Hello, sorry about being so quiet. I've actually ended up quite ill with the stress all of this has caused me, but I'm recovering now and ready to finish this fight with every ounce of strength I have left. The appeal was listed but was then adjourned because the original judge was 'too busy' to approve the transcript. I've now finally received the approved transcript and the hearing is coming up very soon. I can't really give too much away at this stage as it will be largely determined by what I have to say to the High Court Judge on the day and I'd rather not give the other side any heads up. I will say this though, having now read the transcript I am appalled that it has had to come this far and the glaring errors are shocking. Following the travesty of the trial I have entirely lost faith in the justice system so I am prepared for this to go against me too, however if I am going down I will be going down fighting. I have no assets and no money so all I have to lose at this stage is my faith that right and wrong is actually relevant in law, as opposed to just who has the most money. A big thank you to all that have followed this thread and offered tremendous support, it has often been because of all of you that I have carried on when I've felt like giving up, so thanks again x

The definition of Hire Agreements is contained in Section 15 I think. I'm working on the case law

Sorry, Section 132 can only be used for Consumer Hire agreements which are different to Hire Purchase agreements. This does not apply to Hire Purchase agreements. Breach of Statutory Duty is a cause of action on its own, the redress of which is the damages sustained as a result of the defendants breach of statutory duty.

In order for it to have got to allocation stage you would have needed to have filed a defence, do you have a copy of it you could scan and post up minus personal details?

Hello and welcome to CAG First things first, an allocation hearing is no big deal-it's certainly nothing that will decide the outcome of this claim. All civil claims need to be allocated to a 'track' which is usually dependant on the amount of the claim. In your case, as the amount is for more than £5k but less than £15 it's more than likely it will be allocated to the Fast Track which will come with its own set of rules and guidance. So what is the situation with regard this claim? Was a defence filed within the 28 day time limit? Are you disputing the whole claim? Did you make a counterclaim? I'm not sure what you mean by "in October they decided not to continue the contract " Is this a Hire purchase agreement?? Sorry for all the questions (and there'll probably be more!), but we really need to know all the details in order to give our opinions.

It all sounds good so far What is the figure on the agreement under the "Repossession, your rights" section?? Did you pay any deposit or part exchange when you took out the agreement?

It is absolutely vital that you are 100% certain this is a hire purchase agreement as opposed to a bill of sale, do you have a copy of the original agreement?? Also, were there any PPI or other insurances added to the agreement?

Hello and welcome to CAG I would think that in order to assist you further we really need to know some more details. It sounds absolutely despicable that you have lost your car over £38! Firstly, do you have a copy of your original agreement and if so could you scan it and post it up minus your personal details? Are you saying that you are £38 short of paying the car off altogether or are you just £38 in arrears??

Thank you for your support. It's confused me too but I've been speaking to a barrister and apparently this is how it goes these days, an attempt at streamlining the process and saving expense allegedly. It would appear that if an appeal had no merit it would be refused on paper, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. The first judge wasn't a High Court judge and I've looked into further and found that there have been other instances where his judgments were overturned on the basis that "the judge didn't take into account all the evidence and invented the incident" Hmmm... sounds familiar! I believe that High Court judges are obliged to follow the letter of the law as this is where case law precedents are set, so hopefully things will get sorted once and for all. Don't think I'll bother with the Part 18 request, I'm just getting myself worked up over nothing because this whole thing has been such a travesty

Thank you for all your help, it's really useful. There are 3 grounds for appeal: Ground 1- Mis-selling of Payment Protection Insurance 1) The Judge misinterpreted the nature of the claimant’s claim alleging misselling of PPI as being that of the unsuitability of the product. The claimant claimed that the PPI was mis-sold as it was made a condition of the finance and made no allegation to its suitability. 2) The judge incorrectly held that the presence of claimant’s signature on the agreement was sufficient to prove the PPI was sold correctly and failed to consider whether the supplier gave to its customer information "that was clear, fair and not misleading" so that an informed choice could be made. 3) The Judge failed to consider the evidence which shows clear systematic problems in the methods used by the defendant on previous sales of PPI policies. Ground 2- The payment of a Secret Commission to a Broker 4) The Judge overlooked written evidence showing a substantial amount of commission paid by the defendant to a broker, an unsubstantiated verbal averment by the defendant’s witness was relied upon in the judgment despite the higher amount being conceded by the defendant’s counsel during the trial. 5) The defendant conceded that there had been no disclosure regarding the payment of commission at the instigation of the agreement. 6) The lesser amount was allowed by the judge as being non causal, the judge was wrong to allow causation to be a complete defence to the claimant’s claims of secrecy and lack of fair and open dealings. Ground 3- Breach of Section 92 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 7) The Judge found in the claimant’s favour in a claim for trespass but subsequently either misinterpreted or failed to acknowledge Section 92 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, by which the agreement was regulated, overlooked supporting text and failed to make a consequential judgment. 8 ) The Judge was wrong to make an order that Section 92 was not applicable when the defendant’s defence was a denial that they entered the premises as opposed to a question of the relevance of the Law. Does anybody know if it's too late to do a Part 18 request???

Thanks for that This is all so strange to me, I know very little about appeals and then whatever I learn seems to get quashed! I was expecting a decision on my application for permission on paper followed by an oral hearing if that was refused, and then the hearing of the actual appeal some months later, the whole process taking the best part of a year! What has actually happened is - I submitted applications for permission to appeal, a stay of execution pending the outcome of the appeal and a copy of the transcript to be provided at public expense on 3rd May. 10 days later a Judge had looked at my applications, decided I could have a copy of the transcript, I could have a stay and fixed a time for hearing the application for permission and hearing the subsequent appeal in 5-7 weeks! Now that's what you call service I've been told I will receive a transcript of the judgment and I need to file and serve my appeal bundle within 5 weeks. I wonder how the other side will react to this course of events? Upon receipt of the sealed appellant's notice from the High Court they wrote to me saying they would "issue an appropriate response if and when permission is granted" - not gonna be much time for that if it's immediately followed by the appeal itself lol! Looks like the second and final round is coming up very soon... I can't believe this is finally, finally going to be over!

"WITHOUT NOTICE IT IS ORDERED THAT; Apellant's application for permission to appeal, with the hearing of the appeal (subject to permission) to follow, with a total time estimate of two hours, will be heard before a High Court Judge at *** Civil Justice Centre at 10.30am, on a date to be fixed, within a hearing window commencing 27th June 2011 and ending 15th July 2011,. NOTE TO THE RESPONDENT: this order is a direction under CPR PD 52 para 5.22 that the respondent should prepare for the hearing of the appeal, notwithstanding that permission has not been granted." **directions about filing and serving an appeal bundle** "There be a stay of execution of the order the subject matter of this appeal pending the outcome of this appeal or further order." All opinions gratefully received!!

Well it looks like we'll get to find out sooner rather than later! Just had notice from the High Court there will be a hearing between end of June middle of July in front of a High Court Judge. Have to say I'm a bit confused as to what is going on right now as it is totally NOT what I was expecting to have received The High Court have written to the lower court asking for them to make a copy of the transcript available at public expense and it be sent to me and that I need to submit an appeal bundle within 35 days of today. I am so confused!!! It appears to be saying that there will be a permission to appeal hearing followed immediately by the hearing of the appeal with a total time estimate of 2 hours and that the other side should prepare.... How can that possibly happen???? I think I need to post up the actual wording of the letter and get others' opinion, maybe I'm misconstruing what has been written

The judge spent the whole day complaining about how understaffed they were due to various judges being off sick and could we just "hurry this up??" Farcical to say the least! He took the easy way out because it was just taking too long. I do understand there must be time limits and trials cannot go on indefinitely, but surely fairness and justice should still remain the priority?!!

Oh dear it looks like I've resorted to playground tactics then After addressing all the issues with how the judge was wrong it's actually very difficult to see how you could say there was anything other than bias! He even ruled in their favour at times when they admitted they were wrong! One example of many I could quote:- Them: we only paid a tiny bit of commission and so it was irrelevant, Me: Here is written evidence of how much commission was paid and it was a hell of a lot more than you say, I notice you have omitted this document from your bundle. Them: (uncomfortable shuffle) ok we agree it was more but it still wasn't a very large amount compared to some other cases, Judge: I rule they only paid the tiny bit they first admitted to, (even though they changed their mind, backtracked, agreed they were wrong and don't have any evidence), and it was such a small amount it was irrelevant. My evidence and case law was just ignored. WTF??? Apart from being wrong, how can that be anything other than bias?

The latest is that permission to appeal has been requested from the High Court and I'm just waiting to find out if it's been granted or refused 'on paper'. I do know that my application for a copy of the transcript at public expense has been granted, so definitely a step in the right direction It is true that I might end up with a large bill if I lose, but this battle is about getting justice and obtaining a precedent as opposed to money. At present my situation is that I have absolutely nothing lose, (apart from time and sanity!), so even if things don't go my way in the end, they can't take something from me I haven't got. I don't think I would end up with a massive lump sum if I win as the claim wasn't for a massive amount in the first place, but the value to me of beating welcome in the High Court is entirely priceless!

So, interesting turn of events today I used my 14 extra days to complete the skeleton argument supporting grounds of appeal and took it along to the High Court today. When I filled in the Appeal Notice I also made further applications for a stay of execution and a copy of the transcript at public expense. Whilst submitting my skelly today, the clerk told me that my application for a copy of the transcript at public expense had been granted and I would receive directions in the form of an order in a few days. I have to admit I'm a bit confused by all of this, I was under the impression that all the applications would be dealt with together and it would take quite some time for a decision on permission to be reached?? Does anybody know how long on average it usually takes for applications for permission to be dealt with on paper?

Mcjohnson you are entitled to your opinion as are we all. I have no intention of getting into petty tit for tats with you or anyone for that matter, my time, attention and efforts are better spent elsewhere. Nobody has to listen to anything I have to say nor do I insist upon it, but if I can help anybody as a result of my own experiences then I will. Whoever you are and whatever your motive will have no bearing on me or what I do. I will not waste my time or energy defending myself against ill founded and pointless allegations, I know myself and have every confidence my actions will not mess with peoples' lives in any kind of contrary manner. If irritating people and provoking reactions is how you get your kicks then do carry on but it just won't work with me, sorry.

Did you decide if you want to go ahead with setting aside the discontinuance or you just going for wasted costs instead?

Mike, you really mustn't lose sight of the fact that you have done nothing wrong here. You had every intention of making your payments and keeping the car, the mix up with the payment dates was entirely out of your control and you did everything you could to put it right. It is the other side that have royally screwed up here and they know it. You do really need a clear, concise letter from your sol that outlines all of their failings and exactly what you insist they do in order to avoid legal action being taken against them. I must admit I don't know an awful lot about rescission of contract but I can happily share my knowledge on Sections 92, 87 and 140. Personally I would stick to the breaches of the CCA, but that is purely my opinion based on provable facts, offences and consequences. I've gotta go out shortly but I'm happy to help out tomorrow with a few pointers if I can

Sorry I haven't had a lot of time lately, I will have a look at some time today and see if there might be anything I can offer

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/comment/8502046/PPI-a-rotten-product-that-made-the-banks-billions.html

As you appear to have paid over half, you may want to consider Voluntary Termination and then use your cash to buy a different car outright??

Thanks Leakie There were a few times when I thought I was gonna buckle under the strain but we got there in the end. The appeal process is incredibly complicated, no information or rules appear to be clear or even consistent! That has got to have been one of the most difficult things I've ever done in my life, especially with the rawness of the hideous freak show trial still fresh in my memory. I seem to have developed some kind of bizarre phobia of courts and all things legal, so walking into Birmingham High Court today was quite a mammoth task Anybody considering an appeal, or a claim for that matter, should do some serious soul searching beforehand. You will need a will of steel and an army of support for starters!

It would entirely depend on the circumstances, has the creditor done something they shouldn't have or do you have some kind of gripe with them?? A judge would be highly unlikely give you a free car at an ordinary Return of Goods hearing, unfortunately there's so much more to it than I could give you a straightforward answer to.