Natwest and Arrow Global

[StuffedbyNatwest]

Another newbie here. Simply, I left the UK owing money on my Natwest credit cards. After 5 years I hear from a foreign debt collection company that they now own the debt who say they are agents of Arrow Global Limited in the UK. Natwest wont speak to me, Global are not in the phone book, and the foreign company told me they would send bailiffs to our new home. When I asked them for some proof of the debt they said it would take too long to get and would send the bailiffs anyway.

 

Does anyone know the situation concerning debts run up in the UK which are then assigned to overseas companies for collection.

 

I think I may be better off getting an IVA or at the worst going bankrupt but do not know what to do.

 

Any help would be appreciated

 

I should say that although I am 60 I acknowledge the debt but simply do not have enough money to pay itin full right now

 

Thank you

[KJD]

Hi Stuffed...

 

I'm fairly new to this site too, but from everything I've read, I would say DONT do anything until you get some response here. Don't go down the route of IVAs or bankrupcy - there will be some good advice here soon which will help you get this sorted. While you're waiting, have a read around this amazing site at some other people's experiences. They'll give you real hope. They certainly have for me.

 

And try not to worry....

 

[kegi]

stuffed as kjd says do not do anything till you get good advice on here and do not acknowledge any debt if the actual debt is over 6 years its statute barred if you do a search on paragon you will find posts relating to arrow global and who they are ...dont even think about iva or bankruptcy or talking on the phone ..someone will come forward soon

 

kegi

[Guest NATTIE]

where overseas are you? is it within the EU

[StuffedbyNatwest]

Sorry Nattie

but not quite sure what your response meant

Help appreciated

[kegi]

stuffed i will anwer for nattie she is asking where are you abroad in the EU or some other country different rules could apply to your case etc

here in uk bailiffs only come out after a county court judgement has been applied so I think they are trying it on to scare you into admitting the debt don't

someone will correct if i am wrong

 

kegi

[Guest NATTIE]

Kegi- read a bit about chasing debts within the EU because if can happen. Times online for reference. and a little note.....nattie is not short for nathalie so i seem to have lost something big and gained two other things, if you get my meaning:D

[StuffedbyNatwest]

You are all stars, but mustbe my age as I amstill confused about SAR's ect

I am in France by the way

[dannyboy660]

You'll find what you're looking for here.

 

European Judicial Network - legal_order - United Kingdom

 

Click on the flag of the country you are resident in and you can take a look a various scenarios. Bear in mind the expense involved in chasing UK debts in the EU is huge, and they normally only bother with fairly large sums. The courts in most countries aren't interested in UK debts as they are outside the eurozone and full of complicated issues like "simple contract laws". Then there's exchange rates, etc, etc, - most of the time the expense is prohibitive on an unsecured loan regulated by CCA 1974, especially if you decide to contest. (Most people do, as the Courts tend to favour the debtor)

 

If property is involved it can get a bit heavy, or if it's for Tax or a debt to HMG they will press for it, regardless. But for unsecured Credit Cards.....it's possible, but doesn't happen often.

 

If you've been abroad for 3+ years then making yourself bankrupt in the UK may not be an option, it will have to be in your country of residency, which will take into account your current financial situation in your new home. Best avoided if possible.

 

If you're talking about a modest amount of money, this may be just another scare tactic, They'll try anything to get you scared enough in to paying up on their terms.

 

If it becomes a bit too stressful, get in touch with the Consulate and ask to be put in touch with an English speaking Lawyer. They will help you make sure things are dealt with fairly and give you peace of mind that they can't stitch you up. In fact, things may even go your way...

 

All the best.

[kegi]

stuffed its mostly beyond me and thats my age also and not sure if if same rules apply there as over here i can only say again if the debt is over six yrs old and you have'nt paid anything in that time or acknowleged it I would say its barred and can't be enforced if the same rules apply in france we need one of the superstars to pop in here and put you right in the meantime read other threads and see what can be done

don't whittle too much about it or so called collectors:-x

 

S.A.R.s are what you send of to a bank etc to request all statements etc that they hold on you and your accounts.

 

 

Nattie whatever can you mean where i come from nattie means smart and dandy thanks for the tip

 

kegi

[dannyboy660]

Phew. Found it.

 

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/site/en/oj/2001/l_012/l_01220010116en00010023.pdf

 

This will answer many questions as to who gets to do what to whom, and where.

 

If you can plough through all that and understand exactly what it means, you're a better wo/man than I am.

 

In need of a CAG specialist,..... or perhaps a professional.

 

Whatever the case, don't worry. Unsecured debt is exactly that - unsecured. A lot of poop that goes on from DCA's (home and abroad) is just scaremongering and you are probably better protected in France than UK.

 

All the best.

[StuffedbyNatwest]

Firstly my thanks to everyone for their help, I did not appreciate how valuable this site was!

I had a couple of thoughts overnight.

Natwest have not taken me to Court in the UK and thus have no legal judgement against me. Can a French debt collector (part of a UK firm) enforce any action without a Court Order

Secondly, as the original agreement was taken out and signed in the UK, and I believe it said 'subject to UK Law' or somesuch, how can UK Law then be simply be ignored and the laws of another country come into play?

As ever, grateful thanks

[dannyboy660]

Just a very brief comment,

 

Without a CCJ in UK, nos amis Francais can do nothing.

Your creditor can not get a CCJ (I think) unless you have an address for service of documents in the UK.

 

Whether it's possible to obtain such a judgment through a French court, on an English simple contract for unsecured credit... I think it's very doubtful.

 

Having quickly scanned through that EU legal stuff I posted, I get the impression they can enforce a judgment that is already in existence in UK, but without that critical judgment in a UK court on a UK contract there's not much (if anything) they can do, other than try to frighten or bully you into accepting liability and paying up.

 

You admit you owe the debt, so how you proceed is probably a matter purely for you, but if in doubt, seek advice preferably from someone more clued up on French law.

 

Let us know if anything happens, and don't let it get you down.

[StuffedbyNatwest]

I must be a web dinasaur ! How do I find the standard letter to send to request the copy of my agreement that they have 12 days to respond to?

Thank you

[StuffedbyNatwest]

One last favour - can anyone tell me a phone or e mail address for

Arrow Global Ltd

57 - 61 Mortimer Street

London W1W 8HS

 

I cant seem to find it anywhere

 

Thanks

[dannyboy660]

Ok.

 

Arrow Global

 

That's Arrow....and.....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

 

The request your looking for is letter 'N'.

 

Hope that's helped you out a bit.

[dannyboy660]

Arrow Financial | Home

 

..perhaps that one is more relevant

[StuffedbyNatwest]

WHAT A DAY !

 

I decided to call Natwest/Royal Bank of Scotland when I found that the letter of assignment did not have the actual account number correct (out by only one digit I must say) and suggested they might like to re-issue it.

I also suggested that as they had assigned an incorrect account I would send them the CCA letter as technically they still were the person owed the money. He said not to send it to them as they had sold the debt even if the account number was wrong and regardless of this Arrow owned the debt.

They also told me they had not gone to Court for this debt

I asked how much they sold it for but he said he had no idea and that no one there would know - strange?

I then asked if they were concerned at the tactics of the DCA they sold it to and he effectively said it wasnt their problem any more. So, I asked, if they shot me in the legs as part of their collection methods would they be concerned - no comment. I asked if then if a bank who today declared a profit of £9,000,000,000 was the least bit concerned about how their DCAs worked - again not much comment.

 

So me thinks, where from her?

A CCA letter to Royal Bank of Scotland or Natwest

or negotiate with Arrow

or give up!!

 

Thanks all !

ps Interestingly the letter from Royal bank of Scotland was signed by exactly the same person as the letter from Natwest, although they had different job titles. He must be a busy man!

[KJD]

Well, well done you.

 

I would say 1 - unless Arrow themselves have taken it to court (perhaps you could check your credit file - can be done online), you can stop worrying about bailiffs. A DCA cannot come and seize goods. 2 - you need to send a CCA request to Arrow. Have a look round the site for a copy, and don't forget to put at the top that you do not acknowledge the debt. When I sent mine off, I added at the bottom that all contact must be made in writing, no personal or telephone calls. Oh, and send by recorded delivery - or the equivalent in France. You need to be able to prove that you sent it and they received it.

 

Dont enter into negotitations with Arrow. When and if you get to the SAR stage, you may find you have got some unlawful charges, which you can try to recover and therefore reduce the total owed.

 

[dannyboy660]

Stuffed,

 

I can quite honestly say, of all the people on this site, yours is the position I envy most.

 

You signed a CCA'74, paid your way....found yourself in France...but pursued by Rottweillers you felt the need to connect with fellow Brits who line the pockets of those that don't need it anyway.

 

I take my hat off to you. (If I was wearing one!!)

 

Keep us updated.

 

I'm very interested to see if you will test the law, or if they will hide in the skirts of their women (Scottish expression).

 

I can see lots of skirts full of British debt collectors!!!! (for three years at least!!)

 

All the best.

[dannyboy660]

As if you needed any.......

 

Ozone Dragostea din tei English Version - Google Video

 

 

Have a good nights sleep, knowing UK rules....

[dannyboy660]

Well, well done you.

 

I would say 1 - unless Arrow themselves have taken it to court (perhaps you could check your credit file - can be done online), you can stop worrying about bailiffs. A DCA cannot come and seize goods. 2 - you need to send a CCA request to Arrow. Have a look round the site for a copy, and don't forget to put at the top that you do not acknowledge the debt. When I sent mine off, I added at the bottom that all contact must be made in writing, no personal or telephone calls. Oh, and send by recorded delivery - or the equivalent in France. You need to be able to prove that you sent it and they received it.

 

Dont enter into negotitations with Arrow. When and if you get to the SAR stage, you may find you have got some unlawful charges, which you can try to recover and therefore reduce the total owed.

 

 

 

With all due respect, if they (Natwest) already say they have not taken court action checking out a UK credit file is a bit pointless. Court documents have to be served on you at a UK address and this obviously has not, and can not happen. The search will be recorded on the file and the address you give (UK address, I believe) has to be confirmed before the details can be given. Therefore, all you actually do is inform anyone who may be interested EXACTLY where you are/were/where your friends/relatives are depending on what you give.

 

When you pay by Visa/Mastercard to use the online service they confirm the address of the enquiry is the same as that registered for the card, and hey presto they already know where you live, which bank you use etc,etc. .....

 

Resident in France, there's no need to worry about ID theft in UK, because you're not there to sign anything, and they won't take applications from overseas, so you're in the clear anyway.

 

Unless you intend to pay the debt, negotiating with Arrow is a bit pointless too. No CCJ, no enforcement,....no worries. If you acknowledge and pay, be sure you have no skeletons in the cupboard because they will soon be out!!!

[StuffedbyNatwest]

Hello again

Well CCA letter en route (with a £1 coin) !

Just wondered if the fact that they have the numbers of my account wrong in both cases (be it by ony one digit) will take them all back to the drawing board?

 

Hope everyone is well

[languid]

Hi stuffed, I am in a similar position to you. Have you managed to stop the French DCA hounding you?. If so, how?

 

Bon Courage

[StuffedbyNatwest]

Hi Languid, I have updated the position under a new thread 'Update on Natwest/RBS' - sorry cant do a link !