interview under caution - benefit fraud

[jabba jones]

Can you give a few more details of the work you've been doing. When from, hours per week & earnings?

[jabba jones]

I've not got time to do a full reply now, but if no one else gets back to you before, I'll be back tomorrow evening. However in the mean time could you just clarify, have you been paid a wage or has it all been expenses?

 

Therapeutic work has not existed for about 8 years now, it was replaced by Permitted Work. Theses are the rules, have a read of them. You mentioned you were supervised so does Supported Permitted Work fit what you have been doing?

 

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/disabledpeople/financialsupport/dg_10020667

 

"do Supported Permitted Work and earn up to £93.00 a week for as long as you are receiving Incapacity Benefit

Supported Permitted Work means work that is supervised by someone who is employed by a public or local authority or a voluntary organisation, and whose job it is to arrange work for disabled people. This could be work done in the community or in a sheltered workshop. It also includes work as part of a hospital treatment programme".

[jabba jones]

Right I'm back.

 

Because you are in receipt of several benefits, there are quite a few things they could be looking at.

 

From what you have said it is voluntary work, however you are going to have to try & get some evidence of this. As you don't have any receipts can you get the charity or your CPN to put something in writing to verify this?

 

It can be only classed as voluntary work if it is for a charity, if for any reason the organisation is not accepted as a charity then the employment should be accepted as Permitted Work Lower Level (Earn up to £20 for an indefinite period). That should cover your Incapacity Benefit & there will be no overpayment.

 

Income Support & Housing Benefit both have an earnings disregard. I think it's currently £20 per week, so again if the employment is accepted as either voluntary or Permitted Work Lower Limit then there should be no overpayment there either. You should still have reported the work though, it may have stopped all this disruption.

 

However that still leaves your Disability Living Allowance. You said that the IUC invite letter states its regarding an undeclared change in your circumstances. If it was just about the work you've done, the invite letter should really have said it was “about your employment”. However this is picked from a list of possibilities when the letter is printed.

 

You state you have been awarded DLA middle rate care & high rate mob for life. Whilst this maybe correct, if the way you manage your condition improves you still have to report these changes & your award can be reviewed. You have a pretty high award of DLA. You stated earlier that you've been managing to do the work 4 or 5 times a week. Whilst it is fine to work & receive DLA this may suggest that you are dealing with your condition better than when your DLA was awarded/last reviewed. Does what you are now able to do contradict anything you put on your DLA claim/last review form? If it does then you will have to explain this.

[jabba jones]

My incap benefit and DLA is not the subject of the review at all it is purely the income support, the reason everything else has stopped is because I didnt pay enough NI before I started claiming (because I was so young when I started receiving benefit I think) but because of this everything is paid through IS

 

So it appears it is the employment side they are looking at not the DLA.

 

Whilst you may not be receiving payment of Incap, you will still have a claim for it & they will be crediting your National Insurance account each week (this protects your Retirement Pension) & is one of the qualifing conditions for I/S & therefore H/B. So the Voluntary work/Permitted work advice still stands. Try to get the proof as discussed earlier. You can take this with you to the IUC, but you also need to notify both the Incap & Housing Benefit sections.

 

If possible print out the Permitted Work rules & take them with you. You'd be amazed at how many Fraud Investigators don't really understand them!!

[jabba jones]

The other info is that the mental health advocate cannot come into the inteview with me along with the solicitor as my appropriate adult under PACE, this has left me feeling pretty shook up

 

The Mental Health Advocate would not have been able to say anything during the IUC, they would just be there for moral support, where as your solicitor will ask for disclosure prior to the IUC. This means they'll have a chat with the investigator, who will tell them what the alleged offence is & what evidence they hold. The solicitor will then be given time to discuss this with you & explain what your options are.

[jabba jones]

The CI11 - "Notice to persons following interview" is basically the alleged offence in writing & is followed by the 2nd caution (the NOW caution).

 

The district I used to work in stopped doing thsse 2 parts of the IUC a while ago because they are not really required & once done the customer cannot be invited back in for another IUC regarding the same offence. So should any further information come to light (& it often does) it can't be questioned.

 

The fact that you have been issued it doesn't mean they plan to prosecute you. It's not upto them at this stage. A file with all the evidence & a transcript of the IUC will now be sent to the decision making unit. They will decide if any periods of the claim are to be disallowed. If they are an overpayment will be calculated. At that point the file is returned to the fraud department. IF at that stage it is decided an offence has taken place they have 3 options:

 

O

verpayment over £2000 – Repayment & attempted prosecution.

 

O

verpayment less than £2000 but offence not admitted – Repayment, administrative Penalty (30% fine) & Departmental caution.

 

Overpayment less than £2000 but offence admitted – Repayment & Departmental caution.

 

The departmental caution is kept on file for 5 years. It is NOT a criminal record & does not show up on any checks.

 

Hopefully from what you said previously all the work will be allowed & therefore non of the above will come into play.

[jabba jones]

The decision regarding your past periods of benefit will take several months to be sorted.

 

As for your current payments, give the Fraud Investigator a ring. His/her telephone number should be on your IUC letter if you still have it. They need to inform the benefit paying sections of a safe date to start paying you from again. They may want you to complete a new claim first because your old claim is still pending a decision & MAY be disallowed. Therefore you may also be paid at the lowest rate of benefit until the decision is made.

 

After you have spoken to the investigator, phone your usual 0845 number & ask for a call back from the relivant benefit processing supervisor. Your case is far from unique but you do need to be dealing with someone who knows what they are doing or I'm afraid you'll be passed from pillar to post for the next few months.