Caught with Freedom Pass - Old CodJA/ UNDERGROUND help! What to do?

[Old-CodJA]

You're right SPRO, I should be heavily fined and I completely accept responsibility for these actions.

 

However I disagree that it should be as 'serious' as to be prosecuted, possibly leading to a mark on a CRB which seems rediculously excessive. After all no one or no property has been harmed and with a heavy fine LU would be getting back more than they lost and I have definitely learned my lesson.

 

My main question was whether anyone else has had CCTV evidence used against them..

 

You may believe this is not a 'serious' matter, but it is worth taking note of the CPS view on the subject. In their own words:

 

'Fare Evasion is the principal form of dishonesty to affect public transport. The fact that it is widespread is a relevant public interest factor and we must also take account of the general principles covering prosecution for all offences of dishonesty'

 

Your post suggets that you admitted using the Freedom Pass during the previous two weeks, but unless you mentioned specific dates & times and were questioned under caution for those additional offences, you should only be charged with the one offence for which you were detected and reported.

 

There are no guarantees, but your best option is to write to the rail company, offering to pay the fares due and any reasonable costs incurred by them in recovering the fare as an alternative to being prosecuted.

 

Make sure that you apologise for your uncharacteristic use of someone else's Oyster

 

Be sure to give an undertaking to always ensure that you hold a valid ticket before travelling in future.

 

Have a look at the 'MissyLow' thread for further detail.

Edited August 13, 2009 by Old-CodJA

[Old-CodJA]

With Oyster cards ALL journeys are kept on file, if the officers can pin down dates and times as to when they think that you have travelled using such pass, then yes they can request a copy of the CCTV for the gateline area, to see if they can spot you tapping in or out, but they would ahve to be specific as to a day and time span. we recently done it for someone to prove that they didnt come into work, we ask for the cctv footage between the time that they say they came in and left, to see if we cld prove or disprove what the employee has said.

 

Absolutely right, I do the checks too where justified, but the 'suspect' still has to be made aware of the specific charges alleged and must be given an opportunity to respond.

 

Yes, all Oyster journeys are kept on file. However, only the most recent 8 weeks are immediately accessible and any CCTV footage that may exist is not available indefinitely unless a serious incident has been captured and preserved during the given time-span that you are asking to be examined.

 

Where staff travel Oysters (and nominee) are concerned, as suggested in your example, it is of course quite a bit easier too.

 

I am a firm believer in making everyone aware of the penalty that they might face, but I also like to see it done in a fair manner and try not to increase any fears unnecessarily.

[Old-CodJA]

In honesty CCTV footage is rarely of any value in such cases because the imagery is not high quality and whilst it may show a hand passing over a reader, it cannot conclusively show what the hand held.

 

Now I understand that confirmation of that action may be all you are seeking, but this might easily be discredited for that reason if someone has been charged with fare evasion. Equally, it might give the Magistrates sufficient doubt to acquit, but I would expect the prosecutor would also have evidence that the validation point was working normally and that the traveller's card history showed no valid ticket.

 

Dumbelling is the name given to the practice of avoiding a fare by using two tickets that do not cover a whole journey. Adopting this pracyice guarantees that a traveller will be prosecuted when detected.

[Old-CodJA]

Sorry for hijack, just to confirm really, but:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-2361300.html

 

Am I right in assuming that son is going to lose his Oyster card altogether? Is there any way to avoid this? I know he's an idiot (even HE knows he's an idiot... now), but without the card, guess who's going to get lumped with the cost of travel when he goes back to college.

 

This is taken from the DLR/TfL Conditions of Carriage:

 

10.2. If we believe that you have used or tried to use any ticket or Oyster card to defraud us we may cancel and not re-issue it. If this happens, we will not give you a refund of the remaining value of the ticket, or refund any credit or deposit paid for the Oyster card

Your son might try writing to the office with a full explanation and appealling to their better nature.

[Old-CodJA]

Mr Dell, it seems that you have posted the same query on 3 or 4 different threads, which may well lead to a lot of confusion.

 

Perhaps the site team can resolve that so that we can give any suggestions all in one place