Can My Employer Sack Me After 12 Months Sick

[Guest BARBIE DOLL]

HI does anyone know if you can be sacked after 12 months of long term sick?

due to some bullying issues at work of whch my employer is aware of i ended up off work very very ill with stress /deppression .so far work have done nothing to try help me back to work apart from requesting medical letter from my doctor to prove i was ill .basically they have left me alone but a few people have told me that once have been off work 12 months they can finish me . is this true? even when they know that t was brought on by getting constantley picked on even though i mentioned it a number of times to my manager and also my supervisor months before i ended up so ill i couldnt go to work.

 

also i was getting ssp and a little work sick pay which wasnt much but it was something .i got a letter yesterday to say my ssp had ceased and also the small payment i was getting from work saying they had stopped that too.so now i am getting nothing. does anyone know anything about how i can handle any of these or if there is anything i can do

[Lookingtobuy]

what support have they offered to help you return to work in this period?

 

have they used AXA or First Assist or any healthcare support service to give them advice on how best to help you?

 

have you had Wellbeing meetings? (catch-ups where you have informal discussions on how you are progressing)

 

have they offered you staggered returns? eg coming in for 3 hours a day for three or 4 days a week, rather than jumping straight back into a 40 hour week?

 

if you don't mind me asking, what was physically stopping you returning to work? i understand a little about mental health problems, but this is a key area they will look at.

 

have you kept in regular contact with your employer?

 

how long had you been at your company?

 

have you had any action plans or disciplinaries about your absence at any point?

[Guest BARBIE DOLL]

Hello thank you for reading and replying to me,

i wll answer you in order of you questions.

 

firstley i went on sick at the end of feb 08 and for about 5 weeks i get ssp plus nearly all my wage, so when they are paying you like this they dont really like it and so get you in nearly every few weeks to see the works doctor whom i might add trys his best to get you back to work in that time regardless of what it may take so asking about support then during march i saw the works doctor a few times but as soon as my almost full pay stopped they didnt have me in to see him anymore .he actually disscussed my illness and when i mentioned the bullying he tried to change the subject and said i quote"we dont need to name names"

work then requested a letter from my doctor asking if he thought i was well enough to work and what treatment he was giving.

you asked if they had sort assistance from axa or first assist i cant answer that i dont know what that is or if they have.

 

i have not had any wellbeing meetings or anything else.

 

no talks about staggered returns to work .not to me anyway.

 

nothing physically is stopping me working. its the mental issues that as made me ill after been picked on constantley which caused me to suffer panic attacks ,ocd, sleepless nights, fear of going out and suicidal thoughts whch my doctor refered me to a councillor in may but the first meeting is a very long waiting list and i am still waitng.

 

my partner works at the same place so some times the top manager will ask how i am..

 

i have worked for the company 20 years.

 

 

you get a verbal warning if you have been off work 3 times in 12 months even if it is 3 seperate days or 1 full month then 1 more month a few months later . each time off regardless of how long is classed as 1 sick time. about 6 years ago i was off in 12 months 3 seperate days and i got a verbal.

 

thank you hope this helps

Edited November 8, 2008 by Rooster-UK
Font changed to make post more readable.

[Lookingtobuy]

Your absence management procedure is very similar to the large company I recently worked for- 3 absences trigger a disciplinary, absenses are classed as PERIODS of absence- not by how long the period is.

 

I take it they haven't used an AXA type referral service as you would have been made aware of it (signed paperwork giving them access to your medical records, you would have been contacted by a representative who would have talked to you about your condition, etc)... very big companies tend to use services like this so they can get recommendations on how they can try to ease you back into work, what support may be necessary, etc.

 

Again seems a little odd they haven't given you the support of keeping contact with you through meetings- very informal ones where they will have catch-ups with you. This again is quite standard procedure with large companies managing long-term absence- be they in a neutral place, by home visit, or if you feel comfortable enough to come into work, in a an office with your line-manager. One of the benefits of doing this is that it makes the mental return to work less daunting... and if I'm honest it provides evidence (if needed) that the company have done their best to support you back into work... makes it easier to manage you out the business.

 

I'm looking into a few things... I really am not an expert, so please don't take what I am going to say as anything but an opinion... in the meantime a couple more things:

 

tough question but realistically when do you think you may have been able to face returning to work? It seems awful how little support you have been offered and I understand how daunting it must be. I know you've been there 20 years (which is massively in your favour also), but have you considered a job at a different company?

 

Will do some googling and see what I can unearth!

[Guest BARBIE DOLL]

the company have known that i suffer quite bad with my nerves for a long time but it as not effected my work in the past. ths is why i mentioned getting picked on well before christmas last year to my supervisor and manager in the hope it could be sorted before it came to me been off sick.

you may ask why i never went to my union rep. this is because she is one of the people causing me the problem and she is also a gossip .

maybe realistically had work of had me in for meetngs whilst i have been off work it may have made it easier for me to return earlier but because of the lack of intrest from them its made me worse and now i feel the whole world is against me and with people telling me that the can sack me come 12 months its making me think is this what they are waiting for and why they have just left me alone.

you ask if i could leave and work somewhere differant. the job i love and the money is really really good for a girl anyway . but also the ones causing all this have only worked at my company 2 years and that makes me think what right have they to try push me out when i have been there20 years.

anyway once again thank you sooo.. much for all your help

[mb in cambs]

HI!

I'm in a situation whereby I have been signed off work by my doctor for nearly 2 years following a bad car accident, and suffered whiplash, back spasm and sciatica, leaving me with difficulty walking, moving and sleeping.

My company have now requested a meeting with me, after receiving a doctors report highlighting my mobility issues, stating that the outcome of the meeting could mean my contract being terminated!

 

Basically, it looks like they want to sack me while I am signed off, but have ignored all requests for me to work from home, and have refused to actually make allowances or offer any form of help for my mobility issues in helping me to return to work.

I feel i have been treated very unfairly, in that they want to do this on December 15th 2009 (great timing...NOT!) leaving me both shocked and anxious about what is going to happen.

 

They have based most of this decision on evidence supplied by the companies' BUPA health care management team, and most of that evidence has been refuted by the latest report AND my doctor.

 

Additionally, they have only kept me up-to-date in that I have had 2 face-to-face home meetings (informal) and 1 meeting with my manager (formal) to outline changes to the working practices of my current (soon to be lost by the look of it) position in the space of 24 months!

Even emails I send to them get responded to in about 3 weeks and I have received NO letters of update, no "news letters" or even updates from my team leader or my direct line management despite requesting them on numerous occasions!

 

My question(s) to the forum would be (and I am grateful for ANY help here!) is this:

 

1) Can they sack me while I am signed off sick, even though I have offered to work from home (managed by myself)?

2) Can they ignore my requests for possible help with returning to work on a part-time basis, given my current mobility issues?

3) Can they do this without prior consultation, and have thus far withheld any form of evidence to base thier decision on?

4) Refuse to allow me any form of representation other than an employee of the company to act as a witness only (who would have little bearing on the meeting at all)?

 

I am seriously worried about this, as it means that if they do indeed terminate my contract, is going to effectively cause me further hardship, stress and anxiety with regards to the coming "season of good will" (to put it as sarcastically as possible!)

 

Please help, I am at my wit's end!

 

MB

Edited December 4, 2009 by mb in cambs

[Uncertain]

The answer to your question is .....

 

Yes they can sack you but they need to be careful.

 

If you are medically unable to do you job they can dismiss you on the grounds of capability. However, if taken to a tribunal they would need to show that they had acted fairly. Also, if your illness amounts to a disability (in the legal sense) they need to show that they cannot make reasonable adjustments to allow you to return.

 

You have presumably reached the point where any company sick pay has run out? You do however still accrue at least statutory paid holiday thanks to recent court decisions so whilst you remain on the staff your employer has to pay you for at least 28 days per year.

 

Apart from the holiday one option they could take is to do nothing at all. It is not costing them anything and, statistically, the chance of somebody returning after a year off sick is very slim. They may choose to do this rather than address the issue.

 

Another option is to agree a Compromise Agreement where you "go quietly" in exchange for some money (normally tax free), a reference and an agreement not to make any claim against them. You HAVE to be legally advised on a CA for it to be valid.

 

If you are still signed off sick by your doctor one possibility is to say that you are not well enough to attend a meeting. Ask them to put whatever they want to discuss in writing. This gives you the chance to take advice before responding and means they cannot later deny what they have said.

 

Sadly they can refuse to allow you to bring anybody except a work of colleague of your choice or a trade union rep to a meeting. It is possible to hire an accredited union rep via some employment lawyers, if you are not a member of a union, but this can cost about £500.

 

I would suggest you call ACAS or the CAB for some one to one advice. Your union, house or car insurance may provide access to free legal advice.

Edited December 4, 2009 by Uncertain

[mb in cambs]

Uncertain - thanks for your reply...

 

Yes, I am on long-term sick leave and all company sponsored sick pay ended about 1.5 years ago (long time, tbh!)

 

I didn't know about the holiday thingy, and I though the company would be duty-bound to inform me of ANY changes to my terms & conditions, which they have not? or at LEAST keep me informed of any changes, which they have thus far, steadfastly refused to do...

 

I have considered asking for them to put the matter in writing, but they have booked a meeting place very near to my home (my work was in Hatfield, herts and I live in Cambs), rather than allowing me the option of opting out on health grounds, so they have me there.

 

I would consider the option to "go quietly" if they were serious about it, but I have a feeling that they are gonna go down the road of "not capable = no good/sack" and then they will wash thier hands of the whole sorry mess (just my opinion, tbh!) and, if I appeal/refer it to an tribunal, they will stall, drag thier heels, etc...

 

As I said in my post, they have refused to allow me to work from home, as part of an offer I forward, to enable me to gradually engage in actively trying to return to work, and they counter offered a proposal to return to work full-time (as I offered to actually TRY to work, they felt I was FIT to return completely!)

 

Looks like I will have to wait and see, but being as it is so close to Xmas, I think it is a really unfair and despicable action to take at this time of year, however, best advice I have/can give to anyone in this situation is:

 

Hold your temper.

Don't jump to conclusions (difficult to do at the best of times, tbh!)

Wait and see

 

Not looking forwards to this, tbh!

 

Thanks everyone who has had input into this and everyone else problems!