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    • I would suggest that you stop trying to rely on legal theory – as you understand it. Firstly, because we are dealing with practical/pragmatic situations and at a low value level where these arguments tend not to work. Secondly, because you clearly have misunderstood the assessment of quantum where there are breaches of obligations. The formula that you have cited above is the method of loss calculation in torts. In contract it is entirely different. The law of obligations generally attempts to remedy the breach. This means that in tort, damages seek to put you into the position you would have been in had the breach not occurred. In other words it returns you to your starting position – point zero. Contract damages attend put you into the position that you would have been had the breach not occurred but this is not your starting position, contract damages assume that the agreement in dispute had actually been carried out. This puts you into your final position. You sold an item for £XXX. Your expectation was that you your item would be correctly delivered and that you would be the beneficiary of £XXX. Your expectation loss is the amount that you sold the item for and that is all you are entitled to recover. If you want, you can try to sue for the larger sum – and we will help you. But if they ask for evidence of the value of the item as it was sold then I can almost guarantee that either you will be obliged to settle for the lesser sum – or else a judge will give you judgement but for the lesser sum. This will put you to the position that you would have been had there been no breach of contract. I understand from you now that when you dispatch the item you declared the retail cost to you and not your expected benefit of £XXX. To claim for the retail value in the circumstances would offend the rules relating to betterment. If you want to do it then we will help you – but don't be surprised if you take a tumble.  
    • I was caught speeding 3 times in the same week, on the same road. All times were 8-12mph higher than the limit. I was offered the course for the first offense and I now need to accept the other 2 offenses. I just want to be ready for what might come. Will I get the £100 fine and 3 points for each of them or do I face something more severe?  These are my only offenses in 8 years of driving.
    • I'll get my letter drafted this evening. Its an item I sold, which I'm also concerned about, as whilst I don't have my original purchase receipt (the best I have is my credit card statement showing a purchase from Car Audio Centre), I do unfortunately have the eBay listing where I sold it for much less. But as I said before this is now a question of compensation: true compensation would seek to put me back into the position I was in before the loss ie: that title would remain with me until my buyer has accepted this, and so compensation should be that which would be needed to replace the lost item. But in the world of instant electronic payment, it could be argued that as I had already been paid, the title to the goods had already transferred, and I was required to refund the buyer after the loss. And so, despite my declared value being the retail price - that which is needed to return me to my pre-sales position, the compensatory value should be the value I sold it for, which being a second-hand item from a private seller is lower. I still believe that I should be claiming for the item's full value, rather than how much I sold it for, as this is the same for insurance: we don't insure the value we paid, but rather the value of the item to put us back into the position we would be in if we ever needed to claim. Its for the loss adjuster to argue the toss
    • amusing that 'bad economic judgement on behalf of prior party ISN'T a major reason to wingers to move to deform yet immigration is, where record levels of such has been driven by the right wings terrible brexit and the later incompetent dog whistle 'proposals largely driven to whistle to the right wingnuts Just seems to confirm the are clueless numpties 'wetting their own shoes   Has farage bought a property in Clacton yet?   yet concern for the NHS is listed as a major issue even by those saying they are moving to deform  
    • Also, have you told us how much you paid for this vehicle? Are there any other expenses you have incurred – insurance, inspections et cetera? How far away from the dealership do you live?
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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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CBS Transcom - Arrow Global - Cope's - NOTICE OF DISCONTINUANCE!!!


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Right guys, I have had absolutley sod all of the requested paperwork back and the 7 days were up yesterday, but I gave it until today (just because the post around here is rubbish at the moment:roll:)

 

So now I need to do the N244 form ready to put into the court on Monday morning, any advice would be welcome, as always.

 

Thanks in advance

MM

Im sure a friend will be along shortly to assist with this;)

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  • 2 months later...
Hi mighty-midget,

 

Are there any further developments, did you complete the N244?

 

I would be interested to know what happened.

 

Regards

SC

 

Hi SC,

 

Sorry not been around much lately, my TFT went bang:eek:

 

I did send off the N244 but have heard nothing from the court, although I did try to call them and I think that I got the YTS girl:rolleyes: So no help really I will ring them again to see if a judge has had a chance to look over everything!

 

Have had some paperwork from Cope's but TBH you can't really read it as the quality is really bad.

 

So, I guess what I am trying to say is that I am still playing the waiting game.

 

Thanks for the interest.

MM

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Me again:rolleyes:

 

After saying that I have heard nothing and that I am still waiting, this morning I got a letter from NCC bulk centre saying that;

 

"as a result of an order made on 16 January 2009, this claim has been transferred to ****** Countu Court"

 

Whay could I not have been told this when I rang?

 

The letter also has a note on it that says

 

NOTE: A party affected by this Order may under Rule 23.10 apply to have it set aside, varied or stayed. Such a party must apply under Rule 23.10 within 7 days of service of this order.

 

What does all of this mean? And what happens now?

Will I get something from my local court to tell me when etc? Or do I need to contact them myself?

 

Thanks in advance as always.

MM

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All this means is that the claim will be transferred to your local county court. You should receive an 'Allocation Questionnaire' next from the court to complete. There's a sticky above on completion of AQs, so don't worry. Come back when you receive the AQ.

Arrow Global/MBNA - Discontinued and paid costs

HFO/Morgan Stanley (Barclays) - Discontinued and paid costs

HSBC - Discontinued and paid costs

Nationwide - Ran for cover of stay pending OFT case 3 yrs ago

RBS/Mint - Nothing for 4 yrs after S78 request

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All this means is that the claim will be transferred to your local county court. You should receive an 'Allocation Questionnaire' next from the court to complete. There's a sticky above on completion of AQs, so don't worry. Come back when you receive the AQ.

 

Thanks for the help docman:)

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Hi all, just to keep you up to speed!

 

I have received a Notice of Hearing Application from my local court and the date is set for 2nd March 2009, but as of yet I have not received and Allocation Questionairre..

 

My feelings now are that preverbial brick depositing from a rear orafice:eek:

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  • 1 month later...
Hi all, just to keep you up to speed!

 

I have received a Notice of Hearing Application from my local court and the date is set for 2nd March 2009, but as of yet I have not received and Allocation Questionairre..

 

My feelings now are that preverbial brick depositing from a rear orafice:eek:

 

Soooo....... what happened?

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  • 2 months later...

I will certainly update the thread asap, I am just trying to keep the essay to a minimum with all the facts in the right order!

 

I can now let you all know what happened and when, but as you can see from the title I received a nice letter in the post today:D, this smiley is definately showing the grin on my face at the moment!

 

Thank you so much to all of you that have helped me;), it is very much appreciated:smile:

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Fantastic news MM. Look forward to the essay!

Arrow Global/MBNA - Discontinued and paid costs

HFO/Morgan Stanley (Barclays) - Discontinued and paid costs

HSBC - Discontinued and paid costs

Nationwide - Ran for cover of stay pending OFT case 3 yrs ago

RBS/Mint - Nothing for 4 yrs after S78 request

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You just can't find a decent backbone in that company anymore... :D

..

.

 

Opinions given herein are made informally by myself as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice, you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

 

 

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  • 4 weeks later...
I will certainly update the thread asap, I am just trying to keep the essay to a minimum with all the facts in the right order!

 

I can now let you all know what happened and when, but as you can see from the title I received a nice letter in the post today:D, this smiley is definately showing the grin on my face at the moment!

 

Thank you so much to all of you that have helped me;), it is very much appreciated:smile:

 

 

MM

 

Can you let us know what happened? There appear to have been a few NODs issued in early June. Did they pay your costs or agree to remove any adverse comment with the CRAs?

Arrow Global/MBNA - Discontinued and paid costs

HFO/Morgan Stanley (Barclays) - Discontinued and paid costs

HSBC - Discontinued and paid costs

Nationwide - Ran for cover of stay pending OFT case 3 yrs ago

RBS/Mint - Nothing for 4 yrs after S78 request

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Firstly sorry it has taken me so long to try and write this:oops:

 

As you all know I went to court back in March, the morning went as follows:

 

The paperwork stated that I had to be at the court for 10.15am, not having been before I assumed that this was my time slot! I sat and waited and finally got my chance at 11.30am.

 

I went in full of confidence and armed with all the information that I thought I need (following the advice of a couple of lovely chaps!) I was polite and explained that I was a litigant in person and had limited knowledge of the law. I thought that the hearing was just to hear my motion to have the claim dismissed or to force Cope's to ammend they POC's! How wrong was I?

Cope's had requested a summary judgement and to have my defence struck out, I KNEW NOTHING ABOUT THIS:eek:

 

I was immediately put on the back foot and the judge did not seem interested in anything that I had to say, he just kept saying that I knew what this was all about and that I owed them the money, and although I was prepared for some of his questions I wasn't prepared for a judge that didn't seem to care what points I raised ie that cope's had not set out their claim correctly, who the money was due to, that there was no date of default etc

 

On my N244 I was either asking for their claim to be struck out or failing that I was asking the court to get cope's to ammend their POC's, the judge dismissed my claim and dismissed their summary judgement request! But, I tried to push the issue and eventually got the judge to order that they ammend their POC's within a given time period, 14 days and that I then be given a further 14 days to file my defence.

The judge did not award me my costs, even though he had actually ordered Cope's to ammend their POC's which was part of my N244 as an either or

Also, as I was leaving the judge's chambers the judge said "as you know what this is all about I suggest that you call them and come to some arrangement" I didn't respond to him but couldn't beleve that he had said it!

Right from the start of the hearing I got the feeling that the judge didn't care about any points of law that I raised, in his eyes I had borrowed the money and therefore I had to pay it back regardless and to be honest I felt that he was already on their side.......

 

Got the order back from the court 4 days after the hearing.

 

Two weeks after the hearing I got a letter from Cope's stating that they had already received a judgement against me and that they were going to seek an attachment of earnings order:eek: OMG I panicked thinking that perhaps something had happened that I didn't know about, bearing in mind that they had made a request for summary judgement without informing me so it was quite possible that they had done something else!

 

Sorry forgot to add a comment from the judge, he said that he felt that there were websites out there that were offering advice and that he implied that people like me would be better off not getting advice from such sites and that I knew what it was all about!

 

I will leave it there for a bit and continue with the saga later

Edited by mighty-midget
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I look forward to the saga continuing!!

Arrow Global/MBNA - Discontinued and paid costs

HFO/Morgan Stanley (Barclays) - Discontinued and paid costs

HSBC - Discontinued and paid costs

Nationwide - Ran for cover of stay pending OFT case 3 yrs ago

RBS/Mint - Nothing for 4 yrs after S78 request

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