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    • Strange final response. They say that they are still investigating but they are giving you their final response anyway. Seems like a load of nonsense. Have you got a copy of what you then sent to the ombudsman? Anyway, for the moment although would like to know – it really is all for curiosity because as you have put it into the hands of the ombudsman it's probably not worth doing anything more until you have a reply. I would suggest that when you decide to spend this kind of money in future on a used car, that you understand exactly what your rights are before you make the purchase. When you buy anything – and maybe especially used car you should realise that you aren't only paying for the car, you are also paying for a bundle of consumer obligations which are intended to bind the dealer. You are paying for a vehicle which is of satisfactory quality and remains that way for a reasonable period of time and you are paying for any defects which emerge to be addressed and repaired at the expense of the dealer. We've already pointed out that by purchasing the warranty, they have effectively persuaded you to pay for something for which you have already paid. Very decent of you not to want to cause trouble in respect of defects which manifested themselves within the first few weeks. I have no idea why. For £78,000…. This you say that they were age-related problems – that is still no reason why those defects should have been there or why the dealer should not have been responsible for them. It seems to me that you have a clear case against the dealer/the finance company. We don't have many or any PCP purchases on this forum. However, it seems to me that the finance company is probably responsible for the condition of the vehicle because effectively you have bought it from them and to that extent it should be the same as HP. With a hire purchase agreement, it is as if you bought the vehicle directly from the finance company not from the dealer and it is the finance company which bears all the consumer obligations. I think the only thing you can do is to monitor the situation. Update us when you hear from the financial ombudsman and if you need to take the matter to court then we will help you. In principle it should be straightforward – but certainly there is a risk of a serious bill for costs if you lose. I don't see you losing. Did you say somewhere that the report suggested that the vehicle was unroadworthy? Have you got the advertisement for the vehicle? Does it make claims for the vehicle which are clearly untrue? And by the way, four hours away from you is what kind of distance? Have you read our used car guide? Have you looked at the video?
    • there's one in this thread.. i wonder if its the same, they seem to be identical regardless each time we have a thread with one Vehicle Control Services Privacy Notice, Brooke Retail Car Park, HA4 0LN - Private Land Parking Enforcement - Consumer Action Group  
    • It was really this daft Privacy Notice we were after, but no worries, I'm 99% sure it doesn't count as a NTD otherwise in his letter Simple Simon wouldn't have offered the discount of paying £60 instead of £100. Apologies for jumping the gun earlier. It's a pity your friend paid.  It's neither here nor there if Excel would back down or not.  They are not some statutory authority.  They're just a cowboy private company.  The only way she could have been forced to pay is if a judge had ruled against her in a court hearing, which is highly unlikely given she could have proved to have been elsewhere. I see her "offence" was in May 2023 so logically Excel and their signs were there by then.
    • Thanks for your reply. Their final response was just an email (seemed a bit unprofessional) but FOS seem to have accepted it as their final response. So the issues that I realised within the first few weeks to me at the time seemed like age related stuff and I didn't want to cause trouble and in hindsight I realise I should have pressed harder but I think my heart was being used more than my brain at this point. And yes I now believe extended warranties aren't worth the paper they're printed on, in all fairness to the dealer they did sort these initial issues out when warranty wise rejected them. To touch on your questions, the car was purchased using PCP so deposit with 4 years of monthly payment then a balloon payment at the end or return the vehicle. My pcp agreement was on the basis of 10k miles per year but I think I've currently done 12k miles since Sept 2022 lol. Elite Inspections suggested FOS as stage probably because they're free so I took their advice. When I got the car it had an MOT around 4 months beforehand I believe My MOTS after have been done by private MOT garages (I guess they tend not to comment on panel alignment etc) As for defects from day one - please note they gave 6 month warranty through warranty wise but everything was rejected through them: Passenger side ambient lighting wasn't working (whole trim panel needed to be replaced - dealer paid) Engine would randomly shut the down completely (instead of start stop function) at traffic lights and junctions (software updated in the end - dealer paid) Sat nav screen would freeze/ stay off for a whole journey (intermittent fault, still not sorted/diagnosed) Boot stopped working (new battery needed - dealer paid) The A-pillar trim between the passenger door and windscreen was coming away from the car making a very loud whistling noise as you drive on the motorway ( dealer paid to replace but has come off twice since this repair which shows me the car has potentially bent out of shape so that panel won't go back on) initially was reported within 3 months of ownership and due to part shortages I held out for the parts to come back into stock which ended up taking 6-7 months (TECHNICALLY they had their first chance to fix, and within 2 months it went wrong again but the first repair was massively delayed due to part shortages) Seat belt warning wasn't working (not beeping if you drive without belt on - software reset dealer paid but really put me off from this point as it suggested car had been electronically tampered with) Sun roof was stuck open on one side due to a bent rail around 1 year after purchase - warranty company rejected due to it being pre existing fault apparently. Bodyshop repaired and from this point he pointed out the damage on the car but Alphera just wanted me to deal with Clinkard Clinkard were offering solutions which ended up with me losing nearly £40,000 in a year and them being able to sell another car to me at full price. It was this point I regretted being too nice and trying to keep the peace as it had gotten me nowhere. Advised Clinkard of the cost and opportunity for them to speak to the customer they bought the car from but advised there weren't any issues and advised Alphera too and they suggested that I get the inspection done and here we are now lol Please let me know if I've missed anything out sorry about the essay 😅 email.pdf   Sorry forgot to mention the dealership is around 3-4 hours away from me and was a distance sale and I just went to collect it after transferring deposit/ Finance being accepted.
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

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      This is good ethical practice.

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      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Insolvency Practitioner Help

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Hope someone can help.


My parents have been given appalling advice by an Insolvency Practioner which has led to their bankruptcy. Originally, to protect their business and sort out the debts the IP advised that they should go into an IVA. It now turns out, after their solicitor has done some digging that only one of them should have been put onto IVA in order to protect their business (a pub). Things came to a head in court, where the IP's representitive claimed 3 times, in a court to a judge's face that he had not received any payment for his services, £2000, and my parents were therefore lying about their financial standing, this totally destroyed their credibility in front of the judge who immediately ordered the bankruptcy, leaving my parents with no business and no money.


The thing is, they have checked with their bank who have confirmed that the payment cheque was paid in and cashed by the IP months ago!


So - their case was mismanaged from the start either willfully or through such incompetence the guy should not be allowed to practice anymore.


My question is, who exactly do they complain to, due to the lying in court and mismanagement is there anyway they can either reverse the bankruptcy (i wish) or make things easier, or get the bankruptcy term reduced, or do they have a good claim to get the money back from the IP (though presumably this money would then go to creditors) Also, is not knowingly lying in a Court Perjury, and a criminal offence? do they have recourse to that?


Matters were not helped by the fact that the judge whos name could possibly ressemble a past norman monarch is well known for having shall we say "sticky fingers"


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  • 10 months later...

I'm interested in circumstances where only one person should go into an IVA when they have a joint business, and presumably therefore joint debts. I can't imagine what these could be. If I was a creditor I would think the information from the party in the VA would make me realise it was worthwhile bankrupting the person not. At the very least, I would hold the party not in the VA responsible for the proportion of the joint debts that the VA didn't cover.


In terms of the bankruptcy order; do you feel that your parents should not currently be bankrupt? An annullment application costs £65 per head, and would give the opportunity for the argument that the order ought not to have been made. If you believe you can show that the IVA proposal was viable and that the IP thought not in error, then this is a distinct option.

Number of times I've asked 1st Credit for information that I stil haven't recieved... 55 as at 02/05/07 :!:

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Well if only 1 of them had gone into the IVA, then their business/jobs would have survived, and the debts paid off about 3 weeks later (loan from family in Ireland was coming through, with solicitors letter as proof)


The actual reason the Bankruptcy being granted was the Insolvency Practitioner claimed that he had not recieved his fees from them, therefore there was 3 or 4 thousand pounds missing, which the Judge assumed they were hiding from the court/proceedings and so bankrupted them, apparantly things like Bank Statements showing that their cheque had been cashed and cleared by the Practitioner held no merit as evidence to the Judge. The Judge, especially from when practising as a solicitor sadly is renowned throughout mid Wales of frankly being as bent as a 2 pound note, its possible he had something personal against them, as they knew each other outside court. (small town)


They didnt bother trying to get it annulled, firstly it would have probably gone up against the same Judge, and secondly it was too late to save their jobs, so they just left it, and while they still feel seriously embarressed about the bankruptcy (old school people who think its totally a bad thing, I think they are a lot less stressed not having something like £70,000 hanging over their heads! It always seemed strange, as if the creditor had held off a few weeks longer, they would have got ALL the money, and yet bankrupted 2 people who had no assets and lived in council accomodation.. Go figure :rolleyes:


Plus they were headhunted by a company in a similar business soon after and have been travelling around a fair bit.


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Make sure the Official Receiver knows that the IP is holding these funds.


I expect he does by now - they are due to be discharged in 3 weeks! :D It was August last year they went. Stupidly they never went and put in a formal complaint against the IP, I dont remember all the details, but there was some serious mismanagement, malpractice and bad advice, going on there. If I had been living near to my parents at the time, the *(&* would have hit the fan over him, i would have MADE them do something ;)


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Ah. Didn't appreciate that the horse had bolted!


There is a problem here in that when things are to do with bankruptcy courts feel you ought to act sort of sharpish (sort of "yesterday = good, within 7 days = acceptable, longer = please tell me why..." kinna thing).


I'm not understanding why an IVA was ever appropriate though, especially if there was money for payment in full on the way.

Number of times I've asked 1st Credit for information that I stil haven't recieved... 55 as at 02/05/07 :!:

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