gary68 v Cap One - PPI

[citizenB]

Gary, that application form appears to be pretty much what most Capital One victims are receiving. I have looked at both mine and OH's and there is no reference such as you have circled, so I cant help you with that.

 

The 2nd page of T&cs are those provided for both mine and OH's. Mine is from 1999 and OH's from 2003.

 

I think if you look around the Capital One threads, you will see that if clause/condiiton 23 is present on any of the T&cs then it is irrelevant as it deals with data protection.

 

The 2nd page they have provided you with couldnt have been on the back side of the application form as it doesnt contain the condition/clause they refer to.

 

To date, they have supplied me with several different versions of what they hope I will be foolish enough to believe was on the back

[the_shadow]

I have the cs009 reference on the side of my 2nd page and I have a very very dubious looking section 23 on my 2nd page.

 

Application was made in 2004.

 

S.

[GARY68]

 

The 2nd page they have provided you with couldnt have been on the back side of the application form as it doesnt contain the condition/clause they refer to.

 

Thanks CB

VERY DUBIOUS

[GARY68]

I have the cs009 reference on the side of my 2nd page and I have a very very dubious looking section 23 on my 2nd page.

 

Application was made in 2004.

 

S.

 

EVEN MORE DUBIOUS

mine was in 2004 also,

what I was thinkink about the code...Con..Somebody ..it was 09

[GARY68]

Quick update..

Not heard anything but they are still adding charges etc..anyway I have sent off a ppi claim and having worked out my charges iam about to send them off,

Can the charges still be claimed or should I leave it,I ask this because on my request for prelim "repayment of charges " letter

the paragraph which is entitled "your responsibilites"

"I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account".

 

Is this not a bit contadictive as Iam disputing the account,

any advice please,should I claim back my charges?

thanks in advance

Gary

[GARY68]

update

letter back today regarding the charges on the account which Iam claiming.

£503

£412+£90 @8% interest....although im sure ive worked this out wrong and should be asking for more.

 

 

 

 

I want to refuse this and want to reply with a letter ,does this have to be a letter before action and what is this situation with the disputed account as in regards to taking this to court?

Ihave read other threads that have claimed money via money claim and they seem to pay up after acknowledgement is this correct,

 

can anyone shed any light on what my next move would be..refusal letter or letter before action.

thanks

[the_shadow]

update

letter back today regarding the charges on the account which Iam claiming.

£503

£412+£90 @8% interest....although im sure ive worked this out wrong and should be asking for more.

 

 

How about something like :-

 

 

Letter Before Action

I acknowledge your letter of xx/xx/xx and your "goodwill gesture" of £110 + £10 to cover the interest. However this amount does not match my calculations and therefore I am only able to accept this in part payment of my claim.

 

I note you state that after the OFT recommendations you have reduced your charges to £12 however I note in the same OFT recommendations the following passage:-

 

“We are not suggesting that default fees should be set at £12, and a court will certainly not consider that a default fee is fair just because it is below the threshold”. “We consider that a contract term is likely to be unfair if it requires consumers to pay more as a result of a default than the court would order them to pay if they were sued for breach of contract. This means that a default charge should not exceed a reasonable pre-estimate of the administrative costs that the consumer ought to have realised would be likely to be incurred by his or her card issuer in dealing with defaults”.

 

and therefore in order for you to charge me £12.00 you must demonstrate to me that it costs Capital One £12.00 for late payments. I should warn you also that in any court claim I will ask for strict proof of this charging structure and ask for the court to order disclosure of this structure.

 

Yours fed up with crapital one

 

S.

[GARY68]

many thanks Sshadow,

Ive been looking for that quote for oft in your threads and you just interupted me:)

 

I will use this and fill in the bits

cheers

[the_shadow]

many thanks Sshadow,

Ive been looking for that quote for oft in your threads and you just interupted me:)

 

I will use this and fill in the bits

cheers

 

Cant remember where I pinched it from I think it was a somebody complaining to Mint so big respect whoever dug it out originally... I just like to pass it along

 

S.

[GARY68]

Well got this back today from Ellie

 

[GARY68]

Bit of a dillema

should I proceed or settle for stalemate?

if Im disputing the debt can I still issue a claim,I know they probaly wont defend and pay up but there are issues with defaults and which I would like to be removed would this be a seperate issue?

Im also waiting for a response to a ppi claim which was first refused,

with the ppi and charges that would take it down to 1 third left on the balance which is why they are reluctant to settle,

huuumm..pondering which way to go.

[the_shadow]

Bit of a dillema

should I proceed or settle for stalemate?

if Im disputing the debt can I still issue a claim,I know they probaly wont defend and pay up but there are issues with defaults and which I would like to be removed would this be a seperate issue?

Im also waiting for a response to a ppi claim which was first refused,

with the ppi and charges that would take it down to 1 third left on the balance which is why they are reluctant to settle,

huuumm..pondering which way to go.

 

Gary, are you disputing the debt or just disputing the enforcability of the debt. If its the latter then I dont see it being a problem, there is a debt its just crap1 shouldnt be allowed to collect on it as their agreement is complete tosh... in this instance bringing a claim for unfair charges and having the repayment applied to the balance shouldnt make a difference... not in my opinion anyway.

 

If you are happy with the amount then you should settle, if your not then I think you need to issue a court claim.

 

S.

[GARY68]

Good morning Shadow,

thanks for reply,

Im disputing the enforcability hopefully:)

ive travelled with all on my sig this far and now I would like to move forward to court,

but its been a while

[GARY68]

with your help on the ppi letter im waiting for that any time soon.

like i say when the charges+ppi come back thats a big chunk off.

I think Ill give it a couple more days then decide to put a claim in

[GARY68]

by the way..no im not settling for that offer on the charges...

 

oooo fighting talk, I think ive just made my mind up:D

[the_shadow]

by the way..no im not settling for that offer on the charges...

 

oooo fighting talk, I think ive just made my mind up:D

 

Reading around the other crap1 threads you'll see they usually say they'll defend the claim and then pay you everything and invite you to discontinue. Its going to be tougher if youre going for default removal though.

 

Any help I can be I'll be around

 

S.

[GARY68]

not sure if I can include the default shadow as ive already sent a lba off just for the charges

[the_shadow]

not sure if I can include the default shadow as ive already sent a lba off just for the charges

 

In my opinion you can put it in the claim still, its just the fact that you will be using the court route that you are warning them about in the LBA not all the specific details. So long as the monetary amounts match I would just include a paragraph to have all adverse data removed from all credit reference agencies into the claim.

 

S.

[GARY68]

I see what your saying, no point in issuing another lba,

I will read up on more threads, Ive read many on this and cant remember which ones..been doing a hell of a lot of reading of late and keep getting distracted via other interesting threads instead of concentrating on my own,

many thanks again for support , s

[GARY68]

update

received the letter below today,

firstly, didnt ask for any default removal in my letter before action,

secondly, im surprised about me not paying them for the 6 months prior to default,but looking up..it is true:p

 

not to sure if this is there fob off letter for me including the £12 fees which i want back .

 

Edited June 26, 2009 by GARY68
remove info

[GARY68]

this is a copy of the default they are refering,what do you think

 

Edited June 26, 2009 by GARY68
edit notes

[Turnaround]

Hi Gary1968,

 

I have been helping my OH with Cap 1 for some time now, and on going through her files came across this blank (unsigned) original Cap1 agreement that originates from 2004 and thought it might be of some use.

 

I have removed the name, address and barcodes only.

 

If you compare the blank signature box with yours and others on this site, I would suggest that you could see a difference in the lines contained within that box. You might also conclude, as others have how different that signature box appears from the original.

 

Furthermore, previous caggers have rightly noted the distinct lack of prescribed terms, this is because this is an application for credit and not a Credit Agreement. This word application is mentioned on three occasions within the text, twice in the first para and once in the third.

 

And the infamous section 23 does not appear overleaf and your code CS009 appears on the bottom.

 

I have tried to copy/paste onto here but ended up doing an attatchment. How do you copy/paste the images

 

Hope this helps

 

Kind regards……….

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10178&stc=1&d=1246146549

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10179&stc=1&d=1246146549

[Turnaround]

 

Edited June 28, 2009 by Turnaround

[GARY68]

Hi Turnaround,

looks like the same unenforcable agreements keep getting battered around,

 

It's been a while can anyone help me with the N1 form or show me a link for filling against cap1, and is it best to go to mc online?

[citizenB]

Gary, your letter from Capone in post 45. I was rather interested in the statement they make as follows:

 

"As a company, we have a LEGAL DUTY to report to credit reference agencies how you manage your account".

 

Now as far as I am aware there is no legislation "requiring" companies to do this. So I telephoned the ICO.

 

The person I spoke to was rather evasive but eventually confirmed there is NO legislation requiring them to do so.. although they werent prepared to go so far as to accede to my suggestion that this is just an empire building exercise that has gone unchecked by the ICO:D

 

ICO has suggested that .. in the event you are intending to write to Capone, then perhaps you could ask THEM which law they are referring to.