Cupcake vs Egg 03

[Bigdebtor]

Cupcake

 

I would make your offer as simple as possible - with the least amount of concessions or rights to the creditor if you default.

 

If you don't need to use a court order type format then don't.

 

I suggest you simply draft a simple proposal along lines of : Baby due in 3 months, self -employed partner for whom I work is injured - no work - no pay - not sure how long for at present. Can afford £5 only if all charges an dinterest now frozen - and I know this amount has been accepted by you from others in financial difficulties - I will be prepared to review if/when circumstances alter (don't say improve - so you can review DOWN too).

 

Include summary I&E if you want - but don't detail all debts and other payments unless you have to do so. Something similar got me the £5 deal from Fred - but only after I hadn't paid them anything at all for a good few months.

 

Post up a draft if you want us to give it the once over.

 

Good luck!

 

BD

[cupcake68]

Hi Guys

 

I have had a reply from Brian Carter.

 

They can confirm on a without prejudice basis they are prepared (should it not say our client is prepared?) to accept in full and final settlement of the debt £15188.58 payable by monthly instalments of £5.

 

They have enclosed consent orders for me to "use". I have to sign and return within 7 days. If they do not hear from me they will apply to the court to strike out your defence at hearing.

 

I have had a read of the consent order and have just a few queries!!

 

At the top of the form it says Maidstone County Court (which is my local court that the case has been transferred to)

 

Further down the form it says Before District Judge

On the day of 2011 sitting at Bristol County Court (none of the blanks are filled in!!)

 

Upon the parties having agreed the terms of settlement

 

BY CONSENT

 

IT IS ORDERED that all further proceedings in this action to be stayed upon the terms set out in the schedule hereto save for the purpose of enforcing or carrying into effect the said terms with liberty to apply for that purpose.

 

AND IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that all parties will bear their own costs

 

SCHEDULE

 

1. The Claimant agrees to accept the sum of £15188.58 in settlement of the total claim payable by instalments of £5.00, first payment commencing 16th March 2011 and on the same day each month thereafter.

 

2. The Claimant agrees not to enter Judgement on the condition that the above arrangement is maintained.

 

3. The Claimant be at liberty to restore proceedings if the defendant defaults in payment arrangements.

 

So the history of this account is as follows....

 

I stopped paying in May 09 bal £13974.20

 

Egg continued to add interest at approx £230 pcm until Aug 09 bal £14698

 

In July 09 Egg added £16 late charges

 

In May 10 Egg refunded £960.25 under refund of interest (I had not asked for this!) Account charged off at £13738.33

 

I have a letter from BC dated Nov 10 balance of claim £14698.58. The total balance to date of claim including costs £15188.58.

 

So.....

 

Am I pushing my luck to say I should not be paying their costs?

 

Why would it say Bristol County court?

 

And why are the spaces not filled in?

 

Thanks for the advice

 

Cupcake

[pt2537]

So.....

 

Am I pushing my luck to say I should not be paying their costs? Er each party bearing their own costs means just that, they dont pay yours you dont pay theirs, its often called drop hands.

 

 

 

Why would it say Bristol County court? because they were too lazy to properly edit the template

 

And why are the spaces not filled in? the blanks will never be filled in on such an order like that, because it is impossible to know which judge it will go before on which day, so it cannot be completed unless done so by the judge.

 

Thanks for the advice

 

Cupcake

[cupcake68]

Hi Pt

 

So should I be writing back asking them to correct their mistake and go ask that the outstanding sum be corrected to not include their costs?

 

What would be the reasonable amount to settle on?

 

The amount that it was at when I stopped paying in Mar 09 (pushing it a little I figure!)

 

The amount it was charged off at ? (This would take into account the £900 refund they applied just before charging off)

 

Thanks

 

Cupcake

[pt2537]

erm unless im seriously missing something,

 

it doesnt include their costs, and ive just said that too in my previous post. Each party bears its own costs, which means you dont pay THEM and THEY dont pay you, its no order as to costs

 

In respect of the rest, that is something for you to consider and see where you go from there

[pt2537]

just to clarify, the costs they are seeking will be costs of the claim in respect of issue fees, court fees etc, these are not something that the drop hands would include normally, but you are not liable for the fees of the solicitors

[cupcake68]

The costs I am talking about are is the difference from when they "closed off" the account £13738 and the total they are now asking for £15188.

 

Cupcake

[pt2537]

what you need then, is not to ask for them to be removed, but to ask for a break down as to how these costs have accrued and what they are

[gh2008]

To be honest, where the alternative is for a CCJ against you with possibly a forthwith order which you then would not be able to comply with, which could then be turned into a Charging Order etc etc

 

and the alternative is £5 a month for the rest of your life and no CCJ against you and technically the default should also be removed from your credit file (as this would be a new agreement in effect which you would be keeping to - although the credit file would still show the balance outstanding)

 

I know which one I would go for ........

[cupcake68]

So do you think I should agree the £15188?

 

Cupcake

[gh2008]

In reality @ £60 pa does it really make any difference??

 

There is no proviso for change in circumstances or anything - it is a staggeringly bad IMHO (for the creditor) agreement

 

I would get proper legal advice re your will & your estate though as you would want to avoid this being taken off it when the time comes I presume .....

 

I would snap their arm off before they get their act together TBH .....

[Gallahad]

I agree with Gh and down the line a bit they may take an offer of F&F as their costs to administer will outway any profit

GH

[gh2008]

Had another think about this and the only 'Gotcha' I can see for you (apart from the points raised earlier about your estate etc.) is ensuring the £5 pcm reaches them on time.

 

Ensure you set up a Standing Order NOT Direct Debit straight to Carter or Egg (whoever the payment are to be made to **you need to check that**)

If you don't have a bank account then open one just for this as you do NOT want any cheques or Postal Orders to not be received on time as you are admitting your liability to the outstanding balance.

 

IMHO, in reality they (Egg) are not even interested in your £5 pcm they are interested in the fact they now have an admitted liability of £15k on their books rather than a 'worthless' disputed account.

[cupcake68]

Hi

 

The long term is my only real reason for questioning this. Obviously £5 per month is a great result but £1400 further down the line will probably still be a lot of money to me and I do not want to have shot myself in the foot at this stage in a rush to get it settled.

 

I do have a bank account and I will ensure the SO set up some time before it is due in case of any problems.

 

Thank you all for your great advice on this and many of my other threads.

 

Cupcake

[gh2008]

To put this into perspective it's the difference between repaying the debt in full over 230 years or 250 years

 

I'm not sure that it really matters does it??? Forget 'the principle of it' just take the offer before it becomes more realistic!!

[cupcake68]

So do I need to worry about the wrong court being on the document or do I just sign and send back?

 

Cupcake

[Bigdebtor]

Cupcake

 

I agree that this is not worth jeopardising the (pretty good!) deal for - but given they will probably want to offer ( or you will want to offer them?) a low F&F in a few months' or years' time then (once your finances are better?) then it is worth a small bit of effort to try to get the balancve agreed at the earlier amount.

 

Even at 10 -25% F&F this will save you a few hundred pounds of your own money in future.

 

With this in mind why not send a "nice" letter to Uncle Bryan along lines of:

 

Thank you for your letter of XXX. I am pleased to accept your offer of £5 per month in principle with immediate effect and enclose my first payment in the form of cheque no. xxxxx. I propose to set up a Monthly Standing Order Mandate for £5 per month to be paid into the account in the name of XXXXX at Sharks Unlimited Bank plc, Sort Code: Xx XX Xx, Account No. XXXXXXXX starting on XX March 2011. I say I accept this offer in principle as I would ask that you confirm how you have arrived at the current balance as stated by you.

 

According to earlier correspondence the amount outstanding on XX/xX/xxxx was £xxxxx.xx but you have now stated the balance currently outstanding is for £xxxxxx.xx - i.e. some £xxxx.xx more than I was anticipating. Since it is agreed that I shall not be liable for costs I am somewhat confused as to how the balance has grown in the interim and would be grateful if you would check this out and if you still feel your new higher balance is correct I would appreciate your clarifying the reasons for this increase before it is time for the first payment to be met by monthly standing order with the first payment leaving my account on Xx March 2011 and all future payments to be made on the xxth of the month or, wher ethis is not a bank business day, the earliest subsequent bank business day.

 

Hope this helps?

 

BD

[cupcake68]

Thanks BD

 

I will do as you suggested being as I need to ask them to correct the order anyway!

 

Cupcake

[cupcake68]

Hi Guys

 

I have just sent a chase letter to BC because I have not had a corrected order through to sign or any response to my last letter but the cheque I sent for the first monthly payment was cashed!

 

I have also spoken to the court today who cpnfirm they have not been doing anything sneaky behind my back. I have sent copies of all correspondence tp both the court and Egg just to make sure evryone is aware of the current situation.

 

Can I just ask one question that is bothering me ?

 

If Egg are the Claimants do they definitely still own the debt or could BC have bought it from them?

 

The reason I ask is in BC's letter accepting my offer they did not say at any point they have consulted with their client it just said they are willing to accept!

 

Thanks

 

Cupcake

[cupcake68]

Hi

 

Reply from BC today.

 

Includes a copy of the same consent order (still stating Bristol County Court and Maidstone County Court and the same figure). Attached is a compliment slip with a hand written note.

 

"Please sign and return the attached consent order. Once we have received this we will forward to the court for it to be sealed. Look forward to hearing from you."

 

What a load of muppets?!!!

 

They have totally ignored my letter explaining that I was confused why it would say Bristol County Court and no surprise they have also ignored my request for a breakdown of charges!!!!

 

Would I get into any trouble for signing an order that mentions a different court?

 

Thanks

 

Cupcake

[Bigdebtor]

Cupcake

 

I would not sign something that's wrong - as a matter of principle I would give them as much extra work as possible and just write again pointing out their mistake once more - enclosing a further copy of the last letter which told them - and asking again for the breakdown of charges.

 

JMHO.

 

BD

[cupcake68]

Thanks for the advice BD

 

Did you see my post before last?

 

I am wondering if BC own this debt and I'm not sure what that means for me ?

 

Cupcake

[Bigdebtor]

BC tend to be Egg's tame lawyers - along with Fredrericksons who are Egg's heavy mob.

 

I doubt if they own this debt as I don't think that's their normal modus operandi - and if they do now own it then you should have got an NOA (from Egg) - and if they don't own it then they need to have EGG take you to court - not just BC alone.

 

I would just concentrate on making them woirk for any money Egg give them as suggested above - keeping copies of ALL correspondence, envelopes etc.

 

BD

 

v

[cupcake68]

It states on the court docs that Egg is the claimant but BC seem to be making all the decisions.

 

I can't actually believe Egg would pay for the service BC give - the are worse than useless!!

 

Cupcake

[cupcake68]

Sorry Guys !

 

But I need a little extra advice on this one please....

 

Have finally received a consent order that doesn't have the wrong court stated on it but...

 

The amount they state still leaves me a little confused.

 

They have sent a two breakdowns now.

 

The first gave an original debt of 14698.58

They then added the following fees

 

Claim Fee 190.00

Claim Cost 100.00

Alloc Quest 300.00

Final hearing -100.00

Final Hearing 100.00

Alloc Quest -100.00

Balance 15188.58

 

I wrote back asking them to clarify where the original 14698 came from because the last statement from Egg listed as follows

 

Opening Balance 14698.58

Charge off Account -13738.33

Refund of Interest -960.25

 

Closing balance 0.00

 

Now I did not have any correspondence with Egg at the time of this account being charged off so i always assumed they refunded the interest because they had made some mistake along the way but if they chose to charge off the account at 13738 is that not what I should be paying (why would I pay the extra 960 when Egg have refunded it to my account?) and my agreement with BC was that we paid our own costs. Does this not mean that all these charges they have added should be removed?

 

I hope this makes sense!

 

Cupcake