Hello everybody! Sorry for the late reply.. Well, thats a very interesting stance Mary, i wasn't aware of that before. Haven't had a chance to look into it closely but i bet there are plenty of people on here that would love to look into the legal points your post raises!! Hey there, HHFN! Doing well thanks. Some post today in fact and even a real human reply from Halifax! wow that's only taken 8 months! Hope all is well with you at the mo! Dear Mr x, I refer to your recent enquiries regarding your account. I was sorry to learn you are unhappy with the service we have provided. We are keen to deal with your concerns as quickly as possible. I have asked for one of our Customer Care Managers to investigate the points you have raised and you will receive a reply shortly, but certainly no later than 4 weeks. You will find enclosed a copy of our complaints leaflet. This tells you how we will handle your complaint. If you need to speak to someone in the meantime, please call us on the above number. Yours sincerely, Miss C Lee admin Team Customer Care Retail Bank Collections Also 2 letters from the FOS: Dear Mr x, Your complaint about HFC Bank Limited I am sorry to tell you that, unfortunately, we are still not in a position to look at your complaint. We hope to allocate it to one of our adjudicators for assessment as soon as we can. We will contact you again within the next four weeks to update you on our progress. I do apologise for any inconvenience. If you need to contact us in the meantime, please remember to quote our reference number. Dear Mr X, Your complaint about Capital One Bank Plc The large volume of cases we are dealing with at present has meant that we have not yet been able to allocate your complaint to one of our adjudicators so that it can be assessed. However, we will do this as soon as possible and we will contact you again within the next four weeks to keep you updated on the progress of your complaint. And a note from the OFT: Dear Mr X, I acknowledge receipt of your permission to disclose slip received on 17 October 2007. As you are aware, we have no powers to intervene to help individual complainants and so we cannot directly help or advise you. If you have not already done so, we would like to suggest you to contact Consumer Direct or your local citizen's advice bureau as they can offer free independent advice. Meanwhile, the OFT can and does take action in the interests of consumers generally, where there is sufficient evidence. Thank you once again for giving us permission to disclose your complaint details and for taking the time to write to us about this matter. Yours sincerely, Miss Jo Kwok Enquiries and Preliminary Investigations Centre

Hey there.. thanks thats really nice of you to say! I will be interested to read your thread once it's up and running for sure! Hope i can be of some help along the way.. keep in touch!

ugh poor you! That stinks doesn't it! If you had told the police that your next door neighbour's tires were half a millimeter below the legal minimum or they hadn't paid their car tax for 2 days or brought back 2 bottles of scotch from France without paying duty on them, then the police would have been round to their house with police marksman and a sniffer dog the very same day!!! Shame about the MP but that's politicians all over isn't it. Keep going Maggiebroom! Perhaps a formal written complaint to the police station in qeustion wouldn't hurt and also the idea of the newspapers (if you can find one that is interested in the story) is a really good one. There's nothing that creditors or police hate more than bad publicity and i'd love to read your story in the national press!

Dear Mr x, Reference Barclaycard Personal Loan Account Number ******** (master Loan Account) I write further to your letter dated 19 October 2007 requesting a copy of your credit aggreement under Section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act. Firstly please accept my apologies for the delay in responding to your request however after looking into your file i can confirm we were not in receipt of your letter dated 24 August 2007. I am aware that Helen Gould did respond to your initial letter dated 29 June 2007 and asked you to supply us with more information regarding your Barclaycard Account. The Account Number ******** is in fact a Barclaycard Personal Loan Account and not a Barclaycard Credit Card Account; therefore we are unable to deal with your request from this department, however I have forwarded your letter onto the relevant department who will ensure your request is carried out. I am aware that a request under Section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act has been complied with from the Barclaycard Personal Loan Dept, however if you have any further queries relating to your Barclaycard Personal Loan, please contact Carmel Campbell on 0870 ........ Yours sincerely, Maria Roy Court Orders and Disclosures Clerk Legal and Regulatory Compliance Dept LRC

hey.. yes you do get the impression that the FOS are running on autopilot most of the time and just going through the motions. Which is why they say things like 'if we don't hear from you regarding this matter we well take no futher action etc' hoping that you will go away. Yeah right! Oh DCA and 'think'... ermm yeah right! lol

yes i think i have just twigged that EOS have just taken over the account and not had it transfered completely from BOS. I suspect BOS are still in overall 'ownership'. Ho hum. I'm not bothered whoever has it! They ain't getting a penny from me! No thats very useful info and a good reminder for me, thanks reallymad. I will certainly put as much info into, and spell it out for, the FOS in any further letters (assuming they ever get around to actually asking me what i think of course!) I like eggs by the way!

Can't see anything about EOS's relationship/connection with Blair, Oliver and Scott on their website: EOS Solutions UK - Your partner for financial solutions But they say things like: The range of debt collection services offered by EOS includes the recovery of your customer's debts: you assign the outstanding receivables to us. We use all the tact and feel that is required for your customer to resume payment. The objective is to close the cases at low cost and out of court. ...Your receivables do not have to be titled until all collection steps have failed to bring success. EOS will put you in touch with a specialized law firm so that the complicated procedure will be as simple as possible for you. The lawyers under contract to EOS guarantee adherence to the prescribed methods and time periods. They take care of the payment order and, if necessary, the writ of execution, instruct the bailiff and effect the submission of the statutory declaration. You are always kept up-to-date. Naturally you can also involve your own lawyers in the process. If the judicial proceedings also fail to bring success, EOS will monitor your receivables for a period of up to 30 years. After all, your debtor’s financial situation can change for the better as the years go by. 30 Years!!! Sod off!

hey reallymad.. yes i know what you mean... my first FOS complaint went out the beginning of July and they still haven't really got their teeth into the matter yet. Now it's October. But i will keep the pressure on for sure and won't give up! A couple of letters in the post today one of which is a bit odd really. Firstly from the FOS to say that (surprise surprise): Dear Mr x, Your complaint about Bank of Scotland plc trading as Halifax Thank you for sending us details of your complaint. It would appear that Bank of Scotland plc have not yet issued their final response on your complaint even though they have had the required eight weeks in which to do so. It may be possible for the firm to issue their final response shortly; we have therefore contacted Bank of Scotland plc and requested that they issue their final response letter within the next 14 days. We will contact you again upon receipt of the final response from Bank Of Scotland plc or when the 14 day time limit has expired. So i guess that proves the FOS don't really read complaints as i made a point saying that i hadn't had any response from Halifax let alone a final one. Hmmm oh well, watch this space... also strangley from Blair,, Oliver and Scott! Now yesterday i had that 'we have been passed the debt' letter from EOS Solutions. Assuming that they were seperate from BOS but now i'm not so sure: Dear Sir/Madam, Thank you for your recent communication. This has been forwarded to the Agent dealing with your account who will contact you in due course if required. Please quote the above account number on all correspondence and address them to Logic group Plc, 2 Birchwood Office Park, Crab Lane, Fearnhead, warrington, WA2 0XS. How odd eh? The address on the back of the envelope was fife (BOS) and the letter head was BOS but this address THEY are quoting is EOS Solutions! Me thinks the two companies are one and the same then?? I shall see what i can find out...

Another couple of letters i have sent off the last few weeks including the renewed FOS complaint re Mint. Been a bit lax about getting stuff on here lately but it's all up to date now: To HFC Bank: Dear Sir/Madam, As per the detail of your letter dated 29 August 2007 it was my understanding that you were not prepared to communicate further regarding the ongoing dispute involving the above account. It was also stated in your letter of the 13 June that it was my right to complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) with a view to resolving the above dispute. Therefore the recent final demand letter from you seems completely inappropriate considering in your last correspondence HFC stated: “...no further correspondence will be entered into regarding this matter unless it is received from the FOS”. You were aware i was planning on reporting this matter to the FOS in my letter of the 10 July 2007. I must only assume therefore that you are purposefully ignoring the impending FOS investigation by threatening legal proceedings? Or trying to speed up the collection process on the above alleged debt thereby avoiding any FOS involvement? Therefore, If it is your intention to proceed to court as stated in your recent communication then please be fully aware that i shall be bringing to the attention of a Judge that HFC forestalled any FOS investigation and thereby wasted valuable court time in not allowing the FOS to investigate fully. Above you will note the FOS Reference Number regarding my complaint against HFC Bank. If the recent final demand was sent in error then I expect HFC Bank to act responsibly and lawfully in allowing the FOS to proceed with their investigation. Yours sincerely, me To the FOS (re Mint). Dear Sir/Madam, Further to my recent complaint re Mint (RBOS). I am sorry for not writing sooner but my status as a full time carer means time is limited. I have received Mints final response and wish to ask the FOS to continue to investigate due to my belief that Mint still have not resolved my complaint to my satisfaction. Is it not my wish to waste the Ombudsman’s time or be belligerent in this matter but after research and advice i have been given i still feel that the documents sent to me in relation to the Consumer Credit Act 1974 request do not comply to the letter of said Act or OFT guidelines in what should constitute a properly executed agreement. Please find enclosed my original complaint form and supporting documents as well as Mints final response letter, which, on this one and only occasion contained terms and conditions relevant to the date of original card application. (Previous replies to my request have contained only current T&Cs.) These pages are only connected to my original application form by a hand-written name and account number scribbled at the top in pen. (Not by myself.) I understand that for a regulated agreement to be properly executed, it must contain all the prescribed terms of the agreement and conform to regulations and If therefore any of the prescribed terms are missing, or incorrect, the agreement is not enforceable against the debtor, and the court is precluded from making an enforcement order. This said, the ‘application form’ that i have received in response to any CCA request does not contain all information as laid out in the Act and OFT guidelines for prescribed terms on the same document (amount of credit, credit limit, repayments, rate of interest etc) and, as such in my view, does not fully comply. Yours sincerely, me And to Barclays: Dear Sir/Madam, Would you please reply to my previous letter dated 24 Aug 2007 as a matter of urgency re my request of my letter dated 29 June 2007. My previous correspondence gave all the necessary information for the above request to be completed and as the statutory timeframe has lapsed severely and a criminal offence has been committed by Barclays I had hoped you would take this matter very seriously. Recent postal delays not withstanding it has been almost 2 months since my last reply in this regard therefore if i do not receive a properly executed agreement or your confirmation that one isn’t available in relation to the above account by the end of this month (October) then i will have no alternative but to involve the Financial Ombudsman Service with a view to resolving this matter expeditiously. I hope that action will not be needed and that I shall hear from you shortly, Yours sincerely, me

tehe thanks! Yes, I find that after all this time it's best to try to leave emotion out of correspondense and talk to them with the same disdain and 'solicitor-speak' that they dish out to everyone else. They seem to take notice of those sorts of letters much more!

My one and only reply to EOS Solutions: Dear Sir/Madam, Further to your recent communication in which you demand payment towards the above alleged debt. As a courtesy I should like to make you aware of the current situation. The above account is in formal dispute as a Consumer Credit Act 1974 (sections 77-79) request has failed to be produced on 2 separate occasions. Halifax Plc and Blair, Oliver and Scott have thereby committed a criminal offence and the above account should not have been passed to EOS Solutions UK Plc as per OFT guidelines. I do not acknowledge any debt to EOS Solutions Uk Plc, Halifax Plc or Blair, Oliver and Scott. Please be advised that any further demands for payment and/or visits by field agents will be considered attempted fraud under the Fraud Act 2006 and will result in a Police report being sent to the Local Constabulary and immediate Court Action. Further, please take note that any detail contained in any further correspondence from EOS Solutions UK Plc shall be taken as a statement of truth in Law and could be produced as evidence in any future Court Proceedings. The Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) is currently investigating my complaint in this matter and I suggest EOS Solutions seeks legal advice as to their standing in this regard. Yours Sincerely, me

Finally some post although rather disappointing as it seems Blair, Oliver and Scott have given up on me! EOS Solutions UK Plc 2 Birchwood Office Park Crab Lane Fearnhead Warrington WA2 0XS Mr D x, Ref: ******** Our Client: HALIFAX PLC (CREDIT CARD) URGENT The above debt has been passed to us by our client for collection PAYMENT IN FULL is required IMMEDIATELY Failure to respond to this letter could result in: * The account being passed to your LOCAL COUNTY COURT for action * Arrangements being made for one of our FIELD COLLECTORS to call on you to recover the outstanding balance. ***Please ring now on 08709031756 to avoid further action*** * For details of how to pay see overleaf

haha naughty! lol

tehe thanks.. never had any complaints over my angles. I'm not called Mr Darcy 3 times a week for nothing! lol

hiya HHNF! Thanks.. i have always liked my angles!

hello there maggiebroom! Haven't had my thinking cap on for a while as it's all been silent here but id say your letter is fine myself. My approach has been that getting the creditor to admit in writing (hopefully with the help of the FOS) that they cannot produce a properly executed agreement is the goal to aim for. Personally, i haven't included in the FOS complaint about defaults etc as i know that once i get a 'we are unable to fully comply with your CCA request' letter from a creditor (i live in hope) that that will be sufficient to get the default removed. That's the angle i am taking although others may have a different tactic! I'd get that in the post to the FOS asap though as they aren't exactly fast workers!

Hey there! Well, lets hope that's the case but i didn't think anyone is getting their post at the moment are they with the strike causing such a backlog! I haven't had any post for days

Hi, No of course.. thats fine with me! Help yourself!

Hi, oh it seems exactly the same as the OFT response i had. They really don't write individually at all do they! I have the consent form at the end of my email reply (although i left out the telephone number option) so if you want that it is on my thread or i can email you the original if you like! D http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mbna/57846-debt-written-off-due-13.html Post 245

Hi Peter.. yes just finished reading your OFT reply! phewww what a very aggressive/defensive response from them! At least mine was half polite. Is that really how the OFT view consumers request re CCA? That the public at large are all dodgy shadey characters trying to defraud the honest hard working creditors by trying to use legalities to wiggle out of a debt?! Personally, I would write back to them simply stating that it is highly offensive to suggest that debtors are using the CCA in such a way and shocking that this is how the OFT view such matters! No wonder the OFT seem to allow criminal offences to go unchecked so easily if this is their view.

I see BOS's website is closed, been that way for quite some time: ! Web Site Closed !

Thanks for the input Peter.. it's all a mine-field of legalities and technicalities this business isn't it!

Hey Maggiebroom! Yes thanks i shall continue along this rocky road and see where it takes me. Does seem the OFT send out a general reply to these thypes of consumer complaints although i must say i was quite miffed by the "With regards to Trading Standards, we are unable to comment on the level of service they have provided". A total cop-out there then as my question was their legal role of enforcement, not simply their 'level of service' but to be honest i didn't expect much more from the OFT reply than what i got back. Humbleman.. your highlighted wording there is a crucial point isn't it and one that i will be reminding the FOS of if/when they get a move on with my complaints to be sure! True Steven about T&Cs and other effects all on the same page. Even of the correctly dated T&Cs (of which i haven't had many of those) you would be hard pressed to link them physically with the main 'application' form as they are always seperate. Another point i will be raising with the FOS. Just wish they would get a move on though! Today in the post just this from Blair, Oliver and Scott (Halifax). Dear Sir/Madam, NOTICE OF INTENDED COURT ACTION HALIFAX Against Mr Davey77 Sum Claimed: £1,042.64 Due By: 04/10/2007 Account Number: ****************** Formal notice is hereby given that our client has instructed us to commence court proceedings against you without delay. Papers are now being prepared for commencement of action through your local court to seek a judgment againest you. If you are a homeowner and do not pay the amount the court orders you to pay, we may then reapply to the court for a charging order on your property. This will give us repayment of the outstanding debt from the proceeds whenever the property is sold. YOU MUST MAKE PAYMENT NOW TO STOP ACTION BEING TAKEN: CALL US: It is vital that you call us TODAY on 0870 240 5138 to make payment or talk to our helpline staff about your account. Our lines are open Monday-Friday 8.30am to 7.30pm and Saturday 8.30am to 12.30pm. TO MAKE PAYMENT: * Call the helpline number 0870 240 5138 for payments by debit or credit card. * For internet & telephone banking, quote your account number as the reference and pay to sort code and account number ****** *******. * Send a cheque/postal order today to the address above writing your account number on the reverse of the payment. Please make your cheque payable to Blair, Oliver and Scott. I have given up trying to communicate with them and as the FOS complaint has been sent and acknowledged i will just wait and see now. What i wrote on the FOS form was: Wrote to Halifax 19th March 2007 (recorded delivery) asking for a copy of the credit agreement for the above account under the consumer credit act 1974 (77-79). I did not receive any reply. On the 24 May 2007 received a letter stating that Blair, Oliver and Scott (Halifax in-house debt collection agency) had been passed the above account. I wrote to Blair, Oliver and Scott 24 May 2007 explaining that Halifax were in default of the above request as of around the 6 April 2007 and that i did not acknowledge any debt to either Halifax or Blair, Oliver and Scott. On 28th June i sent another CCA request to Blair, Oliver and Scott (recorded delivery) who have ignored that request. The only reply vaguely relating to my original request was received 15 September 2007 consisting of a four line printout of charges. No properly executed agreement has been received by myself at any time. Informed Trading Standards 30 May 2007 who have taken no action that i am aware of. I understand the Ombudsman prefers a final response from an organisation before a consumer complaint is made but in this instance I have found that impossible due to the complete lack of communication from Halifax. They ignore all correspondence and refuse to reply in a professional manner to any detail or requests made to them. Likewise, Blair, Oliver and Scott refuse to acknowledge letters or correspond with me on this matter. I have spent six months trying to illicit a response from Halifax and recently threatened court action but my finances do not permit that at the moment so am relying on the Ombudsman to resolve matters. I enclose with this complaint copies of the correspondence since my original CCA request in March 2007 and as you will see I have been generous in allowing enough time for Halifax to comply even though they have committed a criminal offence in not supplying the relevant documentation within the statutory timeframe.

Hello Hell! Were you trying to say something just then as only my partial quote is showing?

Also the other day what i can only assume is some kind of response to my SAR request from Cahoot which included a one page list of charges and payments. I'm sure that doesn't comply with a SAR request as i also asked for details of any manual intervention and any deed of assignment also: Dear Me x, You have asked to a copy of your bank statements, which we assume is to enable you to reconcile your bank charges. We are happy to provide these to you and we enclose copies of your statements as requested. Should you decide to complain to us about unathorised overdraft charges or refer your case to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) after making a complaint to us, we should make you aware of our current policy on handling complaints from customers about bank charges. Although we believe the charges are fair, clear and lawful, Abbey (along with six other banks and a building society) has now become involved in legal proceedings with the Office of Fair trading (OFT) in relation to unauthorised overdraft bank charges which we believe will resolve the legal issues regarding the fairness and legality of unauthorised overdraft charges. It would be our normal approach to resolve any complaint through our internal complaints process as quickly as possible. However, until the determination of the legal issues in the above proceedings, we have asked the FSA to suspend the normal timetable for dealing with bank charges complaints, and the FSA has agreed to this request subject to conditions that protect your rights. Given this court case we have asked both the FOS and the courts not to proceed with any other case they are hearing until the test case is resolved. The FOS has indicated that as a general proposition it will indeed not proceed with cases which rely on the legal issues being considered in the test case. Similarly, you should be aware that if you choose to issue a claim in the Courts, the bank will immediately apply to the Court for an order to stay your action until resolution of the bank's proceedings with the OFT. We are sorry that we will not be able to respond in full to any complaint that you make now, but we (together with the FSA and the OFT) think that it is necessary to resolve the key legal issues before we decide how we should respond to complaints. We can assure you that once the legal proceedings are completed we will resolve any complaint you make as quickly as possible. If at that stage you do not agree with our conclusions you will of course be able to refer your case to the FOS or to the courts. Exactly what will happen next will depend on the courts. We do not know how long the case will take - we have promised to proceed as quickly as possible but inevitably given the importance of the issues being considered this may take many months to finally resolve. We can assure you that if you do make a complaint to us, we will register and store your complaint. Please retain your bank records, as this will make it easier on resolution of the test case for you to support any complaint you may make. We will keep you updated appropiately about proceedings with the OFT. You can check the latest position on our website at Abbey The FSA requires us to ensure that any complaint you make will not be adversely effected by the dealy in dealing with it. Yours sincerely, The Cahoot Team