Are these bailiff charges justifiable ?

[JH101]

There's no provision to charge for two letters, so the second letter fee must go.

 

The visit fee is either completely wrong; or, if we're being charitable, they've charged you an "attendance to remove" (Fee 6) instead of an "attendance to levy" (Fee 3). It's quite clear that's wrong, confirmed by the recent ruling in Culligan v. Simkin & Marstons Group (2008 ) at paragraphs 49 and 50.

 

The visit fee ("attendance to levy", fee 3) should be no more than 28% of £197 = £55.16

 

Don't know why they haven't charged you VAT, but maybe it's because they're a council. Or maybe they're just a one man and a bike operation, too small to be VAT registered. But really there ought to be 17.5% VAT on everything.

 

 

Of course, because you've paid the amount on the warrant, before they have concluded a successful levy, you're not actually under any further obligation to pay them anything (Bennet v Bayes, 1860), nor are they legally allowed to take any further bailiff action.

Edited July 26, 2010 by JH101

[jaafarcake]

Due to the fact that these people in the council don't really know what they are doing. Would it be wise to send in a Formal Subject access Request to make sure I get a copy of the warrant of execution. Then I will be able to cross check to make sure that the amount on the Warrant is in fact £185.00

( as I have only ever been told this over the phone ) Their Sketchy letter only states that I have paid £185.00 it does not confirm this is the amount on the WOE. ( this I see is the crucial part ) However judging by the other PCN I'm pretty sure it is...

 

Once this has been confirmed I could send them a letter advising the amount on the warrant has been paid etc.

 

If I then decide not to pay their charges, could they pursue me to recover their costs any other way ?

[JH101]

£185 is standard for a PCN that starts at £60

 

First you lose the 50% discount for not paying it straight away. That takes it up to the full penalty amount, which is £120.

 

Then if you don't pay within another period of time, they can send you a notice, and the PCN goes up another 50%, taking it to £180.

 

If you still don't pay, they then register the debt with the TEC at Northampton for £5, which issues them a warrant, which they then pass on to their bailiffs. Total amount on the warrant, now owing at this stage, £185.

 

Per Bennet, bailiff fees only become due when the bailiffs achieve a levy. So I think they can't get at them any other way.

 

JBW group had a heap of unpaid fees on their books for work done, when Westminster refused them a new contract in 2008. They couldn't get any money for those fees from Westminster, and according to what they told the court, there was in effect no way they could enforce them against anybody else, either.

Edited July 26, 2010 by JH101

[jaafarcake]

I am extremely grateful for your help JH101, I really am. But forgive me for thinking that last statement almost seems too good to be true :) !

[JH101]

"If tender of the full sum is made before the seizure, the levy is illegal (Branscomb v. Bridges (1823) 1 B&C 145). No costs need be included in the tender as none can be recovered before the levy (Bennet v. Bayes (1860) 5 H&N 391).

-- John Kruse, Law of Seizure of Goods, 2nd ed. Hammicks Legal Publishing, 2009. Page 247.