Cap1 & CCA return

[davefirewalker]

A CCA request means that they have to send you a copy of the agreement

 

any terms and conditions

 

They should have also sent you a statement of account

 

There should be a section on default charges etc. these are not on the doc so these would probably be on the t&c

 

until these conditions are met they have not complied with your request.

 

and I would certainley tell them as much

 

might give you a few days more grace to try and find an answer to this

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

maybe something like this........

 

edit it to your own case

 

-----------------------

I refer to my letters dated XXXXXXXX which was delivered via recorded delivery to your offices on XXXXXXXX, and my follow up letter dated XXXXXXXX.

 

In my letter xxxxxxI made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above numbered XXXXXXXX account under section 77(1) and section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act. In addition a statement of my account should have been sent along with any other document mentioned in the credit agreement.

 

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enter into a default situation. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days, Your company commit an offence. These time limits expired on XXXXXXXX and XXXXXXXX respectively.

 

As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

 

If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

Therefore as at XXXXXXXX this account became unenforceable at law and it is now my intention to refer this matter to the enforcement authorities.

 

Any default notices or adverse comments your company have recorded on my credit reference file should be immediately removed.

 

Failure to respond favourably to this letter within seven (7) days of receipt will result in immediate litigation being commenced against your company without further notice.

 

I await your rapid response.

 

---------------------

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

I dont know at what stage you are upto.....or ifthey have breached the 30 day limit, so you def need to edit it

 

or prehaps someone can suggest something else ?

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

how does this sound??

 

 

I refer to my letter dated 05/04/07 which was delivered via recorded delivery to your offices on 08/04/07.

In my letter 05/04/07 I made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above numbered xxxxxxx account under section 77(1) and section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act. In addition a statement of my account and terms and conditions should have been sent along with any other document mentioned in the credit agreement.

 

This request was not met in full and I am missing important information

 

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enter into a default situation. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days, Your company commit an offence. These time limits will expire on 19/04/07 and 19/05/07 respectively.

 

As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

Any enforcement action that you undertake while not complying with my request is unenforceable and may even be an offence.

 

you now appear to be in default and as such, any action regarding enforcement of this account must cease. including but not limited to processing of data.

 

Any default notices or adverse comments your company have recorded on my credit reference file should be immediately removed.

 

I await your rapid response.

 

try this one

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

intersting problem on the other cca thread.

 

prescibed terms.........what are they and how should they be presented.

ok I think we all know what they are, but presentation?

 

specifically the term "repayments".

 

I have an agreement and it does not mention repayments anywhere.

 

neither is there a heading repayments.

 

it does mention installments, payments, but not SPECIFICALLY "repayments"

 

any thoughts

 

Dave

 

 

Any thoughts on this?

Dave

[davefirewalker]

Cankster

 

Personally speaking.....I think if youve got them to waive the debt that is a win.

 

Going after them for any money you have given them I think is a bit of a no brainer. It depends on everyone's circumstances and how the company have treated you, and how good you feel your chances are!

 

but you've had the money...spent it...enjoyed it, and dont have to pay it back. thats a win. I dont presume to know what a judge will say, but can imagine he may not look too favourably on it.

 

if you do go to court and lose...............?

 

My opinion is its a step too far. you've won ...let it go

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

Hi Pam

 

A ver nice man has sent me a copy of the 1553 regs would you like a copy.

Send me a email and i will send it return

 

Regards

Peter

 

 

DAMMMM

 

ive just paid £6.10 TODAY for a copy......

 

Was going to pdf them and post em......grrrrr

 

ah well never mind

 

ps wanna see a REALLY crap agreement. NO T&C supplied either

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-763464.html

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

hmmmmm just ran it past the fas checker and it came back 13%

 

strange.

 

what is the variation allowed in calculating apr?

 

what was the base rate?

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

Apr has to be calculated from something. usually a base rate something like

"fantastic loan" @10% (APR 12.5%) etc...or have I got it wrong again

I have an agreement where both are visible mind you the rate may be variable which could explain it

 

dave

[davefirewalker]

Peter

you are in fine form today.......

 

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

Hi Uni

Funny you should ask because i have a very rare and particular skill.

Having had so many kids and grandchildren and sibblings of different ages i am wait for it.

Yes i am able to give the precise age of anyone just by finding out what childrens tv program they used to watch in ther first school years,Cool eh.

 

Now with me it was Tales of the River Bank and Supercar. I recon pam was a Muffin the Mule(probably before your time), batt and Ladybird are Deffinately Thunderbirds what do you think.

 

P.S its gone very quiet maybe to quiet!!!

 

Curioser and curioser

 

Petr

 

dont forget fireball xl5...how old am I ?

[davefirewalker]

Perseus, the link is missing?

 

Guy's can we please get back on track!

 

As you know MS are in Criminal Default:-

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/82841-angry-cat-morgan-stanley.html?highlight=angry+cat#post740352

 

I have reported the Offence to TS

MS are reliant on 1983 regs regulation 3

TS say that MS have not complied due to 1983 Regs reg 7

 

TS informed MS that they should write to me setting out their view and that if I had not received this communication within 10 days, then I should re-contact TS.

Well the 10 days are now up and of course I have not received anything from MS (I didn't think that I would!)

 

Tomorrow, I will ring TS and I really want to put the pressure on them.

Previously TS have stated that they will not, cannot prosecute due to a lack of established case law.

 

I have found the following:-

DTI v Lloyds Tsb

Office of Fair Trading v Lloyds TSB Bank Plc & Ors [2006] EWCA Civ 268 (22 March 2006)

and

wilson v secretary of state

House of Lords - Wilson and others v. Secretary of State for Trade and Industry (Appellant)

 

If any of you guys can come up with any brilliant ideas then I would be most grateful. If I can put TS into a position whereby they retreat...I need a plan.

 

AC

 

 

Hi AC

 

I'm almost in the same boat with MS, not quite as far as you though.

 

they sent me a crap application and admitted as much, and when challenged came back with the same reg 3 argument. Ive told them to put up or shut up, and am waiting for a response.

 

dave

[davefirewalker]

yes please

[davefirewalker]

Ok then another thought

 

It has been mentioned before somewhere on this massive thread but I can't find it as yet.

 

MORALLY I have had the use of the money, and I won't argue the fact I owe it.......

 

they have for all intents and purposes NO agreement.

 

Would I be entitled to go after ALL the interest they have ever took....?

 

my cc limit was about £4000 and I have only been making minimum payments (I couldnt afford anything else)

 

I have had this card since 1999, and stopped using it about 2001.

 

looking at the statements at least £55 of my payment was interest

 

(quick calculation) 6 years x £55 /month = £3960.

 

The principal has been well paid off................

 

What do you reckon ?????

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

As far as I can see .....yes

 

Once you have issued the cca request any action should be frozen until they supply you with the paperwork. There is a chance that they do not have the correct paperwork, and so can't enforce the debt.

 

An SAR will get you all the info what they hold on you and may show the correct ammounts. Although a CCa request should show your current balance and what is owing as well.

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

KFDH1962

 

 

I would add to the bottom

 

I would also request at this point that you provide me with a true copy of my agreement and any other documents relating to my request, As is my right under the consumer credit act 1974 s77(1) + s78 (1) You have a duty to supply this information if you are the original creditor or not as per S189 of the CCA 1974.

 

I enclose the statutory fee of £1.00 and hope to hear from you in a timely manner.

 

Until you can confirm or deny the true state of account and provide me with a true copy of the original agreement, i consider this account to be in dispute and as such I expect you not to process any further data or pass data on to third parties until this is settled.

 

yours etc

 

anyone else? any ideas

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

you cant ask for or they will not give you the deed of asignment. this has been discussed previously. the bits in red I had already adressed, and its a case of either / or. the only bit I can see I missed was the executed part

 

I wouldnt tell them the timescale...they know it and if they dont then thats better. I addressed that in "i expect a reply in a timely manner"

 

but 9/10 for effort... :-)

 

best rgds

 

dave

[davefirewalker]

Awww shucks..

I tried

Thanks!

 

Ok I've got a question please...

 

Just drafting up a letter to Crap one, after supplying (after the 2nd request) a copy of the original application form - see post 6366 and 6367.

This account is closed, paid up, finished. Still on the CRA files, with a default due to ppi insurance company being late with payments for 6 months on the trot.

I've got approx £1500 in charges, default was lodged 5 months or so before it was paid off, Still haven't got complete S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) records from CAP1.

Would you reccommend another letter chasing the original CCA, whilst chasing up the SAR and stating I'll be looking for the default removed?

Effectively, I've got nothing to lose by chasing them all the way, everything to gain.

 

Any comments grateful.

 

thanks, and cheers Dave!

 

Perseus

 

Hi pers

its hard to know where to start here

I know sar is not full but have you had all your statements?

have you claimed the charges yet?

 

how long have they had the CCA?

 

basically the CCA would be my prime target. If they cant show an agreement you can kiss goodbye to the default. no agreement ...no default

 

I would concentrate on the charges and cca and when they pay you the charges back, if the agreement is anyway no good and uneforceable or improperly executed there is a chance that you can claim back any interest you've ever paid to them.

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

Hi everyone,

would appreciate anyones views on the reply to my CCA request these were the only two docs sent, but have a feeling it is valid:(

 

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w9/Themainman_bucket/Applicationform.jpg

 

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w9/Themainman_bucket/CCF27042007_00000.jpg

 

By rights they must supply you with a statement of account as well....but I'm sure they could knock one up easilly enough

Dont really know abouth the docs though....

 

two sigs

financial stuff

interest

rights to cancel

 

 

I'll have another look but it doesnt look promising.

 

On the plus side it does say it is an application.....

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

well it has to be a part of the document.......but a document can run to many pages. or it has to be referred to in the document (I think)

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

gosh he's right corn.....

[davefirewalker]

Most importantly it makes no reference to any terms and conditions.....

 

its an application form

[davefirewalker]

Anyone want to cast an eye over my thoughts on this

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-780736.html

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

Campari2

 

No, the regs allow them to send a copy without sigs etc etc, but for them to enforce it in a court of law they need the original docs. you may never find out if they have one until you take them on and see it in court.

 

Dave

[davefirewalker]

while writing the above post, something struck me........

 

They need the original doc to proceed to court. my agreement looks like a microfiche copy......I didnt sign a microfiche, I wonder if the have the original at all? or if theyve archived everthing to save space.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-757767.html

 

is a photocopy of an agreement good enough, photocopys can be doctored. in fact when you are applying for certain things you have to send original docs....photocopies wont do !!

 

or is my thinking gone awry again

 

Dave