Crisis Loans won't be paid if you don't get benefit. Such a loan is only paid up to your next due benefit payment date - ie they give you the absolute minimum (and you have to travel to the JC to pick it up), and only if you have absolutely nothing. They don't give money to people as a substitute for benefit. Now maybe the system has changed, but there is no guarantee for hardship payments and the JC can leave people without money. for instance if i fail my medical i get nothing. I have to claim JSA. Also if you are living in the family home you get no hardship payment at all - it is expected that the people you live with will support you (whether they actually can is another matter).

Except some people just don't have the time and energy after a long day in a job they hate to pursue other work.

Unfortunately they can stop it. Hardship rate, which must be applied for, is not guaranteed. There is no guaranteed minimum for people, however small, who suffer the wrath of this heavily punitive system.

Indeed. But it's sad they can farm out claimants like cattle for the welfare providers such as I have mentioned (the real benefit spongers) and yet that money can't be used more productively to directly help people. Unemployment is a gravy train and as such it's big business. Whatever people might feel about 'scroungers' this will never change, certainly not under this fake government we now have that no one actually elected in. Of course this assumes you believe the nonsense about a deficit.

I believe the jobcentre should help finding work for claimants. Not just sit back and advertise whatever comes through their doors. You'd think and organisation like that would have influence within all spheres of employment and could help. Instead they just funnel all claimants through the same few jobs and wonder why people remain out of work. It's a very stupid system that instead should focus on the individual and their needs/wants in terms of employment, not let them waste away in pointless work for next to nothing, or give money to privateers like Emma Harrison.

Well that's good. Obviously! But my experience is my experience. I can't pretend otherwise. I remember once having the manager rather vocally criticise me for apparenlty not making enough effort to look for work. She had been called over by the adviser on an unrelated matter (they mucked me about gettting funding for a passport so i coudl have ID and let me down with that as well). She decided that, becuase a) there were jobs on the system and b) I was signing on, that I was not making enough effort. She proceeded to say that, if I could be bothered that she could provide me with labouring work without a CSCS card (she didn't offer me any, or have any just shouted at me).

Because in my experience the JC treat people like dirt, make no effort to offer help of any kind, farm people off to these awful providers (like a4e) and don't canvas for or look for work on the 'customers' behalf (as the cusomter himself has to). They are petty dictators and bureacrats and half the reason for my current stress and anxiety is having to deal with them, and I dread having to do so again if i stop receiving ESA.

the Citizens wage is an idea that would solve these problems overnight. But i don't believe there are people that don't want to do anything.

ALL the JC is good for is causing problems it seems to me. They certainly don't help. I'm not sure what a 'dead head scrounger' is. Sounds like prejudice to me.

So as I said, the JC can force you into a job. Splitting hairs over this point seems counter productive. If the choice is applying for a job you don't want and destitution through sanctions then there's no choice at all and the DWP are forcing you to apply. If this is the best this silly government can do for people then it's no wodner society has so many problems. People should be helped into meangingul propductive and rewarding work, not into whatever crap the DWP can be bothered to advertise and pressgang people into,.

Roughly how long does it take for the results of the medical to be decided and for the decision maker to let you know the result and is ESA then immediately stopped. I can't see them restarting ESA quickly in regard to a subsequent appeal.

Apparently it was possible for F DACs, above.

Let's be honest this question is really about forcing people into work they don't want. That is not regarded as a good enough reason by the DWP, consequently they will stop your money. So, in real terms, they can force you into a job. I don't agree with the system, i think it's ass-backwards. But they can force you into work because they force you to apply for whatever work (or that which passes for it) on their system when you sign on. And i've been through their sanctioning/decision making process; it's biased at best. Also be aware they stop your money the instant there is a 'doubt' as to your claim (which is the technical term for breaking the JSA - not looking for work). You can appeal, but until that time you get no money. The appeal may overturn the decision and backdate your claim or it might reduce the weight of the sanction allowing some money through (which in some cases is hardly better than none). If you have your money stopped you might be legible for hardship rate (about 40% of regular dole). If you aren't legible you starve. It's that simple, and that cruel.

So they can in fact force you to take a job.

You seem to be misunderstanding the question. I'm asking what the rules are in respect of the situation I outlined. For example, what are the rules for getting taxis.

Face to face interview for a crisis loan is ridiculous. How can people afford bus fares to attend such interviews. The DWP really needs to address the needs of people (such as myself) in rural areas not served with facilities. I was told to apply for a crisis loan twice when the DWP gacve me incorrect advice in receipt of my ESA claim. I was told by the crisis loan phone person (whos attitude was dreadful) that I would have to pick up the loan from the jobcentre. Without bus fare (hence the need for a CL) i couldn't do it. They also told me, after the interview, that they knew half way through I would otherwise be ineligible anyway, but chose to waste my time proceeding with it.

I'm not sure why you are trying to traduce the issues I mention. If they don't apply to you then fine, but don't judge me based on your own experience. I don't understand how your last paragraph answers the question.

It's not possible because i lack the equipment.

Please don't talk to me like that, it's uncalled for. Once it's over it's far from finished.

What right do i have to ask for an appointment of my own choosing (as opposed to ATOS's supposed and arbitrary rules about only 2 weeks in advance). The medical is 'supposed' to be after 3 months on ESA. But what are the rules in respect of me, a client, ringing up and saying 'no, i want to be seen in september'?

I'd be very VERY surprised if they go for this considering they told me I coudln't book the appointment that far in advance in the first place. They said (I can't know whether this is true or not, they are the ones holding the keys and controlling the appointment system) they can't book beyond a fortnight in advance. I'm not even sure what I could say to ask them to put it back two months!

I've looked at the point system; even a fair medical using that system I don't think will give me enough points. That's what I'm trying to say. I'm sure if I rang them back and asked to rearrange it till september they'd say no.

But I don't have the luxury of seeing other doctors. That's the point I'm trying to make. That's just how it is locally. However that's not an issue at the moment (won't be at least until september). The problem I have at the moment is dealing with attending this medical. I don't mind it per se, it's everything around it and given their inflexibility in dealing with patients (not customers, that is totally the wrong word) I don't seem to have much choice.

Well, it is relevant if they refuse to write a note. Unfortunately there are no other doctors I can see. Our surgery merged with the nearest other a few yeas ago when the original doctors retired and coudln't get replacements. Sadly things aren't better for it as we get the short end of the stick with fewer doctors (who seem to either be on leave or at the wrong surgery venue - there are two). So if the local doctor's won't write a note, I'm not entirely sure who else will.

I'm aware of what ATOS are all about. As I've said, it's not the medical itself that's the problem; if the medical could be conducted at the local surgery, for instance, then there would be much less of a problem. I still don't think i'd pass and if I appeal and the appeal isn't found in my favour by September I don't think there will be another note. Due to the nature of the organisation at my local surgery i've seen pretty much everyone. They don't really like that. I need a better way to get an income than this ridiculous, fraught system that doesn't accomadate people with my sort of issues. The benefits system either regards you as completely fit or completely unfit. People inbetween (which I suspect may well be the majority, mistakenly regarded by the state as lead swingers) are stuffed. When I first signed off (in part because of the stress of dealing with the JC - living in a rural community becomes a real hassle with thngs like transport when dealing with the JC) I asked for help at the same time because I didn't want to 'sponge' off the state, but there just isn't the support. But the reality is there are people with way more serious problems getting thrown off the sick by ATOS, I don't stand a cat in hell's chance. Even if, by some miracle, I did pass it'd be back to Working Links again! Out of the frying pan... I appreciate what's being said, and I understand it, but I have to do what's right for me.