@BankFodder @stu007  just wondered what you think are next steps

Letting agent should have emails of conversations, we certainly do

Just received this email today following the SAR request I sent to the Letting Agent.

Please can you advise our next move? Is it small claims court now?

Dear xxx,

In response to your letter, I would like to inform you that we do not hold any of your personal information.

We are a small company and data collected is only handled by 1 internal employee who conducts the reference checks.

Once the reference check has been completed, the documents are destroyed by deleting the data. Therefore, we cannot provide you with any of your personal data as it has been deleted and we no longer hold any of your personal information.

In your situation as soon as you pulled out of the deal, your information was deleted and was not shared with any external organisations.

The nature of renting a property requires the applicant to go through a reference check which you did and by doing so you sent us the required documents. The information which we had was sent to us by yourself, for the purpose of conducting a reference check. We do not need to hold personal data on applicants who do not move into a property. Once you pulled out of the deal your data was deleted.

We do not share any personal data with third parties or place prospective tenants on any list.

Cool Cribs Estate agents is registered with the ICO and has a certificate of registration.

Please do let us know if you need anything else.

Regards,

Please can you tell me how long i should allow for a response to the SAR?

@stu007 @BankFodder please can you check the Letter of Claim below before we send this to the Letting Agent

Address

This Letter is on behalf of the following individuals;

Names of people involved in paying Holding Deposit

Address of Letting Agent

3 September 2019

Letter before Court Claim

Dear Sir

Re: Address of Property

Following our communication on email with reference to the Lease of the above Property this letter explains our situation and why we were left with no choice but to pull out of the Let and why we are entitled to a full refund.

We are once again requesting a full refund of the Holding Deposit which we paid you in good faith on the 2^nd August 2019 of £705. This was paid to you because you agreed to a 6 month break clause in our Lease – something which was very important to us.

We have attached a copy of your correspondence where you agreed to this 6 month break clause

We would like a reply as soon as possible so that we know you have received this letter.

If you don't agree to the refund, could you please then send us a detailed response saying why you don't agree.

If we do not receive a satisfactory response from you within 30 days of the date of this letter, we intend to issue proceedings against you in the County Court without further notice.

This may increase your liability for costs.

We refer you to the Practice Direction on pre-action conduct under the Civil Procedure Rules, and in particular to paragraph 13-16 which sets out the sanctions the court may impose if you fail to comply with the Practice Direction.

We look forward to your acknowledgement.

Yours faithfully

Thanks @king12345, so this is a Small Claims Court (MCOL) route then?

Thanks @stu007, will arrange for these to be sent.  @king12345 Can I ask why you think the Property Ombusman if they are pro the Estate Agent as seems to think they are and a waste of time?

So is this Small Claims Court then?

Do you think because they actually confirmed the 6 month break clause on the 3rd that we do have a viable case, and its not just a case that we backed out because we felt like it?

Hope you don't mind me asking, I'm just wanting to make sure we're not being stupid about this

Surely the Letting Agents response of no more communication unless its through your Lawyer is a Deadlock situation?

28 th – Email from Student

Please can you clarify which parts of the Tenants Fees Act 2019 that came into force on 1 st June 2019
are you using to refuse the return of our Holding Deposit / say its non refundable?
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28 th Aug – Email from Letting Agent

Because we have gone through the whole process and at the end you have changed your offer for
the property and you have pulled out of the deal

This 1 week rent doesn’t even cover us nothing in terms of the cost we have encountered from your
withdrawal.
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28 th Aug – Email from Student

Please can you show me the which part you are using to refuse / say is non-refundable?

I would like to remind you that our decision not to proceed was based on the failure of you to
arrange the break clause in the agreement (which was an essential component of our agreement from
the outset!),

You’re email on the 3 rd August specifically said

Please can you let us know details of any letting agent redress scheme you belong to because looking
back at our correspondence we made it very clear from the start that we wanted a Break Clause

It was very important to us

You asked for our Holding Deposit and said you would confirm details following receipt of the Deposit –
as soon as we had paid you you then back tracked on your email of the 3 rd August where you state it is a 1
year Agreement with a 6 month break clause
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28 th Aug – Email from Letting Agent

Please see below the email when we spoke about the break clause and it was agreed for 1 year.

I have numerous email with the other group members which they have agreed for the one year.

Subject: Your Offer

Hi Guys,

I can confirm that we have received £705.00 as a holding deposit for xxxxx and attached is the
receipt.

Offer:
Price: 705 pw
Move in date: 4 th  Sept 2019
Tenancy: 1 year
Our next step is reference check; please provide us with the following within next week the latest:
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28 th August – Email from Student

Yes I have this email that you have copied below, but if you look at the time you sent the one confirming a 6 month break clause this was at 14:44pm on the 3 rd – so after the email below

Please can you let me know details of the redress scheme you belong to?
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29 th August – Email from Letting Agent

Please speak to the other tenants which I have been dealing regarding the viewing and we have confirmed this via email and over text and other means.

 If this was your issue why didn’t you cancel the deal then? But you chose to send me the references and made use go through the whole process?

You should talk to your group
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29 th August – Email from Student

I am fully aware of all the correspondence between the others and yourself, we have a timeline of all the conversations

 I’m worried you are not replying to me about the Letting Agent Redress Scheme, do I need to contact the Council to ask if you are a member?

 All we want is our Holding Deposit refunded in full and we will drop this

 If not, you leave us no option but to file a complaint to the Council as you are not replying to the questions we are asking and you clearly have not looked at the timeline of our conversations and when you agreed to a 6 month get out clause

 Its up to you  

Look forward to hearing from you asap, and hope we can solve this amicably

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29 th August – Final Response from Letting Agent

Good luck with your case.

Unfortunately the holding deposit is not refundable as you have pulled out of the offer and you are using the break clause situation to get your deposit back.

As explained before - we agreed on a 1 year lease, you sent us all your references and guarantor documents and details - you were delayed on this but you still sent all the documents - we prepared the contract and sent it to you - once we requested payment for the move in you withdrew from the offer. By this point the break clause was not an issue as you went through with the process.

I am ready to go all the way on this.

All our company information that you need are in our website.

From now on please get your lawyer or your representative to contact us regarding this case. You withdrew from the deal without giving any explanation or option to negotiate and the deposit will not be refunded.

I would like to point out that the only reason we pulled out of the offer was because the Letting Agent back tracked on what he agreed to with us on the 3 rd August when he sent us an email confirming a 6 month break clause

We proceeded with all the paperwork he requested because as far as we were concerned we had a 6 month break clause

I also need to point out that the Letting Agent did not provide us with any Terms and Conditions of the Holding Deposit, and neither did he ask us to sign anything confirming the Holding Deposit was
non refundable

We trusted that the Letting Agent would have stuck to his word of a 6 month break clause as he stated and then when the Tenancy Agreement arrived there was no break clause at all on the paperwork

I have since checked his website and the Letting Agent is part of The Property Ombudsman Their website says you must follow the Letting Agents Complaint Procedure and file a complaint Im guessing our emails above cover this, and also the Letting Agent says he will only deal with our Lawyer from now on

So please can you advise?

Do you think we have a case?

Response just received from letting agent @stu007

Please can you clarify which parts of the Tenants Fees Act 2019 that came into force on 1^st June 2019 are you using to refuse the return of our Holding Deposit / say its non refundable?

Hi

Ahhh ok, thank you!

I will let you know what they say!

@stu007 Please could you clarify what you mean with the following sentence:

Due to our Dispute over the Holding Deposit I now require further clarification as this Holding Deposit comes under the Tenant Fees Act 2019 which parts your letting agency are using to class it as 'Non-Refundable' Holding Deposit.

I am a bit confused with the part after 2019

Below is the actual email trail between us and the Letting Agent with dates

3rd August - First Email from Letting Agent
Hi Guys
I can confirm that we have received £705 as a holding deposit for XXXX and attached is the receipt
Offer:
Price:705 pw
Move in date 4 th September
Tenancy – 1 year
Our next step is to reference check: please provide me the following info for yourselves and
guarantors
(Etc etc – list of items required)

3 rd August – from Student
Could you send me a copy of the break clause as I have some concerns.
Thanks

3 rd August from Letting Agent
Sorry a copy of a Break Clause?
What is this?

3 rd August – from Student
I was just wondering about the Contract if it was through the Summer of 2020 because I wont be in
London during summer of 2020

3 rd August – from Student
Also, how does the Break Clause work?

3 rd August – from Letting Agent
The Property will be rented for 1 year without a break clause
This is what we have agreed

3 rd August – from Student
But you told us it was a one year lease with a 6 month break clause

3 rd August – from Letting Agent
The Contract is for 1 year without a break clause

4 th Sept – 3 rd Sept 2020
Let me know if there is an issue

3 rd August – from Letting Agent
Kindly email me once the payment is done and I will confirm everything on my end
Just to confirm this is for a 1 year agreement with 6 months break clause

3 rd August – from Letting Agent
Yes Ive spoken to you over the phone and explained that the agreement needs to be for 1 year
The landlady doesn’t want to have another agreement
If you want to leave early and replace yourself that will be fine
Let me know?

3 rd August – from Student
What about subletting rooms – is this allowed by the landlady?

3 rd August – Letting Agent
We can allow that but only once per tenant during the tenancy and the incoming tenents need to be
referenced fully

3 rd August – from Student
What do you mean by references fully?
Sorry I don’t undertstand what you are saying in the previous email. Could you explain it more
please?

3 rd August – from Letting Agent
Sorry been sending a lot of emails for simple questions
You can call me for explanations
What I mean is that when new tenants come in we need to do references for them

August 5 th from Student
Im sending this email to ask about the break clause. Before we paid the holding deposit you had said
we would be agreeing on a 1 year lease with a 6 month break clause which we were ok with.
However, you have changed the terms after we paid the Holding Deposit. We would really like the

break clause as its an Insurance in case something happens and we have to terminate the contract.
We should also have been made aware that the Landlady didn’t want the break clause before we
paid the Holding Deposit
If the lease cannot have the break clause then we will have to decline to rent the property. In this
case we would like our deposits back as it was your communication that would lead to us pulling out
of the contract
Please do find out about this form the Landlady as fast as you can as we need to find
accommodation asap

5 th August – from Letting Agent
I have been in contact with one of the other students before I sent the offer to the landlady. I
explained that it will be a 1 year contract and you will be allowed to sublet your rooms if you wish to
leave early
The above is the agreement which the landlady has agreed with
Now I have the Option of a 8 month break clause which I cant find out as the landlady is on holiday
and not reachable until 15 th August
The holding deposit is non refundable if you change your mind on the offer Ive sent to the landlady
Please let me know your final decision

6 th August – from Student
We would like to forward with the Property but await your response from the landlady when she is
back from holiday

23 rd August – from Letting Agent
The landlady has accepted you as tenants
I will be sending the Tenancy Agreement over shortly

Hope this is clearer now

Please can you tell us the next step?

I will also reply to other questions in a new post

Agent is Coolcribbs
Landlady is NEHA SHAH
Im second year at UCL
Yes, you are correct, we signed nothing for the Holding Deposit, it was mearly an email on the 2 nd
August asking us to pay £705, with their bank details etc and a note on the bottom saying if the
Landlady rejected our deposit it would be fully refundable
Then we paid it on the 2 nd and on the 3 rd received an email from the Letting Agent saying he could
confirm receipt of the £705 as the Holding Deposit and that this email was a receipt
The Letting Agent said it was a Contract for 1 year without a break clause
We then queried this again, as we had asked for a break clause
The Letting agent responded with this below
Before I sent the offer to the Landlady, I explained that it will be for a 1 yr contract and you will be
allowed to sublet your rooms if you wish to leave early
The above is the agreement which has been agreed with the landlady
Now I have the option of a 8 month break clause with the landlady but I cant find out as the landlady
is on holiday and not reachable until the 15 th Aug
The holding deposit is non refundable if you change your mind on the offer I have sent to the landlady
As I mentioned over the phone I could help advertise your rooms if you wish to leave early
On the 5 th Aug the Letting Agent forwarded us the forms for Reference Check and Guarantor Checks
On the 19 th all the information they required was sent over
(Delay inbetween as on holiday)
On the 23 rd we were sent the Tenancy Agreement
Up until now we had received nothing re the break clause we had asked for so presumed it would be
in the Agreement
It wasn’t, so we have said we would like to pull out
On the 24 th we received this response
The holding deposit is not refundable as you are withdrawing from this deal.

I will need a confirmation from
Everyone that they are withdrawing and we will put the property back on the market.

The move in date is on the 4th and the landlady is left with a very short time to find another tenant.

This will incur a lot of extra cost from both us as an agency and the landlady which we will try to
recover.

You will hear from us soon.

I am a University Student looking to rent accommodation along with three other Students

We found a four bedroomed flat and called the Letting Agent to say we were very interested

We had a viewing and raised some questions

We wanted to check if there was a break clause in the Lease

The Letting Agent said we would need to pay a Holding Deposit whilst he waited for the Landlady to return from Holiday

So we paid £750 split between the four of us to the Letting Agent

We then received an email to say the Holding Deposit was non refundable

References were then checked and the tenancy Agreement arrived which needed to be signed by each guarantor and tenant and send back the full signed agreement

At this point we got to see the Tenancy Agreement for the first time and the break clause of 6 months was nowhere to be seen so this made us very nervous and we decided to pull out as we felt we didn’t want the risk of not being allowed to leave the property until a full year was up

We emailed the Letting Agent who replied with the following:

The holding deposit is not refundable as you are withdrawing from this deal.

I will need a confirmation from

Everyone that they are withdrawing and we will put the property back on the market.

The move in date is on the 4th Sept and the landlady is left with a very short time to find another tenant. 

This will incur a lot of extra cost from both us as an agency and the landlady which we will try to recover.

So, my question is are we eligible to get a refund of our Holding Deposit – bearing in mind we were not told we wouldn’t get it back until after we had paid it?