If an account enters a default situation owing to the failure of a company to supply a copy of the agreement, unfortunately this default only lasts until such a time that they can supply a copy of the agreement. Once they have supplied such a copy, the account once again becomes enforceable (so long as it conforms to the statutory standards). There is much debate regarding what does and does not count as enforcement. My personal view is that selling the debt would be unlikely to constitute enforcement in the eyes of the court (but this is my view and I may be wrong). Is there any chance you could scan in and post up the "agreement" they have sent you (removing all personal information) so that members can assess whether it may or may not be enforceable? Cheers. UF __________________ I am a first year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. If you are in doubt, always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

OK well I don't personally think that is anywhere near enforceable.... but please wait for other more experienced members to come along and give their opinion. I'm simply writing a letter as explained in my last thread.... I'll post up a rough copy shortly when I've finished. Alternatively there is a letter posted by another member in my thread. Hope this helps. Cheers. UF __________________ I am a first year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. If you are in doubt, always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

No problem! It's just that if we can see it then people can assess whether it conforms to the relevant statutory standards or not. I suspect it may be very similar to my thread that I linked to earlier. So yes, if you can post it up and we'll see what's what. Cheers. UF

Have they ever actually sent you a copy of anything purporting to be a credit agreement? If they have then could you scan it and post it up (removing all personal information) so that we can take a look at it? Cheers. UF

Had basically exactly the same letter from them with regards to my thread: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/238350-me-mine-cabot-crap.html I'm just writing to them stating that I disagree with their contentions and that we have set our final position clearly. I'm also stating that I feel a infinite game of letter tennis would be pointless and so I shall not respond to their letters etc unless they bring something new into the equation. UF

This is the thread where we applied to have a statutory demand set aside: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/162489-statutory-demand-stature-barred.html All of the forms you need were posted by 42man with all information. But wait because more experienced members will surely be along soon.

OK. If you last made a payment in 2003 then this debt would be statute barred by the Limitation Act 1980. If this is the case then you can apply to the County Court to have this statutory demand set aside. I have done this in the past. I'll dig out the paperwork and post it up for you so that if this is the case then you can inform the organisation that served this stat demand on you that you have applied to the court to have this set aside. Then put them to strict proof that the statutory demand is not statute barred. Unless of course they did have a CCJ, in which case they would have to explain to the court why they have taken so long to act upon it. It really is important when you last made a payment and whether they have obtained a CCJ or not. I've only done this once in the past, but other members who are more versed in this will be along shortly. Cheers. UF

When did you last make a payment or make a written acknowledgement on this account? Cheers. UF

OK firstly, what is the debt for (credit card/overdraft etc)? Secondly, has the Original Creditor already obtained a CCJ against your partner? In answer to your questions, I believe they can obtain a charging order against a jointly owned property, but I may be wrong... someone will come along and confirm this for you shortly. With regards to a full and final settlement offer, I have always gone it at between 10 and 20% and see what they say. Others that have done this more often than myself will post as well, I'm sure. More people will be along with advice shortly, but it might help people if you could scan in and post up the letter they've sent you (delete all personal details first)... that way people have more information on which to advise. Hope this helps. Cheers. UF

You'll soon be relishing the chance to take on these bullies, believe me we all started where you are and this forum will help you realise your strength!!

It just shows you how arrogant these people really are RedEst!! Nothing shocks me any more with these people!! They have no legal power whatsoever to demand that you answer their questions! They seem to think they are kings and can do/say/demand whatever they want!!

Oh my god!! I actually cannot believe the arrogance of that response!! Demanding that you answer all of their questions in what is, in my personal opinion, nothing more than a dirty deceitful attempt to get you to admit liability!! Whatever you do, do NOT answer their questions!!!!!!! Someone with more info and experience with this company will be along shortly, I'm sure!! Cheers UF

Thanks for the replies everyone..... that is exactly what I thought tbh.... it's just always helpful to have other peoples thoughts on these issues as well I'll edit the letter posted above and see what they come back with.... tbh I think I might put a paragraph at the end stating that this will be our final response and that they are free to take us to court if they so wish.... but that we will vigorously defend!!! As I said in an earlier post, I really can't be bothered to get into a game of letter tennis with them, which I know they seem to really like. So I shall just tell them, in no uncertain terms, to bring it on (so to speak) Cheers again everyone. UF

BUMP Any thoughts anyone? Cheers. UF

OK, we've had another letter from CrapPot on this matter. Some of it is quite amusing; such as the part where they say that the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations do not apply to this matter..... and then actually quote the section of the Consumer Credit Act that clearly states that they DO apply to this matter!!!! I've posted the letter (2 pages) below for you all to look at. I've already told them in no uncertain terms to start proceedings.... but as always they appear reluctant, instead hoping that we will cave when they start with their bulls**t The bit that is, at the moment, worrying me slightly is that they have made referrence to S189(4) of the CCA; that says that "A document embodies a provision if the provision is set out either in the document itself or in another document referred to in it." Can anyone offer any advice on the above issue? Or indeed, any advice on this overall? Many thanks everyone. Cheers. UF

No I don't think so..... but all these rotton companies are in cahoots, of that I'm sure!!

Because one desk in the Capquest office doesn't know what the threat-monkey on the next desk is doing in the Capquest office!! It's a standard Capquest tactic to try and confuse, boggle, annoy, frustrate, harass and intimidate people through behaviour such as this. File under "I" for Ignore for now See what comes next. Cheers. UF

How long is left on the tenancy? Depending on the terms of the lease, could you not start proceedings to have the tenant evicted now for breach of contract, in so much as they have failed to pay their rent? Just a thought, someone that knows more will be along soon though. I haven't heard of a DCA asking people to go to their offices; but I sure as hell is hot would not ever take a DCA up on such an "offer"!! Knowing the dirty tricks they employ even when they are on the phone or on someone's doorstep, can you imagine how much worse that would be if the alleged debtor was in the dirty DCA offices?!!? Finally, what debt exactly is it this company are chasing for? And have you made cca requests to all of the relevant debts that you can make this request to (credit cards, loans etc)? Cheers. UF

Hmmm.... when I go back next week, I'll speak to my lecturer.... I'm only in the first year so maybe it's something we learn about later on. As has been said, this is surely doomed to fail in the context of debts etc. But still something I would be interested to learn about.

I was thinking that.... I'm studying contract law at degree level at the moment and I can't see any reference to novation in any of my text books!! Now I know why Cheers. UF

Looks too good to be true. I wouldn't trust that information as far as I could throw the person who came up with it.

OK. Firstly, when you say liability has been confirmed etc.... do you mean simply because she has been paying them? Because if so, then this does not prove liability. If she hasn't already done so, I would send a CCA request to ensure that all the paperwork etc is in order. Secondly, the OFT guidelines on debt collection state that DCA's must not try to make debtors pay more than they can reasonably afford. Lastly, the DCA can ask her to provide such details; BUT SHE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO REFUSE!! I have never and will never give these people my personal details. But that is just my stance on this particular issue. If she hasn't made a cca request, then that would definitely be my first move. And then take it from there. Once she has sent the request, after 14 working days (12 days + 2) the account will be in default and they cannot (or should not) take any action to enforce it until they come up with the relevant paperwork. Let me know if you need the cca request letter and I'll post it up. Hope this helps. Cheers. UF

Cheers, everyone.... that's kinda what I meant.... Typically of me I managed to word it entirely wrong. Thanks for clearing that up. Cheers. UF

OMG is that a typo?? A £15 debt being increased to £1300 by charges???

Absolutely could not agree more!! DCA's will try any number of dirty tactics! I'm all for raising awareness of these issues Cheers. UF