abroadgirl v vanquis

[teaboy2]

Ignore them, they stated themselves the debt is not enforceable. the fact they provided you with a cca where the address had been altered, means its not a true copy of the original and therefore not acceptable under the CCA request you made. ALso where were the Terms and conditions on the CCA? where they on the same piece of paper within the same 4 corners? I doubt it! chances are they given you a application form and sent you a terms and conditons on seperate sheet if they actually sent any.

 

You should tell them that as a result of their unwillingness to resolve your dispute that they are in breach of OFT Guidelines and you will report them to the OFT, trading standards and that as off now you request that they stop processing your data immediately in accourdances to the Data Protection ACT. Failure for them to stop processing your data would be a criminal offence and should be reported to the information commissioner. Basically, once you tell them to stop processing your data you should no longer receive any letters or phone calls from them. as for them to carrying sending letters and making calls to you would mean they still processing your data despite the fact you have withdrawn your consent for them to do so. they can only sent a letter acknowledging your request.

 

Also inform them since they have not compiled with your CCA request that they are now infact in default on the account. therefore until the default is resolved by providing you with a True copy of the CCA they nor any other debt collector can lawfully continue to pursue for this debt.

 

oh and send them an invoice for all the charges they have added to the account as your adminstration charge and charge for your time which was lost dealing with their letters, just to be spiteful and see how they like it. it certainly works for me! infact am sure i read somewhere that debt collection agency can not add charges or interest to the debt while its in dispute same with original creditors.

[teaboy2]

Abroad girl send them the letter below, once you sent them this letter then you are placing them in default. and as a result they can not legally pursue you until they provide you with the correct documentation. Oh and dont for get to creat a quick invoice using and microsoft word/office invoice template for the admin charges you have incurred. i normally charge about £25 per letter i have to write them and same for every call i get from them weather i answered it or not and give them 14 days to pay, and if they dont inform them you may start debt collection proceedings against them lol

Notice of Non-compliance

 

Account Number:

 

Account In Dispute

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of (date), the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On (date) I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

 

 

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on (date), (12+2 working days AFTER the CCA request was sent)

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

This limit has expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law. But as you already knew the debt was unenforceable at law as you have already stated so in previous letter dated (enter date of their letter where it was stated).

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute/default.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party i.e another debt collection company.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter, which is now a formal complaint.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours

 

 

Simple edited the letter with the dates etc and them post it to them at your local post box with a big smile on your face knowing that you have now got them by their balls lol.

[teaboy2]

is that it???? lol you can relax as to me looking at that its nothing more then an application form. A true copy of the original CCA must be a signed agreement headed under the consumer credit act, and must also have within the same 4 corners of the document the terms and conditions. looking at what you posted its nothing more then an application.

 

However to be certain we would need to see the full document. Or is that all thats on the document? also when did you recieve that as i have another letter that you can send them in response to it?

 

p.s you might want to remove the image as it contains your personal details which can lead to DCA's indentifying you.

Edited November 5, 2009 by teaboy2
letter removed as already poosted previously

[teaboy2]

its just an application form unless theres terms and conditions included in the same 4 corners of the document which there isn't.

 

also, am not sure if it because you enlarged the image or not, but is the written text legible when you look at the actual document? because if not then it wouldnt stand in court either.

 

i will have a look at your other thread too at some point today

[teaboy2]

whats actually on page 2,3 and for are they terms and conditions?

 

Are all 4 pages linked together by statements like continued overleaf or terms and conditions overleaf?

 

p.s fact they changed your address means its not a true copy and can not be enforced as they have defaced it.

[teaboy2]

ok so theres nothing linking the application form to the t+c's which is good because it makes it unenforacble too.

 

 

from your last post am i right in understanding that you never had the credit card at your old address and that you applied online for one while at your current address and therefore you never actually signed a CCA? Yet they have made up the cca theyve sent you and lifted your signiture of one of your previous letters?

[teaboy2]

ok i would send them the account in default letter and include in it that the cca was fraudlent due to what you have just told me here and therefore not a true copy of the original. i know the letter may well be the same or similar as the last one i posted on the thread but it doesnt matter. what matters is your letting them know that the cca is not a true copy and that it was fraudlent.

 

Account In Default

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of (date), the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On (date) I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

 

 

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on (date), (12+2 working days AFTER the CCA request was sent)

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account. what you actually supplied me with was nothing short of a fraudlent attepmt to deceive me. (give details as to why i.e old address when you were at your current address when you applied for it. and the lifting of your siginiture from previous letters onto the fake cca)

 

Furthermore

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

This limit has expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter, which is now a formal complaint.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours

 

use a computer font to sign your letter rather then siging by hand.

 

 

once you receive a response let us know. if you dont hear anything within 14 days then report them to the OFT and the ombudsman.

[teaboy2]

any response from them yet?

[teaboy2]

hi abroadgirl

 

i hope you enjoed your holidays. I wouldnt worry about the latest letter its just a standard response stating they are allowed to process your data on the believe the original agreement was between you and the original creditor. But you are the sole owner of your own data so you can refuse them the right to process your data regardless.

 

So send the the following letters.

 

Regarding data protection letter:

 

To; The Data controller/compliance Manager.................. .................

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

 

Please be advised that this is a formal notice issued under Section 10 of the Data Protection Act 1980

I demand that you cease processing of my Data by any means whether written or electronically,with third party individuals and

organisations.In addition to processing,this also means passing,ammending,sharing ,and management in any form of my Data in whatsoever filing,both manually or electronically.

 

In compliance with the Information Commissioners guidance,I give you 14 days to comply with this request.

 

The purpose of this request is that I am of the understanding that your continual processing/controlling of my data will cause distress harm and damage.

Specifically because;

 

(i) My credit worthiness is being or has been damaged by your actions as a result of your entries to my credit files,which relate to A disputed and unproven debt (cca provided being incomplete and unenforceble, along with beng pysically tampered with i.e. Address being changed), and therefore you are acting in breach of OFT Guidlines.You can also add other stuff here as is applicable and any or all of the following that apply (since you need to show reasons as to why continual processing will or is likely to cause distress harm or damage)

 

(ii)That recorded defaults on my credit files by yourselves are in dispute.

 

(iii)That I fully expect to show that adverse data was wrongly filed which would mean that earlier processing was unfair and unjust.

 

(iiii)That matters in relation to adverse data you have entered onto my credit files are currently in litigation.

 

(iiii) That the adverse data you continue to process,manage and pass on to third parties impedes my ability to apply for credit,mortgages or other financial services.

 

(iiiii)That as a data controller/compliance officer,you have a responsibility under the Data protection act to observe all principles set out therein, within the act.

 

 

I expect an acknowledgement of your intentions to comply,and if you do not agree,your reasons for being unable or unwilling to do so.

I will give you 14 days to forward this to me in writing.

 

 

Under the Data Protection Act,a County Court has the powers to order compliance of any breaches it sees fit,together with compensation,at the discretion of the court.

 

Should you fail to comply,or give just and reasonable reasons as to why you will not comply,I will consider making an application to my local Court on notice to force compliance,together with costs and compensation.

 

Yours Faithfully

 

P.S. you yourselves still remain in default of the account following your failure to provide a valid CCA upon my request. As such, then in accordance to section 78 subsection 6 you can not enforce the debt. therefore under OFT guidlines you will cease all attempts to pursue me for payments on the disputed debt.

 

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Now the second letter:

 

this is ment to be sent to the OFT, but i would send a copy to the DCA aswell and state on a sperate attached piece of paper that the letter is a copy of your letter of complaint against them that you have now sent to the OFFICE OF FAIR TRADING in response to their ignorance of your requests so far, and that you will also be writing to the information commissioners office if they again fail to respect your request that they stop processing your data. which they should not be doing anyway given the fact their is no evidence to suggest or confirm you as the debtor but plenty to suggest that they have fraudleuntly altered records (i.e.adrress) in order to make it look as though you are the debtor when you have no knowlegde of such a debt.

 

That way, the *****rs will know your serious and that they should expect to hear from the OFT regarding how they have behaved towards your.

 

Please have a look at this explanation of the CPUT regs. The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 - draft

 

 

If you think that your DCA is acting contrary to any part of these regs then complain immediately. [Which they clearly are]

 

Post in the debt forum to let us know what you are doing. [use this thread, as no need to start a new one]

 

There is no cost and no risk to this course of action.

 

This has not been tried before but CPUT is very new. [since this letter was created its been tried and will no doubt make the DCA **** there pants]

 

This action should be taken in addition to any other action you are considering taking. [consider speacking to the CAB about getting legal advice on what legal action you should take if any in the event the DCA continue to pursue you]

 

This is the address to send complaints to the OFT:

 

Enquiries Unit

Office of Fair Trading

Fleetbank House

2-6 Salisbury Square

London, EC4Y 8JX.

 

You will have to look up your ocal Trading Standards address:

Do not neglect any court action merely because you have made a complaint to the OFT or TS. On the other hand, once you have received an acknowledgment and a complaint reference number, you can refer to it in court so that the judge knows what is going on.

 

 

 

 

Quote:

Your address

 

 

Date

 

 

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUT)

 

Formal complaint against [Name of Debt Collection Agency here]

 

 

 

 

I am writing to complain under the above CPUT regulations. I am receiving letters and telephone calls from [DCA] in respect a purported debt which I understand is governed by the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

In accordance with the Consumer Credit Act I asked [the DCA] to supply me with a true copy of the Consumer Credit agreement. [They have failed to do so/ supplied me with a document which clearly fails to satsify the Consumer Credit Act.] I enclose a copy of that document with this letter.[personally id send them copies of all letters received and copies of all letters you have sent them including the one above]

 

Although I have pointed this out to [DCA] they have failed to acknowledge this and continue to contact me and to harrass me with threats of action. And have also refused to stop processing my data in accordance to the data protection act upon your request.

 

Clearly they are entitled to bring a legal action if they so wish. However, they have not done so and appear instead to be relying upon a campaign of systematic contact with accompanied by threats.

 

I consider that [DCA] are operating an unfair commercial practice and it is for this reason that I am sending you this complaint.

 

I enclose examples of the letters which they have been sending to me. I also enclose a log and verbatim notes of phone calls I have received.

 

I would be grateful if you would acknowledge this letter and let me know what procedures you now intend to follow and what your targets for action are.

 

 

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

 

 

sign the letter

Delete or include the appropriate words for the words in red in this template

[teaboy2]

they are not giving up are they

 

 

trust me they will. its a shame i dont know you personally i would beable to help you alot more and probably have got the DCA to close the account altogether by now. unfortunately i can not give such indepth help here on the forum as it is indepth and requires writing letters from scratch to match your own circumstances only, and therefore people maywell use such letters for their own circumstances which may make their situation worse, since such letters will not have be written for general use and therefore should not be used by them for their own circumstances. it could be done by PM as i would need to know slightly more personal details and have full access to all documents they have sent you, but PM's are frown upon here for good reason. that reason being that DCA are active on these forums too and have used PMs to give wrongful advice or obtain personal data to work out who you are etc.

 

So for now send the 2 letters above and see what the response is.

[teaboy2]

lol dont let them work you up so much their letters are just standard response letters. in the 1st page of the latest letter that you received, they even stated the agreement is unenforcable until they have provided all of the perscribed terms etc. So they've confirmed the debt is unenforceable so are now just trying to pressure into making payments.

 

Since you said all this is all charges and Payment Protection then did you include the payment protection with the agreement or was it optional where you had to tick a box for. If it was where you ticked a box in order not to take payment protection then they mis sold it to you and must pay you back all the payments made for it and all charges that have now accured. So what does it say on the agreement about the payment protection?

 

Again with the CCA as ive said above they know it cant be enforced, there statment about it saying on the cca that terms are referred to in the declearation box and therefore they have met the provisional apsect of your CCA request, basically. However until they provide the fully disclosed cca with all precribed terms they can not in force it and as such should cease pursuing you.

[teaboy2]

Hi Abroadgirl

 

Ive emailed you in response but will also put on thread here what was i advised for the benefit of the thread and any one veiwing or subscripbed to the thread.

 

Regarding Cabot, I would just ignore their letters now. You have already sent them the account in dispute letter for their failure to provide you with a valid credit agreement, so their latest letter is just an attempt of psychological mind games. They know full well that they don't have an enforceable credit agreement otherwise they'd would have send you an enforceable one by now.

 

You could though write a letter reminding them of you account in dispute letter and that under sections 77/78 subsections 4/6 respectfully of the consumer credit act 1974, state that they are not entitled to enforce the debt be it by court action or by pursuing you for payment whist still in default of your CCA request, therefore their latest letter is unlawful and they as such are acting unlawfully and in breach of the above stated Act, not to mention being in breach of OFT guidelines on debt collection. Inform them if they continue to send such letters that are a clear attempt of trying to enforce the debt you will report them to the OFT, trading standards and the FOS without further hesitation. Also inform them you reserve the right to commence legal proceedings against them without further notice.

 

But its up to weather you write back to them or not, personally since your wait for vanquis to respond to your last letter direct to them about the charges etc, I would wait for a response from them first.