Kaakaapo Vs. Lloyds TSB (Again)

[kaakaapo]

A learned friend of mine alerted me to this site, we both got hit with a lot of bank charges during University and now we're trying to get them back. I have a Lloyds TSB standard account and a Natwest credit card to take on and will update my progress here in the hope that it'll help and inspire others.

 

I'm just getting into everything but sadly I'm not the intellect I used to be and I have some questions.

 

1) Are all bank charges 100% unlawful? Even when I made the mistake of taking out too much cash?

 

2) Second, I need to the The Data Protection Disclosure Request, can I simply ask them to provide my full account history? Last time I asked for just a statement Lloyds wanted to charge me £25 for it!

 

3) I imagine I will post the claim as my Lloyds account is in manchester and I now live in Liverpool. I imagine for the Lloyds account I post it to my branch, do I also just post to Natwest credit card to find the details of that account? Can I just pay by cheque, made out to the bank?

 

 

Thanks for getting this ball rolling, sorry if these seem ignorant questions. I hope it works and look forward to spreding the word as banks have well and truly screwed me over the years. Wish me luck!

 

Dean

[alanfromderby]

Hi

 

Welcome to the forum, the more people we have on board the more strength we have to fight these unlawful charges. I understand that you have a great many questions, and would therefore advise that you to have a look at the FAQ's:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=5

 

In the same section you will also find a step-by-step guide which will help you through the process.

 

All the best with your claim. Please keep us informed of your progress, and remember that we are all in this together. If after reading through the FAQ's you still have questions, please post them to the forum.

[kaakaapo]

After some delay the claim against Lloyds is underway. I paid the £10 then found out how to search charges on-line, bu never mind. I have two other accounts victim of excesive charges and this is really only a practice one for the big bills.

 

I found out I'd only ben given £50 charges on this account, much les than I thought. I'm not going to chase up the interest, it's only £5.27 and I think that thats on the agreed intrest.

 

When I requested my data the customer notes page reminded me of a previous bank dispute I was involved in. The bank was supposed to send an international bank transfer of 1150 Euro but sent £1150 instead, £350 too much. This worked in my favour as it came of the second payment I had to make, but when I complained asking for hte fees back they refunded me the £350. Unsuprisngly when they asked the recipiant of the transfer for the money back they said no, rightfully so, but then LLoyds asked me to give back the money they'd given me in error while trying to compensate for another mistake they had made! Anyway, long story short, will this effect my claim?

 

Anyway,I shall press on with my trying to topple the bank £50 at a time.

 

 

Thanks for all the detailed help, and I apologies for asking questions which although not always clearly apparant, are elsewhere answered. It must be damn annoying, but I'll make it up to you!

[kaakaapo]

I won out against Lloyds TSB, but in the following letter they assured me they didn't have to give me the money back (Only £50), but that they would because they're such good sports and like my moxie, the cut of my jib, my attitude and badittude...

 

 

They also claim they will not issue more than three charges per month, and that the first time you exceed your limit in a year they don't charge you. Anybody have contrary experince?

 

 

 

 

Dear Mr. Ellison

Re: Account Charges for Overdraf Excesses

 

Thank you for taking hte time to contact us about your account.

 

I understand that:

 

• You Feel that the charges you have incurred are unlawful
  
• You are unhappy with the amount of charges you have incurred as a result of being overdrawn
  
• You have requested that recent charges of £50 should be refunded

When you become a customer, we give you details of any charges for the day to day running of your account. Details of our charges are also avaliable from our branch staff, telephone helpline or our website.

 

For the vast majority of our customers bankiong with us can be completley free as charges are not masde for services such as debit cards, cash machine withdrawals, balance requests, statments, cheque books and Internet banking. We also do not charge for processing Direct Debits and Standing Orders when they are paid through our customers accounts.

 

One of the few services we apply charges for are when a customer does not have enough money in thier account to meet payments they have requested us to make. If customers think they may exceed any limit they have, we urge them to contact us to discuss thier requirments. Any requests for furhter lending are then assessed in line with our usuasl credit policy. Similarly, when we return an item, we are preventing a customer exceeding thier limit, and again as we explain clearly to our customers, this process incurs a charge.

 

Typically, we do not levy customers an excess overdraft fee the first time they go overdrawn without agreement, as long as it hasn't happened in the past tweleve months and we limit excess fees to a maximum of three occurences in any one month.

 

As a business we are intitled to set charges to cover additional work. These charges are not hidden and are notified in the guide to banking charges leaflet we produce. We advise our customers to ensure cleared funds are avliable in their accounts to meet payments due. You will also note that in the front of each cheque book we request that funds are avliable before cheques are issued.

 

You incurred charges becuase you did not ensure funds were avliable in your account to cover the payments set up by you. It is your resposibility to operate you account within any agreed limits and within the terms and conditions.

 

You accepted these terms when you opened your account. We did not agree to pay your account in excess of the asmount agreed without charges being made.

 

We do expect your account to be run in line with the terms and conditions of its opperation. This means that you must ensure that cleared funds are depositedinto the account the working day before any payments are due. If you do not feel you will be able to run your account in accordance with the terms and conditions, we may have to consider withdrawing certain facilities, such as debit cards or chequebooks you may have.

 

The above said, I do recognise that you account conduct is usually satisfactory and this does appear to be a genuine oversight on your part. With this in mind I am prepared to refund the £50 of charges you have incurred. I should point out that this is purley a gesture of goodwill, since you are a valued customer, and not because of the points you have raised in your letter. I must also advise you that any future charges will stand unless there has been a bank error. If you do not feel able to agree with this, I must refer you back to my previous paragraph.

 

In case you haven't recieved a copy of our leaflet called 'How to voice your concerns' I've enclosed one with my letter. This tells you all you need to know about resolving your complaint with us.

 

If you are unhappy with my decision and feel that you have something to add which might change the outcome, please get in touch. if we cannot agree on a solution at that point, I will help you refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service for independent arbitration.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

 

Dave Just

Assistant Manager.

 

 

 

 

So I got my money back but I was made to feel like I was asking for my ball back after kkicking it into a neighbours garden.

 

I did pay the £10 to have a list of charges sent to me, so I'm only up £40 really, but it really should be stressed to people wanting to claim against Lloyds TSB that YOU CAN FIND INFOMATION FOR FREE USING ON-LINE BANKING.

 

1. Log on and go to 'Account Overview', under 'Options' select 'Statments' then click 'Go'.
   
2. Under 'Please select a statment option' select 'Search your statments'.
   
3. Finally, under 'Payment type' select 'Charge'.

Good luck everybody

[kaakaapo]

After resolving my existing issues with Lloyds TSB earlier this month I've been given another £30 overdraft excess fee!

 

On the document I had to sign to retrive the £50 advised me that future charges will stand unless there had been a bank error, so I imagine if I write in again they'll make life much harder for me. Can I still claim back after signing the last form, and if only claiming £30 will it make the procedure easire or harder?

 

In the last letter they also told me they do not usual charge for the first overdraft excess in every tweleve months, although this seems to be the case here.

 

 

Any advice anybody?

[Dappa44]

You should NOT have accepted the terms outlined in the letter m8.

 

That money is your not theirs.

 

If it went to court they could say that your signature has waved any right to arguing for charges. Sticky situation now.

[alanfromderby]

I understood that you could not sign away your right to challenge an unlawful act in such circumstances. A contract is not binding if it breaches UK law.

[Dappa44]

You are probably right Alan, i would imagine it would be very hard to contest in court and theres a chance Lloyds would defend. I wouldnt like to take the risk for such a small amount.

[alanfromderby]

I can't see them defending for that amount - close your account maybe, but not defend!

[kaakaapo]

Last week I got charged amountung to £50 refunded on my account, but to get te money I had to sign to say I accepted there was no real case and they where paying me back as a guesture of goodwill and sign that future bank charges would stand unless it was a bank error (A poor move, I know, but I needed to resolve it quick, and this is only a trial run before moving onto accounts with much larger charges to regain).

 

However, the DAY AFTER the money went into my account I was given a £30 overdraft excess charge!

 

They say the money will come out in the start of June and I've already written to them the with the Priliminary Approach For Repayment Letter and been told the charge stands.

 

So now I'm wondering:

 

• Can I start the court proceedings on HMCS for only £30? Willthey dismiss it for being such a petty claim?
  
• Can I get the ball rolling now or do I need to wait until I've been charged the £30?
  
• Having signed the past goodwill form can I claim this money back at all, or did that agreement only apply to the last amount?

Any pointers much appreciated.

[closey]

Could you post the exact wording that you signed your name against?

[kaakaapo]

I posted it earlier, you can see the full letter Here

 

The more I look at it the more I think it was a dreaful blunder, I could imagine them sending it knowing another fine was on the way. Bloody banks.

[Movingon]

I don't think it's possible to sign away an absolute right you already have in law.

[kaakaapo]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, especially concidering that they're asking me to agree to the contract I signed to agreeto which was wrong to begin with.

 

Just a tad aprehensive about continuing with it and ending up in court without a leg to stand on. Might go along with the Letter Before Action, the legal bit in the last paragraph might move things along a bit more

 

Dean

[alanfromderby]

If in doubt refer them to the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977.

[kaakaapo]

This topic was closed on 03/07/19.

If you have a problem which is similar to the issues raised in this topic, then please start a new thread and you will get help and support there.

If you would like to post up some information which is relevant to this particular topic then please flag the issue up to the site team and the thread will be reopened.

- Consumer Action Group