Hi, Sent CCA request on 7th to Debt managers ltd in repect of a next catalogue acc. Have received this (no scanner at mo so will type - soz if any typo's missed). Letterhead from DML with tickbox titled "others. please find attached copy agreement. we look forward to receiving your proposals for payment". Letterhead from Next stating " We have previously supplied you with or please find enclosed a true copy of the credit agreement. We are satisfied that this meets with our obligations under section 78 of the consumer credit act. The correct interpretation as to "copy" requires reference to section 189 (for the definition of copy) and secondly to section 180 relating to the consumer credit (cancellation notices and copies of documents) regulations 1983 (the REGULATIONS). Looking at section 3(1) of the regulations it is clear that "...every copy of an executed agreement...shall be a true copy thereof...". Section 3(2) confirms that a "true copy" need not include the items listed at sub-sections (a) to (d), as applicable. Of particular relevance are subsections (a) and (b). These two sections confirm that (i) non-statuory information included for the creditor's own benefit and (ii) signature boxes need not be included in the true copy. Based on this analysis, it is accepted as a matter of good law that a "copy" for the purposes of section 78 need not be an exact copy or photocopy, as long as the true copy provided contains every material provision of the agreement signed. In light of this, and in absence of any evidence to suggest that the account holder did not order/receive the goods delivered, Next will continue to seek payment of the balance of £xxx.xx owed by the account holder. A default entry will therefore be made on the credit reference file, which may affect the ability to obtain credit in the future. Making payment to clear the balance will enable the credit files to show as satisfied. Yours Sincerely, R Chamberlain." ok, Then attached to that letter was a photocopy of a blank (ie no sig, no add, no acc number etc) agreement. Any advice please MOST gratefully received as the jargon given in their letter has kinda confused me (which i guess is their plan) beings as i am not at all legally in the know! Many thanks again. Mpols x

Hi again fox - Ave already been following it! We are both waiting for the merest hint of a CCA and secretly hoping they don't have one:wink: You got that right! Time will tell!

:)Ok ODC - Many many thanks - will keep copies of letters safe & wait to see what responses we have to us witholding payments at the end of this month! Soz to sound sooo like a twerp but been a kinda naff few days so was starting to question where i was at with it all ( have been trying to sort hubbys as well as mine). Anyways, thanks hun again! Hi Fox - Told u weren't much to show lol - but ur very welcome nonetheless!

Share & share alike - all friends here from what i can tell lol Not much on my Lowells one yet but a bit more on my Cabot (Doh!). Happy reading hun! Mpols x

Thanks for prompt reply ODC - so in ur opinion - we shouldn't have to worry bout sending next letter? & I can withold payment now as well i believe? Thats brill news thankyou (saves me the squid rec delivery fee at least). Soz to squat on ur thread fox - have got me own but just wanted to jump in whilst had the chance quickly beings as in similar position at the mo! Thanks again. Mpols x

Evening peeps, Have acc in dis letter ready to go tomoz but wondering whether to send or not after comments in another thread advising me to sit tight with these jokers as they will apparently send another couple standard letters then close files - Just wondering though that at least if we do send dispute letter, that it shows (for the record if ness) that we are aware of certain rights/obligations and that is why we will be withholding payments until the agreement is proven enforceable? (If that makes any sense ) We are in same boat with Cabot & Debt managers ltd at the moment as well ( all waiting (unsigned) to be sent in the morning). Would welcome any opinions if poss please? Many thanks as always! Mpols x

Evening - Have printed off all Acc in dis letters for our 4 main DCA's that have defaulted on cca requests ( info in our other threads) & are ready to send tomoz but second thoughts now due to above comment (ta fiftypence)... Has any1 else an opinion please? Cheers all. Mpols x

Hi, We received Zackly that (obviously diff amounts) wording etc couple days ago - they default on CCA request today if nothing in post so we planing to send em acc in dispute letter & see what response we get (if any). Gd luck with urs. Mpols x

Update: Acc in dispute letter sent this pm rec' delivery. Any advice as to what i do next please? Thanks as ever. Mpols x

Fingers xed noomill060 Mpols x

Thanks peeps - enough shared opinion to make me smile easy for a bit. Will see what might arrive in post today or tomoz from these or any of the other DCA's we CCA'd on the 7th. Mpols x

Thanks Berrylover - thats kinda what i figured. Will send them the Acc in dispute letter if not heard received cca of them after tomorrow & will not reply to this f&f letter Mpols x

Morning peeps, Lowell (originally creation consumer finance) CCA'd em on 7th - two replies so far stating requested info from original lender then this yest: "Following your recent request .....blah....i can confirm our client CCF has requested that your credit agreement be retrieved from archive. Once retrieved you will be required to repay outstanding balance in full. If deemed necessary, we may iniate legal proceedings which could eventually see your outstanding balance increase....blah...In an attempt to resolve matter amicably i would like to offer you a settlement...As long as payment is with us by 26/11 am willing to accept £###.## as F& F on your acc. If payment not received withing the time we reserve the right to proceed to collect the full balance....Call number below..blah..." Am assummin that their way of thinking is to try and get the smaller amount from us as opposed to nada because they can't provide the agreement? The smaller amount is approx a third of what they say is outstanding but still wouldn't be possible to find that amount with 2 days notice, if at all to be honest, & wondering if is just irony that they want settlement by the same day that they default on cca request? Also - they seem very defensive with the whole "once agreement is retrieved you will have to pay balance in full" - Why? They not had problem with the payments they been getting the last lord knows how many months & surely we could simply be requesting our details in order to update our records & affairs in the current economic climate? Anyways, Thanks as always. Mpols x

seemed a tad premature

Thats kinda what i figured after seeing similar if not exact wording in other posts. Is it from cca default date that i stop offering payment? wasn't 100% sure..... Mpols x

What the hell has the "goverment" got to do with Consumer Credit? If you really want to know who steals money from the Government, I will tell you. The banking and finance industry steals from the Government. When a credit card company or bank lends money to an individual, a contract is signed. Or, at least should be signed. The individual is bound not only by honour, but by law, to adhere to that agreement. What is the lender obliged to adhere to? At the first sign of trouble, at the very first sign that this may have been a poor business choice, the lending institution will close the account, fire the debtor, and claim the balance in tax relief. That is right. They will make the rest of society responsible for their mistake. Or, at least, their possible mistake. There is no proof whatsover that if the lending institution had behaved like a proper business and been prepared to work with the borrower through his rough patch, that the account would not have been brought back into order. Making further profits for the lender, and saving the Government from an unnecessary loss. Although, of course, it is never the Government that really does take the loss, is it? It is the long suffering taxpayer who subsidises both Government insanity, and the treachery of ponces and leeches such as the banking industry. That is what a bank or lending institution really is. A blown up version of Arthur Daley or Del Boy Trotter. They are inherently immoral, treacherous and dishonest. The only phenomenon worse than these parasites are the bottom feeding **** who buy up these reject accounts that the banks will no longer deal with. Because it is too much like hard work to run an honest business, and too easy to live at everyone else's expense. These loathsome organizations then bully, harass, threaten and abuse the already beleaguered debtor, trying to coerce them into parting with what they can ill afford to part with. These savages are the regression of thinking man back to the level of the animal. They, and their practices, have absolutely no place in a civilized and evolved society. They have taken their gift of human life, and thrown it away, choosing to live only at the level of baseness, greed, and subhuman malevolence. Are you looking in the mirror, Mr Troll?. SH, You did it again! Darn i wish i'd known you at college - reckon you could have been big help with my sociololgy essays. Lol! Mpols x

Morning peeps, blimey it's cold!! Anyway, quick update. Latest letter from my friends stating: Although they have requesed the information, the original lender is experiencing a delay in retrieving the information from it's archives & that they will send the info to me as soon as they receive it. As a gesture of goodwill they will put my acc on hold until they receive further comms from the original lender. Ok, next stage is for me to send Acc in dispute letter as far as im aware? Their 12+2 (working) days is up tomoz. Take care all. x

Morning MrT

Oh dear.

Rory32 & Postggj - Good day to you both

With respect, Haribo88, i am rather disappointed with your statement, particuarly as it completely contradicts my personal experience with this company & whilst i appreciate each individuals' right to an opinion, please do not feel it is neccessary for you to share any more on a thread concerning my situation when clearly i am not 'burying my head' whatsoever - rest assured (for cabot at least), i will in fact be rearing it quite ugly instead - armed with a better understanding of my legal rights & personal capabillities as well.

Hey Tiggs, Am only just starting on my journey here & already feel so at home with so much friendly advice, but have been following ur thread as i also suffer quite severe panic attacks (not easy at best of time but spesh not when littl'uns are around wondering whats wrong with mummy), so was thinking of you this afternoon & willing you to do well! Am sooooooo chuffed for you for your success!! & also, altho' have to confess to not knowing anyone very well on here yet, am quite choked up at how sincerely they have supported you! Congratulations again & thankyou for being such an inspiration hunny! Best wishes (& make sure you enjoy that well deserved wine ) MPols x

Have so far not received anything from all 7 DCA's that sent CCA requests too - am soooo hoping they all default so we don't have to pay them on the 28th! will mean a little extra for filling the freezer for once!

monday pm it is then cheers PGH, Julie x

red carpet chanting his