You're a star! This link will prove invaluable for some other cases I'm dealing with too! I'm sure this will help LL as well Thanks Car2403, BB

Hi LL, There was someone on here that had got quite a few defaults removed but I cannot remember the circumstances or whom. I'm sure if you PM one of the site team they should know or do a search on the forum. BB

Hi LL, I would complain to the ICO anyway. They have a huge backlog and you can always amend/add this to your complaint. What are you intending to do once the 21 days are up? Are you intending making a claim for the money you have paid? BB

Hi LarneyLarnes, If you have been to court twice before to get HSBC to supply the documents, as per the DPA it is your right to see them and I am surprised that a judge would not find in your favour and order HSBC to do so. Have you also complained to the ICO? BB

Hi Zosa, An S10 is something that you send to the data controller of the bank insisting that they stop processing your info. I usually send it at the same time that I have sent the default letter to the bank when they have failed to supply a proper CCA. Some have ignored it and some have not responded to me but have taken ALL their info down. Here is a standard one that I use * STATUTORY NOTICE UNDER S10 DATA PROTECTION ACT 1998 * At NO time have I given my written permission for you or your company to process my data. I do not believe that you are in possession of a properly executed Consumer Credit Agreement as per my request nor are you in possession of any document signed by me giving you or your company permission to continue to process my data. Therefore take notice, that I require you to cease from processing with immediate effect and to remove all information relating to the above account The Data Protection Act 1998 Part II states the following Right to prevent processing likely to cause damage or distress (1) Subject to subsection (2), an individual is entitled at any time by notice in writing to a data controller to require the data controller at the end of such period as is reasonable in the circumstances to cease, or not to begin, processing, or processing for a specified purpose or in a specified manner, any personal data in respect of which he is the data subject, on the ground that, for specified reasons— (a) the processing of those data or their processing for that purpose or in that manner is causing or is likely to cause substantial damage or substantial distress to him or to another, and (b) that damage or distress is or would be unwarranted. (2) Subsection (1) does not apply— (a) in a case where any of the conditions in paragraphs 1 to 4 of Schedule 2 is met, or (b) in such other cases as may be prescribed by the Secretary of State by order. (3) The data controller must within twenty-one days of receiving a notice under subsection (1) (“the data subject notice”) give the individual who gave it a written notice— (a) stating that he has complied or intends to comply with the data subject notice, or (b) stating his reasons for regarding the data subject notice as to any extent unjustified and the extent (if any) to which he has complied or intends to comply with it. (4) If a court is satisfied, on the application of any person who has given a notice under subsection (1) which appears to the court to be justified (or to be justified to any extent), that the data controller in question has failed to comply with the notice, the court may order him to take such steps for complying with the notice (or for complying with it to that extent) as the court thinks fit. (5) The failure by a data subject to exercise the right conferred by subsection (1) or section 11(1) does not affect any other right conferred on him by this Part. SCHEDULE 2 Conditions relevant for purposes of the first principle: processing of any personal data states 1 The data subject has given his consent to the processing. 2 The processing is necessary— (a) for the performance of a contract to which the data subject is a party, or (b) for the taking of steps at the request of the data subject with a view to entering into a contract. 3 The processing is necessary for compliance with any legal obligation to which the data controller is subject, other than an obligation imposed by contract. 4 The processing is necessary in order to protect the vital interests of the data subject. 5 The processing is necessary— (a) for the administration of justice, (b) for the exercise of any functions conferred on any person by or under any enactment, © for the exercise of any functions of the Crown, a Minister of the Crown or a government department, or (d) for the exercise of any other functions of a public nature exercised in the public interest by any person. 6 (1) The processing is necessary for the purposes of legitimate interests pursued by the data controller or by the third party or parties to whom the data are disclosed, except where the processing is unwarranted in any particular case by reason of prejudice to the rights and freedoms or legitimate interests of the data subject. (2) The Secretary of State may by order specify particular circumstances in which this condition is, or is not, to be taken to be satisfied. Referring to Schedule 2 I have not given my consent to the processing There is no contract as you and your company admit to not having a properly executed agreement as per the CCA 1974 There is no legal obligation as there is no legal contract Quite the opposite therefore not applicable N/A 1. No written permission, no legal contract therefore not applicable 2. N/A May I also bring your attention to Part II Rights of data subjects and others, Section 13 13 Compensation for failure to comply with certain requirements (1) An individual who suffers damage by reason of any contravention by a data controller of any of the requirements of this Act is entitled to compensation from the data controller for that damage. (2) An individual who suffers distress by reason of any contravention by a data controller of any of the requirements of this Act is entitled to compensation from the data controller for that distress if— (a) the individual also suffers damage by reason of the contravention, or (b) the contravention relates to the processing of personal data for the special purposes. (3) In proceedings brought against a person by virtue of this section it is a defence to prove that he had taken such care as in all the circumstances was reasonably required to comply with the requirement concerned. It would not hurt to send this to the Data Controller at Ikano but note that you cannot make reference to it in your complaint to the ICO initially unless they have not complied. Once they have gone past the 21 days and you haven't heard anything, then you can add this to your complaint as another failure by them to adhere to the law:) If you had already asked for a copy of the properly executed CCA relating to that account in your SAR request, I don't see the need to request it again. Just make sure that you have for your own peace of mind. BB PS. No idea what's gone on with the font!

Hi Zosaphine, Legally you are within your rights to stop payments to your account until they supply a properly executed CCA. They have further strengthened your position by not responding to your SAR request and subsequent chasers. Without looking at template letter 3, I'm assuming it is the letter before action? If so, what you need to do now is go online to the ICO and make a complaint online. Be factual and state in bullet points whatthey have failed to do. If you had also S10'd the bank in question, also make reference to the fact that they are still processing your information internally and to third parties (that's if they are!) without your written consent as they have failed to supply a certified copy of a properly exceuted CCA which would have given them permission to do so. Attach the letters that you sent and any that you have received. Once you have done that, download the N1 form, complete it and take it your local court. You are asking the court to order the bank to supply the information you have legally requested as per the DPA. Once you have done that, sit back and wait for your paperwork from the court to arrive. Let me know how you get on, BB

Hi, I think the reason why you may not have heard anything is that it is still fairly new. Look how long it took for unfair bank charges to filter through. I have been working on mine now since July 2008. I probably could have got a lot further a lot sooner but hav ebeen distracted by a number of other issues. I am now totally focused and have some N1 claims going into the courts to get the banks to admit that they don't have a properly executed CCA. However, I totally agree that there should be a separate section so that people can share their successes and the steps that they took and also their failures - so that they rest of us can learn from them. BB

Hi Rigante, What exactly did you ask for in your original SAR request, as the one I use asks them for every last thing that they hold on you. Can you post it up here first of all? Cheers, BB

I have just wet myself with laughter:grin: I have a number too that are at N1 submission stage and this has lifted me no end. Thank you for the humour but more importantly, thank you for the support and gee up your post has given me and the rest of the forum. You have made my month!! BB

The up shot here is that they have not responded to your SAR. Did you send it special delivery and can prove that it was signed for? If you can, complain to the ICO - you can do this online and is pretty straightforward and then send HSBC a Letter before Action, referring to your original SAR letter and giving them the Royal Mail reference. Once teh 7 days is up, compile your N1 and take them to court to supply the info. If you haven't got the proof, you are going to have to start again from scratch I'm afraid. BB

Hi Hopster, Look at the top of this page on the left hand side and you will see 'General' just above 'Unenforceable Credit Agreements'. Click on that and it will take you to the main page on this section on the forum. Just above the big box that has the 'House of commons' in it on the left hand side, you will see 'New Thread'. Click on that and type away. BB

No they can't!! Please see my previous response to your other post. I suggest that you try to delete this one to save on any confusion. BB

Firstly - Recent posters, Can I suggest that we all start our own individual threads as it makes it really difficult and confusing to answer your specific questions. Cheers, Carol, I'm sure that you will but they will be as tight as a bats naggers to get the money back from. Unless a member of the site team corrects me, i would suggest that you SAR them to include a certified copy of the CCA and statements to include ALL payments made to the account since inception to when it was closed. Even though the account is settled, they should still keep all the information for minimum amount of time - 6 years I believe. My thought process is that you need to go down the route and get them to admit in court that they don't have and never had it before you can them make a claim for compensation. Don't worry, it's not as scary as it seems and they will probably admit they don't have without you having to go to court. You having nothing to lose except your £10 for the SAR so give it a go and let's see what comes up in the wash. When you respond, start your own thread so that you the answers and responses are specific to you! best wishes, BB

Hi Rigante, I get the feeling that some numbskull in HSBC has probably been shot as it appears that they have 'disposed' of a hell of a lot of crucial info such as this. Effectively, they have shot themselves in the foot. If they can't find or produce it, who is to say that it ever existed??? Your next bet is to send them a letter advising them that as they have not fulfilled your CCA request, the account is now in default. At the same time, send a SAR request to the Data Controller and enclose your £10 fee and also send a S10 request insisting that they stop processing your info and supplying it to other third parties such as DCA's and CRA's. We have gone done exactly the same route with HSBC and have issued a court claim against them to supply the CCA (which we both know they haven't got!) but for us to take it further, we need to get them to admit that in court so that they cannot miraculously muster one up at a later date! Let me know how you get on, BB

We are 4 months into the year - why would you want to cancel the agreement already?? BB

Mike, Firstly I would not have offered to settle at this stage, especially not until I know how strong or not my hand is. HSBC has not responded to your initial CCA request so are in default. If you want them to write off some of the balance, the only way that you will do that is from a position of strength ie they and you know that they don't have a CCA and they know that you are prepared to take it as far as you can and need to. It is highly unlikely, unless your current situation warrants it, that they will agree to anything else if you decide to go any other route. If you want them to write off 60% you need to SAR them and get them to send everything that they have on you. You will probably get a quite a big pile back without your CCA and a comment if you them send them a Letter before Action (LBA) asking for the agreeement saying that as it is held on a different storage system, it is not part of the DPA. (data protection act). That other system is microfiche and if they had bothered to check they would realise that it is. Anyway, I digress. I would start at that for the moment and see what the couriers bring you! Good luck, BB

Hopster, As legal action has been threatended, you need to send off a CPR request as well as a SAR. Both will force them to show what exactly they will rely on in court and if a properly executed CCA is not there, then their case is seriously damaged. BB

Look at it like a game of chess. You have to build up to your checkmate and cover your bases at each step. It's when you are in checkmate that Halifax will have to put their hands up and admit defeat. Patience is the other word to take on board! BB

Nedgas, Have just been reliably informed that I got the court fees wrong and after double checking, they are right. Shouldn't be more than £30 or so. I was getting it confused with another case we are bringing. BB

Jogs, You're right. I'm getting this mixed up with the court fees for something else. Not often I tell a man he's right - must have something to do with the West Sussex air! BB

Hi Havingastella, Their is a fee scale and the fee depends on the amount claimed or if you don't know, there's a flat fee. I wish that it was £30! BB

Hi Milly, No problem. I got it from Zubo and I think we are both happy to spread our knowledge! Nedgas, They should respond in full to your SAR request but believe it or not, they don't always. In theory, they should send you every single piece of information that they have on your whether it be on computer, filed or microfiche, telephone conversation transcripts etc. The should also send a certified copy of a properly executed CCA as well as all statements for the duration of your agreement. HOWEVER, some banks only send say 6 years worth of statements saying they don't hold them for any longer, some send some of the other bits and no statements at all and some, quite stupidly, send nothing at all. This is why you need to be very precise and patient in how you go about this as if you give them enough rope, they will eventually hang themselves! If they don't respond in full to your SAR request you make a complaint about them to the ICO. You can do this online. You then send the offending bank a Letter Before Action letter giving them 7 days to send you the information that you requested. If you get nothing after 7 days you then need to download an N1 from from here, (I suggest you read the notes for completing it properly) and trot off to your local court, pay your £108. The bank has no legal right to withhold any information it holds about you and the court has the right to force them to do so. If they don't have it, they will have to say in court that they don't have it or supply what they have and that's when it starts to get intersting! For now, let's take one step at a time. get your SAR out and let's see what the postman brings you! BB

They get me so mad!!! Of course their solicitor would say that!! SAR them immediately. This gives them 40 days to supply all the info and CCA that they supposedly have. It also gives you further ammunition down the track if they don't supply it. You can get the SAR template from the library. BB

Hi Zosaphone, Glad to hear that your little one is better now. You send them a letter before action letter giving them 7 days to cough up the missing info. Once they ignore that, complete an N1 form asking the court to ordet them to supply the information. If you look in the library on here you will get the manin body of the info you need to supply. You then trot off to your local court, pay your £108 and sit back and wait and see. Let me know how you get on with that. Good luck, BB

Hi BoothyBoy, No worries. I am only passing on what I have learnt from the good people here and at Consumer Credit Support. You have to go at this patiently and know what you are doing otherwise the banks and the DCA's will try to take you as mug. Sending off for your CCA's is the first step on a long journey that may well take you the best part of a year, so don't enter this if you are not prepared for that and all the dirty 'tackles' they will try to throw at you. Keep me posted, BB