Terraferma
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Afternoon All, I owe around £1k to HMRC I have written to them to explain that I am only earning a very small amount of money and in receipt of tax credits. At the moment my outgoings are higher than my income by quite some margin. I've paid a small amount towards the debt directly to HMRC (£25) on their website and offered to pay a regularly monthly amount in my letter directly to them, no response. I sent my letter by recorded delivery, so I know it was received but nothing back. Now I'm getting letters from their debt collecting solicitors Drysden Fairfax. They're obviously written to play on peoples ignorance of the law, insinuating they'll seize goods etc, but there is not CCJ summons, its just a threatening letter. My understanding is until this goes to CCJ they don't have any power to recover this beyond writing threatening letters. I assume if I engage with these solicitors I have to pay my debt plus their fees? My questions are, can I still deal directly with HMRC or do I have to deal with their debt collectors. Or do HMRC stop dealing with your account whilst its been given to this company? They've already threatened to take me to court three times and given three deadlines which they haven't kept. Would they take me to court for £1k? How long before they would actually take me to court? Can they do so when I have paid money and offered to pay money, the most I can afford.. Thank you. .
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Excellent. Thank you. So, if a bailiff has not had access to your property and on the the alleged visitations you have not been in, then a 'levy' has not occurred. So trying to charge for a levy in that case would be classed as charging for work not carried out, which is attempted fraud?
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Can anyone help clarify exactly what 'LEVY' means in relation to a liability order. My understanding is that it describes collection of monies or goods, or cataloging of goods to be collected at a later date if you don't agree a payment with the bailiff. So in order to 'levy' goods, you would need to be able to get inside a property?
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HA. Brilliant, you're smart. Yes, just been on their quick-pay website, and it says: https://ip.e-paycapita.com/
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I would rather not say on the public forum, I'd be highly surprised if Equita didn't monitor these forums, I would if I were them. And gives them a bit of an edge if they can see what advice I am getting in relation to my complaint.
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Tried that, nothing coming up of any merit. sensible approach, do they give that information out over the phone? One thing I have not found to date is that my LA are helpful. Would be great if you can. I've complained formally to both Equita and the LA. I don't expect Equita to be compliant or responsive. In fact, i don't really expect either party to be responsive to this from my experience to date. For this reason, I have involved my local MP and his office being very helpful/supportive helping me in the background. They have offered to contact both parties on my behalf, to date I have no asked them to so holding them back to see how both react to just me before. I am about to ask them to do so now. I am also due to meet him to discuss the wider problem and what can be done from a national government perspective (not expecting huge traction here, but if no one tries, nothing happens, right?) The more accurate, well researched information I have at my disposal the better I can deal with the LA/Equita's counter arguments and the less wriggle room they have in the first place. At the moment, the LA have essentially put in writing that fees is not their business but a matter between debtor and Equita/bailiff. Despite the fact they know I am unhappy they did not offer any recourse or suggest I could make a complaint to them but directed me to speak with Equita directly. I understand from the above, this is not the case and they DO have a duty of care. From what I can see Equita are making a deliberate attempt to charge unlawful / excessive fees by multiple fee charging and charging for work not carried out (in my case). If they have done this to me, there is a very good change this is a wide-spread problem or even a standard policy to see what they can get away with. Anything else to add to the above? I also understand they cannot charge a levy charge if a levy did not take place, but I cannot find the specific reference to this in the legislation, quote would be handy indeed.
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Thanks for the links, both. Interesting, how can I find out if my LA back office is run by Capita?
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At least I am in the lucky position to challenge their fees before they've been paid, i.e. they're not holding all the cards by with-holding the debt from the LA in order to get their fees first. Sorry for ignorance, but what is: Civea & MOJ? It's also worth noting, the local authority have said on several occasions, the fees are between me and the bailiff. They again in their formal response to my complaint said I would need to complain to equita if i disagreed with the fees. Is that correct, do they not have a duty of care that their subcontractors act in a fair and legal way?
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Just to clarify, they can only charge the statutory visitation fees for a certified bailiff coming to levy. Do you know what part of the law states that, I want to include in my complaint. Thanks,
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Well, a visit needs to be from a certified bailiff and they need to show you ID and give you the opportunity to check the register that they are certified. Otherwise they have no legal power or right to levy anything. And they can only charge for a visit from a bailiff. If you are not there, they are legally required to leave a note to say they have called, they did not do this on the second call. On the first visit the letter has one single line from a biro, anyone could do, I would argue very hard that it should be a proper varifiable signiture, otherwise they could pay some minimum wage person to go around posting the letters with no intention to speak to you or levy goods but charge you a fee for attendance to levy. Which is I suspect exactly what they do. The onus is surely on them to prove to me that a bailiff attended. If it was a certified bailiff, why not sign it in a way they could later prove rather than a single line.
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The first visit was not to levy, it was just someone dropping off a letter. They didn't even ring the bell. My thoughts were to say that at best, they could charge an additional £24.50 for the second liability order, assuming it is possible to charge multiple fees. My understanding was they could not.
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Sorry, to clarify: They are trying to charge the fees x 3, so the total fees are just over £230. The first visitation was essentially a letter drop, the letter was generic made no reference to the outstanding amount or which liabiliy order they were enforcing, just said I should contact the bailiff (mobile and name given) and not doing so would be considered a refusal to pay. It had no signature on it from the bailiff, just a printed one from the back officer manager who generated it. Whoever delivered it did not ring the bell, they must have got access to the communal areas by following a resident in. Given they made no attempt to speak to me, I consider this a letter not a visit to levy. The second visit was at 7am and I was not in, the curtains were drawn so they couldn't peer in and list any goods. Nothing was levied, they had no access to my property. They left no card, I have no real proof a certified bailiff or anyone from equita actually came. The only reason I know is because I spoke to the bailiff on the phone. I made a formal complaint to the LA that day, the account was put on hold, before it was live again I paid the outstanding debt to the LA directly.
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the account was for three different amounts I was unaware of. There are two liability orders, one from 2012 and one from 2013, with three different amounts of money but they were all passed to the bailiff at the same time. I was under the impression it was just one liability order from last year. They charged the following. Visit one: £24.50 Visit two: £18.00 Levy fee: c£30.00 each. The first visit was to drop off the initial letter, I was in and the bell was not rung. They just hand delievered it, so no way of knowing it was a certified bailiff. Second visit I was not in and they did not leave a card or any note to say they had been there. Nothing was levied as I paid direct, curtains are always drawn, they have not been in my house.
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I'm a bit confused, I didn't think they could enforce their fees once the outstanding debt was satisfied.
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Thanks everyone for the helpful response. So you're saying that if I now left my window open, they could get in and try to take goods for their fees under the liability order that has been satisfied?
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Thanks for your reply renegadeimp. I've already done this and offered to pay £24.50 both via email and in writing, had no response in the past 5 days. My question is, if say I pay £24.50 on their website and write to them saying I consider the matter settled in full, what can they do about the remaining fees they're trying to charge? What is the legal status if I refuse to pay? Can they enforce? Would they need to go to small claims?
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Hi There, I had some outstanding council tax (CT) which ended in a liability order (LO) being raised, I was unaware of court action (and have complained formerly to council), in the meantime bailiffs were instructed. Once I was aware of the LO I paid the CT and court costs in full, directly to the local authority. Their Bailiffs (Equita) now trying to charge £250, which is only slightly less than the debt council tax and court fees. The Bailiff only came to my house once before I paid, I was not in. Obviously did not actually collect the debt. From what I can see online, they can only charge £24.50 for a visitation, no idea what the additional cost is, I have requested a breakdown which has not been forthcoming. £250 is a 920% inflation on the above charge. My understanding is that the LO is for the CT and court fees, so once they have been paid in full, the LO is no longer valid / live. That being the case, I'm I right in assuming that they have no way to enforce their fees unless they take me to the small claims court?
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