Its Not A Crime! - BR 28 Feb

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What exactly does the OR do?

 

What a question! :o

 

Link: About The Insolvency Service gives you an idea if you really want to know.

 

Has she spoken to anyone from the OR's Office at all yet?

 

Often there will be a brief 5 min phone call at court or later to discuss any urgent matters.

 

If absolutely nothing has been heard from them, then a polite call to the OR might be an idea.

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All money due to your daughter will have to be paid direct to the OR and the OR decides how much the creditors will get.

 

If you mean benefits/wages etc; then it doesn't work like that normally.

 

If you can get an account you are permitted to run one as normal, having benefits/wages paid into there and meeting domestic bills/payments as usual.

 

Should any funds accumulate that are not required for your "reasonable domestic needs" then you have to declare this, but the OR does not even normally monitor accounts.

 

An awful lot is taken on trust, and in this case the intervention from the OR is likely to be very minimal.

 

What Will Happen to my Bank Account

 

Can I open a new bank account?

 

After the bankruptcy order, you may open a new bank or building society account, but you should tell them that you are bankrupt. It is for the bank or building society to decide whether they will let you operate a bank account, and they may impose conditions and limits. You should not get any overdraft or credit facilities without informing the bank or building society that you are bankrupt. You must not write cheques that are likely to ‘bounce’ (be dishonoured).

As a bankrupt you might find it difficult to open a new bank or building society account. Some banks may allow you to keep using your existing bank account after they have contacted the official receiver. If not, you may wish to apply for a 'basic bank account'. Information on which banks offer basic bank accounts to bankrupts may be found on the Financial Services Authority website at http://www.moneymadeclear.fsa.gov.uk/pdfs/bank_accounts.pdf The Citizens' Advice Bureau also has information on basic bank accounts at Basic bank accounts.

 

If your income only consists of benefit payments, state pensions and/or tax credit payments you may wish to open The Post Office card account. This is a very simple account that cannot be used to receive any other payments such as Housing Benefit, occupational pension benefits or wages. The account allows you to withdraw cash free of charge at any Post Office branch. This account may suit you if you want a simple account that will not let you go overdrawn or incur any charges. No credit checks will be carried out when you open this account. Further details can be found at www.postoffice.co.uk

 

Do I need to tell the official receiver or trustee about my new bank account?

You do not need to tell your official receiver or trustee about any new bank account opened after the date of the bankruptcy order unless you are asked for that information. You do need to tell the official receiver or trustee about any money in the account that is more than you need for reasonable living expenses. The official receiver or trustee can claim the surplus amounts, via an income payments order (IPO) or an income payments agreement (IPA), to pay your creditors. Your trustee may apply to court for an IPO, which requires you to make contributions towards the bankruptcy debts from your income. The court will not make an IPO if it would leave you without enough income to meet the reasonable domestic needs of you and your family. Or you may enter into a written agreement with your trustee, called an IPA, to pay a certain amount of your income to the trustee for an agreed period. IPOs and IPAs continue for a maximum of 3 years from the date the order is made by the court or the date of the written agreement. If you fail to cooperate, the trustee may intervene in the bank account.

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The only two reliable accounts for a bankrupt are the "Co-op Cashminder" or the "Barclays Cashcard" accounts. Plus of course the Post Office Card Account for benefits only.

 

See: Bank accounts for Bankrupts

 

While the Barclays account offers DD's/SO's, it doesn't do internet banking.

 

Most other (even basic) accounts are likely to be refused, although there have been a few people who have been lucky elsewhere.

 

Surprisingly enough, some people who have owed substantial sums to the Co-op/Barclays have even been successful in opening a basic account with them. At least in theory the bank should not be entitled to exercise a right of "set off" with respect to a bankruptcy debt, but it would be best to get independent confirmation of this through the OR should you be forced to take out an account with a former lender.

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Big pain about the HB.

 

The Co-op account can be opened over the phone (but might need to do ID checks), plus you can pay in cash/cheques and withdraw cash at Post Offices like most 'basic' accounts. So it may not be as restrictive as you think for her.

 

EDIT: Yep. And it has online banking and a Visa/Electron debit card as well.

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The telphone call from Mercers said that Bankruptcy will not absolve her from paying what she owes.

 

Oh yes it will! That's the point.

 

Oh well, I wouldn't expect Mercers to acknowledge the truth under any other circumstances, so why should it be any different with bankruptcy?

 

I would include everything in your complaints. You may as well.

 

Agree with Hopeful1; the way you've dealt with all this does you an amazing amount of credit.

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Yes, and ALSO contact the official reciever. What they are doing (asking for preferential treatment) is now, quite simply, illegal. The OR has the powers to squash them like vermin.

 

I love that image. I wish they did. Normally the most they will do is bend a few ears, but even the banks take notice of that from the OR!

 

As suggested, it's best to make sure on Monday that the OR has received the paperwork from the court.

 

It may be just that things are caught up in admin since most offices are snowed under at the moment, but the fact that you haven't had the first brief call from the OR to discuss anything urgent (including threats by creditors) makes me wonder slightly.

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Noomill that is a good idea but how will she no where to send it if the OR has not got back to her?

 

The address of the Official Receiver's office covering that court are normally printed on the bottom of the bankruptcy order.

 

EDIT: But yes, there's not much point sending anything until they have spoken to the OR/case examiner.

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oh rite.

 

well maybe a phone call to the courts or the OR office on monday would be an idea if they have not recieved anything then i would ask what they want you to do.

 

Yep.

 

Probably best to try the OR first. They will know if they've had the paperwork through from the court. If they haven't, then they will probably chase it up themselves.

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Halifax are not really an option until you are discharged from the bankruptcy.

 

Just recently I've seen them close the "basic" accounts of several people who went bankrupt, and refuse accounts to people who are newly bankrupt.

 

They will even close children's savings accounts if a bankrupt is associated with the account.

 

Co-op is a Visa/Electron.

 

The FSA booklet on basic accounts is useful, but shows that most accounts will be refused.

 

http://www.moneymadeclear.fsa.gov.uk/pdfs/bank_accounts.pdf

 

And they are right.

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NatWest gave my ex-husband a basic bank account while he was bankrupt so they might be worth a try

 

Everywhere is worth a go. People sometimes get lucky, even at places that most others are refused.

 

But Natwest are refusing nearly all undischarged bankrupts at the moment as well.

 

:o I must sound all "doom and gloom" here , but it's not meant like that.

 

Under the current climate it's just a pain in the *** trying to get even a basic account as a BR.

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That all sounds a lot better.

 

I'm afraid the debts can quite often be sold on.:o

 

However, when she is discharged you can get all the entries on the Credit Reference Files sorted out so that all the former debts are marked in some way to show that they have been settled/satisfied. That is a big help in preventing anyone trying to sell/collect them when they shouldn't be.

 

When that time comes, the instructions in the link below should help get this done. In that there are further links to the letters to send, and to the correct complaints procedures with the Information Commissioner to follow if any refuse.

 

CREDIT REFERENCE FILE CLEAN UP – POST BANKRUPTCY

 

But that's a while in the future.

 

Glad the examiner you spoke to was friendly and helpful.

 

Assuming the forms they are sending you are the normal standard set, then there isn't very much to them.

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she ended up in Addenbrookes intensive care unit for most of last week, since yesterday back on a ward. I slept at the hospital for most of last week. Everything on hold right now. First look at a computer since I last wrote here.

 

Sorry to hear that.

 

I hope things improve, and you know where we are if there's anything we can help with.

 

Best wishes.

 

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Things seem to be settling out a little now.

 

In a case like this it's unlikely that the OR will have many issues to trouble you with. So with little to concern her there, and hassle from the creditors a thing of the past, I hope she can relax a bit and concentrate on getting as well as is possible.

 

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sorted

 

Good to hear.

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can some one answer a question for me - MBNA have sold on the Debt which cant be chased, Everheds have said as much, so whats the point? Its a write off to who ever has the debt, isnt it? I am very confused about this, I am sure its nothing that I need worry about, but its seems a pointless excercise.

 

Eversheds, Max Recovery, and other similar companies buy bankruptcy debts.

 

They buy them in bulk and pay very little for them. While most will never generate a dividend from the OR/trustee, the odd one or two that do means they will on average make a profit.

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It'll be interesting to see what Barclays do with that.

 

If it does get sold on then most of them go to Max Recovery, which was why I mentioned them earlier. Again, they are normally very easy to deal with.

 

For example: Barclays sold my debt.....?

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A large proportion of Barclays/Barclaycard debts that are included in a bankruptcy seem to be sold on to Max Recovery.

 

Max Recovery

 

Max Recovery Ltd is a debt purchaser with particular focus on bankruptcy and insolvency.

 

Established in 1992, Max Recovery is a wholly owned subsidiary of Bear Stearns & Co Inc, a major financial institution with $40billion in total capital and over 75 years of experience.

 

Max recovery was the first purchaser of consumer bankruptcy accounts and is currently the largest unsecured consumer bankruptcy creditor in the United States.

How long was it after the bankruptcy date that you notified Barclays/Mercers of it?

 

If they are attempting to claim that the debt was sold to Max before the bankruptcy, then I find this claim to be somewhat suspicious. I don't think Max would normally touch a "live" debt. As far as I know it is not the type of business that they go for.

 

If you didn't notify them of the BR immediately and they instead were notified by the OR or found out by other means, then their claim may make more sense. Even then they would have had to have sold on the debt at lightening speed.

 

In either circumstance I'm not sure that the bankruptcy or sale of the debt absolves them of responsibility with respect to the FOS complaint. But others here will probably be able to make more of an informed assessment of that.

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I'm glad to hear that. Must be a big relief.

 

I hope things have improved for her in other respects as well.