentation for a supposed car with a service history?

 

Thanks for your timely responses Sailor Sam, much appreciated.

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Sorry but i've only just managed to come on. Probably a tad late now but I would use the 'have tried to contact you a few times both by e-mail and phone without success' angle. I would certainly ask them to re-inburse me the repair charges so far adding my extreme dissapointment that I still havn't got the service history as advertised.

 

Please let us know what happened.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

No Need to apologise Sailor Sam, i am just grateful for your advice and understand advice cannot always be replied to immediately.

 

I did call the garage back and they are not interested, their stance is the Sale of Goods Act works both ways and as far as they are concerned i should have given them fair oppirtunity to inspect the car and carry out any repairs so they are not interested.

 

I will write to them anyway by recorded delivery and intend to progress this legally as a matter of pronciple - surely 10 days waiting for a response is reasonable but as far as they are concerned their internet was not down and messages had not been relayed to the relevant individual so it's not their fault.

 

I sure wouldn't advise anyone to buy a car from this garage, instead to stay well clear of them, most unhelpful and quite arrogant.

 

GA

[sailor sam]

No Need to apologise Sailor Sam, i am just grateful for your advice and understand advice cannot always be replied to immediately.

 

I did call the garage back and they are not interested, their stance is the Sale of Goods Act works both ways and as far as they are concerned i should have given them fair oppirtunity to inspect the car and carry out any repairs so they are not interested.

 

I will write to them anyway by recorded delivery and intend to progress this legally as a matter of pronciple - surely 10 days waiting for a response is reasonable but as far as they are concerned their internet was not down and messages had not been relayed to the relevant individual so it's not their fault.

 

I sure wouldn't advise anyone to buy a car from this garage, instead to stay well clear of them, most unhelpful and quite arrogant.

 

GA

 

I wonder whose fault they think it is then!

 

yes I would agree that 10 days would be a reasonable time to expect a response which is what you need to include in your 'particulars of claim' should you have to progress this via the small claims court. As far as I see this, you have couple of options; You could reject the car on the basis that it was miss-sold due to the lack of service history. Taking this route of course, would risk loosing the £400 you have paid to have it repaired because nothing is guarenteed in court. However, you should still include this in the claim because a reasonable judge is likley to award it. Another option is to persue the seller for the repair costs which I believe would have a good chance of success also because of the lack of reponse from the seller when reporting the fault. Yes, he will no doubt quote his version of the SOGA but i think the 10 days issue will kill that argument. Which ever option you choose, the importnat thing will be evidence so you will need copies of all emails which you have sent, any copies of advertsising showing that the car had 'full service history' and all copies of further correspondence. So any future corespondence should only done in writing. If you choose to reject the car, you must not drive it after sending the letter of rejection.

 

So now you have to decide which option you wish to take. Personally, I would reject it because consider the problems you may have with this dealer in the furture.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Thank you again Sailor Sam.

 

Would you be willing to look over the letter i have drafted, which i will be sending to the garage on Monday, to check if i have missed anything?

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Thank you again Sailor Sam.

 

Would you be willing to look over the letter i have drafted, which i will be sending to the garage on Monday, to check if i have missed anything?

 

GA

 

Yes, not a problem. I'm hoping Conniff will take a look also to see what he thinks.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Excuse my ignorance but do i just post a copy of the letter on here or do i have to send it privately? Sorry unsure of the etiquette on the forum.

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Remove all your personal details (as well as the seller's) from the letter and post here.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Here goes - hope it makes sense, let me know if there is too much detail.

 

XXXXXXX

xxxxxxxxx

The Manager

XXXXXXXX

XXXXXXXX

XXXXXXXX 13 December 2010

Dear Sir Madam

Vauxhall Corsa Registration XXXXXX

I purchased the above detailed vehicle from you on 5 November 2010, which within one month of purchase proved to be of unsatisfactory quality due to the failure of the accelerator throttle pedal.

As a result of the severe weather conditions and being unable to return the car to you I telephoned twice during 1-3 December 2010 to be told XXXXX was with a customer/didn’t know where he was and that he would call me back but to date there has been no response. I made these calls using my mobile to ensure they can be evidenced.

I followed these calls up by e-mail on 7/9/10 December 2010, again no response. I have since gathered there was a loss of internet connection but I find this unacceptable as a business, e-mails can be checked and followed up by alternative methods.

As explained at time of purchase, the car needed to be reliable as it was to be used for commuting to and from work daily. For a period of one week I had to resort to public transport which was not only unreliable but averaging 5-6 hours daily, which was not acceptable. In the meantime I gave you fair opportunity to respond to my communications, which you failed to do.

I was left with no alternative but to repair the car at my own cost, which had sat unused for a period of ten days. As I live in a rural area and the car was undriveable it had to be recovered. In addition the vehicle battery was found to be of the wrong voltage when diagnostics was carried out and therefore also had to be replaced.

The car was also advertised with a service history, which you have failed to provide evidence of to date and therefore it appears was misrepresented, as detailed in the Sale of Goods Act, at the time of sale. I was told at the time of purchase, this would be forwarded onto me along with any additional keys which were handed in, again my requests for evidence have been ignored.

On my third attempt of trying to contact you today (11 December 2010) as XXX had been unavailable, I was advised that XXXXXX had no intention of reimbursing the sum of £475.00 for the repair of the vehicle.

I have now been legally advised that as I repaired the car myself, this does not negate your responsibility for the vehicle within the Sale of Goods Act, only that you could dispute the costs.

I can only assume that failure to contact me was as a result of the one month warranty you provided was within days of expiring but I understand from Trading Standards that the vehicle, having not been owned for in excess of six months, will automatically be presumed to have had the fault at time of purchase and it is your responsibility to prove otherwise if you refute this claim.

If I have not received a response within seven days then I will have been left with no alternative but to progress this in the small claims court.

Yours faithfully

[sailor sam]

Very good as far as i'm concerned. Hopefully Conniff will appear and give his input before Monday. I take it you have decided not to reject the car then.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Hi Sailor Sam

 

The problem is my communte to work is an 80 mile round trip each day and with public transport unrelaible in such a rural area, i have no alterntive mode of transport should i chose to return the car - how long will it take to refund my money, find another car? It's a catch 22 - also with the repairs, the garage reckons i shouldn't have any further problems.

 

You have been a great help with your responses and it is very much appreciated.

[greyhound advocate]

Just to update you Sailor Sam.

 

I spoke to Consumer Direct today and was advised to write a brief letter simply stating i was claiming consequential losses due to the car not being of a satisfactory quality/not fit for purpose. It appears i was within my rights under the Sale of Goods Act to have the car repaired, not only because they failed to respond to my communications but because it caused me great inconvenience.

 

I will keep you updated as to whether the dealer responds or settles my claim but if not i have every intention of taking this to court.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Just to update you Sailor Sam.

 

I spoke to Consumer Direct today and was advised to write a brief letter simply stating i was claiming consequential losses due to the car not being of a satisfactory quality/not fit for purpose. It appears i was within my rights under the Sale of Goods Act to have the car repaired, not only because they failed to respond to my communications but because it caused me great inconvenience.

 

I will keep you updated as to whether the dealer responds or settles my claim but if not i have every intention of taking this to court.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

GA

 

Consumer Direct (with the greatest respect) advise according to the SOGA. It is only when it gets to court that the SOGA can actually be applied and subsiquent compensation awarded in respect of consiquential losses. Such action has to be initiated by the claimant at their own expence. Obviously a sucessfull claim normally means that you recover your costs in bringing a claim. However, where there is a case of a trader incurring a number of complaints then Trading Standards may take action themselves. The point I am trying to make is that basically taking court action yourself poses financial risks, even if you win your claim and unfortunately rouge traders know this.

 

I believe in my post #8, i refered to this and also indicated that due to the lack of response you were entitled to have the car repaired and had an argument to do so. Persoanlly I think the letter you have compiled will be suffice as there is also the issue of the car being miss-sold. What did Consumer Direct say about that?

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[Conniff]

The letter looks fine to me also. Can I assume that it has been posted ?

 

If this is a small dealer and not a large national, then Sams comments about what happens after a successfull court claim is very relevent and even though you may win, there is always the chance that the dealer will totally ignore the court and not pay you anyway.

You do need to be aware of that and the fact that you might have to put some funds upfront to pay for enforcement of the judgement. Lets hope it never gets that far.

[greyhound advocate]

Hi Conniff

 

Thank you for your input.

 

I posted the letter on Monday, 13 December 2010 by recorded delivery, but as yet it has not been delivered as there are still postal delays due to the weather.

 

The garage is a large second hand dealer, which takes cars in from main dealers to sell on. Budget ranges from £2000-£50,000. It's not a garage where the salesmen are on commission but get a decent salary no matter how many cars they sell each week - but they do average moving 25-30 cars per week.

 

I doubt very much they will pay up, just a feeling i got from the arrogant salesman when i eventually managed to contact him. two weeks after my original complaint. They have still failed to respond to my e-mails for the service history also so i seriously need to consider my options now.

 

GA

[sailor sam]

Hi Conniff

 

Thank you for your input.

 

I posted the letter on Monday, 13 December 2010 by recorded delivery, but as yet it has not been delivered as there are still postal delays due to the weather.

 

The garage is a large second hand dealer, which takes cars in from main dealers to sell on. Budget ranges from £2000-£50,000. It's not a garage where the salesmen are on commission but get a decent salary no matter how many cars they sell each week - but they do average moving 25-30 cars per week.

 

I doubt very much they will pay up, just a feeling i got from the arrogant salesman when i eventually managed to contact him. two weeks after my original complaint. They have still failed to respond to my e-mails for the service history also so i seriously need to consider my options now.

 

GA

 

That means the car has been miss-sold which adds weight to you claim. However, this is more relevant if you go for rejection and a full refund. You need to sit down and calculate what your claim is going to be and also add 8% interest. You must include interest when making the court application and work out the daily amount tyo be added. Interest will then increase on a daily basis untill judgement or payment which ever is sooner. It can be back-dated to the point of sale (if the car is to be rejected on the basis of it being miss-sold) or to the date the fault occured.

 

I think that before taking te matter to court, you need to write a final letter before action (LBA) indicating whether you are rejecting the car because it has been miss-sold or you are claiming for the repairs and any other associated costs. The court will normally expect at least 2 letters to be sent to a respondent before commencing proceedings.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[greyhound advocate]

Thank you Sailor Sam.

 

I will do as you advise, just need to get the first letter delivered and give them time to respond.

 

I will keep you updated and let you know what the outcome is.

 

GA

[scaniaman]

Greyhound seems to be having a dreadful time with this garage, but his story is all too common.

It is my understanding that there were a huge amount of complaints about motor traders and the OFT had recently brought out proposals to deal with such companies. Anyone know what the position is here?

[greyhound advocate]

Hi Scaniaman

 

Ahem i am a she tut:lol:

 

Letter still not delivered and still no response to my e-mails requesting the service history - oh and i wrote to the Judge from the Sunday Mail. I can always have the satisfaction that i might just get to name and shame them.

 

GA

[greyhound advocate]

Just to keep you updated, letter has still not been delivered, Royal Mail tracking says it is still being progressed through their network for delivery - sent on 13/12/10 by first class Recorded Delivery so beginning to wonder if maybe the garage has refused delivery, will keep you updated when i hear something.

 

GA

[crem]

There should be a telephone number available on the RM website so that ou can make a more direct enquiry about why it isn't yet delivered. They may be able to give you more accurate info than what you are seeing on the basic tracking system.