That's interesting about a 'D' not necessarily equating to a default notice. Ok, so assuming I can confirm the last payment date, regardless of what the terms of the contract(s) were or when any default notices were issued after that, I can use 'Statute Barred' as the reasoning for them to stop pursuing it. Can this also be used as reasoning to get the defaults removed from my record now rather than have them showing until they expire according to the dates specified? Many, many thanks for the help

Morning all. I hope this is the right forum to raise this issue on and apologise if it isn't. I recently got a copy of my credit history and found that Carphone Warehouse have registered two defaults on it dating back to 2007. In 2006 I had a disagreement with them over a new mobile contract and charges which were applied to my account for WAP usage when I'd been assured at the time of signing in store that WAP would, as per the PAYG SIM I had been using up until that point, be free of charge. I contacted their head office whilst in store having been told by the staff there that there was nothing they could do, and was told that the charges stood. In short, I told them they could stick the contract and wrote to them within two weeks to state that I would no longer be servicing either of the contracts held with them but have never had an acknowledgement from them in respect of this. Although I am not entirely sure of the exact date that payments stopped, I know it was at some point in mid 2006. With that in mind, I have sent in a SAR to my bank to get copies of all statements on my accounts so I can pinpoint exactly when payments stopped. Looking at the payment history for these accounts on my credit file, this does not go back as far as 2006 - it starts in 2007 and shows payments being made on time followed by the countdown to the default but I most definitely did not make any payments at this time; as above, they stopped mid 2006. This is also something reflected by the amount of money that is owed according to my history - nearly £500 on one account and nearly £700 on another, when both contracts were 12 month ones for around £25 a month. I have read elsewhere that the date of default is defined by the first date on which a payment is missed rather than the countdown to default shown by way of payment history on your file - does this hold any water at all? My credit record is now all but clean bar these two debts. One default has been registered as December 2007 meaning it will, as things stand, stay on my record until December 2013? Having heard nothing in years, I have also recently had various letters and a flurry of phone calls from DCAs attempting to make contact over these debts, which suggests to me that maybe they are aware that the six year clock is ticking? (I've done nothing response wise other than answer the phone, refuse to confirm who I am, inform them that no-one of that name is connected with the phone number they have called and tell them not to call again... which to be fair, they have not done.) So... I would be really grateful if anyone could shed some light on what the true definition of what would constitute the legal default date given the circumstances above. If, as I suspect, it's from the date the first payment was missed, how do I go about forcing the DCAs and CW to update their records, and are there any consequences for the latter in respect of registering a payment history that is incorrect? Thank you in advance for any assistance and advice you can provide.

Ok... that is very good to know (in the circumstances) Many thanks for all your help

Cheers for the above. Ok... now what about if you paid under market value for it? I did - it has various dents and scratches, some interior damage, had a cracked windscreen and no MOT or tax when I bought it and has no service history. (Sounds like a real dream, eh) I've not sorted out the bodywork (doubt I will either, tbh), but I've fitted a new screen, got it through an MOT etc and will be spending more money on it soon on a cambelt service (not cheap, as I'm sure you can understand) and sorting out the damaged bits of interior. Yes, I can keep all the receipts but I'm still concerned that they will try to argue that I must have known when I bought it that something was amiss with it on the finance front because I got it under market value, which incidentally having now looked around at what similar cars are fetching on eBay etc, is much higher according to the likes of What Car, than what they're actually achieving on the open market in the real world.

iPhone. I've had two texts so far from 'MackHall' - this isn't a name I've given them, (the name I've given them isn't for use on a public forum!), this is what pops up on the phone when they come in. Just to make sure it's not me being more special than usual, I've gone to save them as a contact - where you would see a phone number usually, it says 'MackHall'. Be interesting to work out how they're doing it - must have some sort of call centre set up that allows them to broadcast a name rather than a number as their caller ID.

My first comment on here was lifted from the OFT link at the start of this thread... so it would appear they do.

Ok... I'm getting sick already of the constant texts and calls from my friends at Mackenzie Hall who have somehow obtained my mobile number, (which to be fair I could change but I'd rather not unless I have to), in the last few months. The bulk get binned by the phone the minute they hit it, but bless them, they have wangled some way of texting you from a name rather than a number and the blacklist app I've put on to deal with these unwelcome interventions for some reason can't bin those along with the rest of the pap they send me from conventional numbers (if anyone knows of a way to get these blocked, I'd be grateful - I'm not speaking to them on the phone / on the doorstep or whatever until such times as I can wave 'Statute Barred' in their face). Have been counting down the days until I can tell them it's most definitely not happening, as it were.

Ok... so why are the OFT suggesting that something classed as 'Statute Barred' is still recoverable then... because it isn't really, is it.

"The OFT accepts that in England, Wales and Northern Ireland, statute barred debt still exists and is therefore recoverable." I was under the impression once you pointed out to the DCA it was statute barred they went away - what's to stop them from continuing to pester you for the debt forever more if it's still recoverable? I ask this, as I'm on the cusp of being able to reel off 'statute barred' at some DCAs who, amongst other things, have somehow managed to get hold of my ex directory mobile number and have been making good use of it recently.

Ok... what I'm now trying to ascertain is if the finance company signed away their rights to the goods as part of the decision made by the courts in relation to the previous owner being subject to the damages order and the ROG order that applied to them being quashed at this time. This is what the previous owner has told me is the case but given I wasn't told by them about the finance in the first place when I bought the car and as much as they appear to being open and honest now, I'd rather make sure for myself this is the correct position before I put myself in a position where the finance company could work out where the car is and attempt to grab it again, much as I'm aware 'good title' applies. Can you see where I'm coming from? Cheers

In respect of the 50% - he's forwarding a copy of the paperwork to me so I can see for myself exactly what is occurring on that one. In respect of what the finance company are or aren't happy with, it appears they were slapped down by the judge in respect of the request to have both ROG and damage orders running concurrent and had to pick one or the other. In respect of them applying for an order against me, this won't be happening any time soon as I've taken steps to make sure my details are kept out of the frame until such times as I am confident of the exact position I will find myself in should I put my head above the parapit... hence my asking in here for some solid advice before I decide what to do that's best for me, so many thanks for the advice you've given so far and any more you can offer to help me with this.

Right... something else has now come to light. Apparently the ROGs were quashed by the court in the second case - the finance company were told they could either have those or have the damages order in place, but not both. So...where does that leave me - can they come after the car now that has been established and the debtors have confirmed they accept the money order and are looking to come to an agreement on clearing the balance. Also, despite what the paperwork I saw yesterday intimated, they're adamant they've cleared off more than 50% of the balance owing - the fact the finance company sought a ROG order in the first place rather than just snatching the car back suggests that would be the case, no?

Here is another angle... Say I decide to just use the bloody thing and take my chances? I take it given I have the documents and a receipt that proves I bought it in good faith (previous registered keeper signed a receipt at the time of sale to me that said the car was theirs to sell and free of finance (!) ), that should a recovery agent call, I can tell them to sod off? If this is the case, would the finance company then have cause to issue a ROG against me, and if so, would I then become at risk of being sued for the full outstanding amount due on the agreement... or would it be more the case that I could scream 'good title' at them? I don't even really like the car but as I have said, I have sunk a fair amount of money into it and I don't think it would be the honourable thing to do to sell it on to someone else with all this hanging over it - with that in mind, I'd rather get some decent advice and get it sorted out so everyone is as happy as you could hope.

It looks to me like the ROG stands and the finance company, having seen that the owner was not in any mood to give it up the goods any time soon have then gone back to court to try another angle to make sure they get their pound of flesh by way of the subsequent CCJ. All the paperwork from the court shows is the sums due to the finance company and that judgement was found in their favour - no mention of other orders etc. It's also telling I feel that the solicitor made a point of setting out clearly that their client wanted the ROG to still stand if they got judgement in this subsequent case. Whatever, as far as I'm concerned they can sort that side of it out amongst themselves, I'm more interested in making sure I don't end up out of pocket / without the car I bought in good faith. Previous owner is obviously on skid row and not in a position to return the money I paid for the car to me... and to be honest, I feel quite sorry for them so was hoping that I'd be able to help them make the best of a bad lot.

ROG was issued first. Attempts were then made to seize the vehicle and these were thwarted by the previous owner. Finance company then went back to court, this time to go for the damages side by way of a 'Money Order', as I understand it - a CCJ, in other words and as per what I previously outlined. The sums requested were for what the vehicle was worth if in good order and sold off a forecourt at the time action was instigated against the debtors, plus the finance companies costs to date. It appears the owner has then got it into his head if he accepts the money order and makes an offer of payment, he can just keep paying that off (or go bankrupt), and the car can then be sold on - this is where it's then been sold on to someone (me), who wasn't made aware of all the problems attached to the vehicle - they have only come to light since. So anyway... to summarise, the court went in favour of the finance company and sent the owner through the forms to do whatever in light of the judgement which he then returned with proposals on clearing the debt.

The money order / CCJ is for less than the sum outstanding on the loan agreement - not quite sure what the reasoning for that is as it appears to be quite complex. The paperwork presented to the court by the solicitors for the finance company specifically states they want the ROG to still stand along side this money order and that if the vehicle is ever recovered, the proceeds from the sale would be shaved off the damages awarded in the second case, if it isn't, they'd just pursue them for the full amount asked for in the damages case. Whatever, this is nothing to do with me other than I inadvertently now have a reasonable sum of money tied up in something I'm quite concerned could be taken off me despite me buying it in good faith.

Having tracked down the previous owner I've deduced the following: It was bought on a HP agreement A ROG was granted at some point in the past The seller resisted attempts at retrieval of the car by third parties not represented by the court after this was granted Apparently the recovery agents attempted to register it as a stolen vehicle with the police but they weren't interested - however, I am not keen to ask them myself if this is the case for obvious reasons. The seller is adamant that no marker is registered against it by the police, despite the solicitors for the finance company stating this was the case. The finance company has been back to court to sue for damages and it stipulated in the notes presented to the court that they wanted the ROG to stand alongside any such order granted, with them then within their rights to still snatch the car and knock the pittance they get for it off the damages - the seller was under the impression if they accepted the damages order and made an offer to pay this that they'd then be able to dispose of the car, hence why I've ended up with it! So... what do I do - I've spent a fair chunk of money buying this thing and it's my sole method of transport and cannot afford to replace it if it is snatched back. I bought it in good faith, in a poor condition and unaware of all of the above, and I have spent money on it since to get it up to a roadworthy standard since I have owned it. I'd approach the finance company to see if we could reach an agreement but having now seen exactly how much they've managed to tot up and taken the previous owner to court for, I know there is no way they'd accept the pittance I could offer them. I still need to use it, although it's now been left in the care of someone else who has lent me an old heap to drive around in whilst I try to sort this out - not ideal though.

Hi all. I have recently bought a vehicle which I had no reason to believe had any finance outstanding on it etc - should have HPI'ed it, but there you go. Turns out it has and is of very much interest to the finance company concerned. Anyway, this has ended up a bit complex and I have a few points I could do with a bit of help clarifying before I decide what to do for the best. In short, having now been in touch with the person I bought it off, as I understand it the finance company went to the county court and got a CCJ issued against both the previous registered keeper and their partner for the full amount outstanding. They have assured me that they attended court, (I have seen the summons etc), and the deal worked out was that they would agree to pay the amount agreed in court and the finance company would declare they had no further interest in the vehicle to enable them to dispose of it and use the money to put towards paying the debt. The loan was taken out in 2007 - not sure when the default initially was, but it sounds like it was fairly early on in the agreements life. Anyway... what can I do - I didn't know the car had outstanding finance on it when I bought and so I'm fairly certain 'good title' applies. I got the car for below current market value, (so this may be something questioned in relation to 'good title'), but at the time it had no MOT, needed bodywork and a windscreen, plus had damage to the interior etc. I want to keep the car, ultimately. Ideally, I'd also like to help the previous owners get themselves out of this mess as best they can as they've obviously not got a pot to pee in and I've no reason to believe they've lied to me about what was agreed in court. Thanks in advance for any advice. Oh, and one last, slightly iffy, question... suppose someone exported a car with finance still owing on it - is this something that would be picked up on if they then went to re-register it in the destination country?

Hi everyone. I apologise now for this post but I have a lot of questions I need to ask and could really do with some solid advice on, as it would appear at present my luck is running out with regards to some old debts. Background: I have a number of old debts which, for one reason or another, I have refused to pay to date and which I am holding out for the six year rule to kick in. Most of these debts were accrued in 2005 to 2006, and no contact / payments have been made since the later part of the latter to my knowledge. First Issue / Question: Determining Time Lapsed Since Last Contact / Payment Made On A Debt Is there anyway I can find out my debt history in terms of what's actually on my record and what the last date of contact / payment was, without having to register with rubbish like Credit Expert etc? Aside from being quite disturbed by how easy it was to register for this, (I registered online), and then consequently how difficult it was to leave, (I tried to do this by way of the net and was made to phone them, at which point I found myself being grilled???), I believe every time you do a search on yourself it's registered and creditors can see you've been active on the account? Second Issue / Question: Unsolicited Text Messages Quite out of the blue I have had two texts from the shysters at Mackenzie Hall today regarding two separate debts. No coincidence I'm sure, they must have somehow got hold of my personal mobile number and chucked it on their system today, but whatever, up until now they've been doing nothing other than writing letters to me, none of which I've opened and some of which got sent back with 'not known at this address' scrawled across them a couple of years ago. Anyway... does anyone know how they've got hold of my number, is there any way to force them to remove it from their records and, more crucially, is there any way to do this without actually having to contact them and admitting you are who they think you are, as in can I register contact from them as nuisance calls / harrassment etc? Worst case scenario I'll change my number but I'd rather not have to, not least because I'm not confident they'll not end up tracing it again. Third Issue / Question: Likely Escalation Path Of Debt Collectors The time lapsed since any contact / payment was made on any of these debts must be coming up for five years now, maybe more, maybe less. With that in mind, I fully expect this to be the reason why as well as having had the texts above today, we've also had a debt collector put a note through the door regarding a larger debt currently owned by Aktiv Kapital. This debt is for several thousand pounds, so I'm therefore expecting this one to be pursued a bit more vigorously than the others which are a few hundred pounds each. So... is it likely that Aktiv Kapital will go all the way and push this through the County Court in due course, or are they more likely to keep writing to us / sending people round, (on commission only I presume, to keep them keen), in the hope we'll fold and acknowledge the debt? The same question goes for the smaller debts. Also, can anyone please advise on what the likely tactics are they may try next other than court action and maintaining the pressure as they have been to date with a constant flow of letters and now I'm sure, texts / calls / doorstep visits. Finally, if a vehicle is parked outside my property, is it likely that debt collectors will go off to DVLA to find out who the registered keeper is as a way of trying to pin down if I reside here or not? Fourth Issue / Question: Negotiating A Settlement Figure Let us suppose a relative decides they want to help and offer to loan me the money to clear some of our debts... and there's not enough in the pot to clear the full outstanding balance of the debts concerned. I'm aware you can normally negotiate a settlement figure with these scumbags as a percentage of what the outstanding debt is. Now am I right in thinking the likes of Cabot and Aktiv Kapital only pay between 10 to 20% of the outstanding debt to the original creditor in order to buy it off them? If this is the case, has anyone ever managed to beat them down to 33% or less as a full and final settlement of an outstanding debt? If no, what's generally the minimum percentage they'll take and has anyone got any tips on how best to beat them down on this? I'm asking this as I'm looking to minimise the damage as much as possible in relation to how much we ultimately end up paying these sharks, if anything, not least because we are on a low income with no real hope of increasing this any time soon due to illness, and like many out there at present are finding it increasingly difficult to cover our bills as it is. Finally, is what I'm now witnessing 'business as usual' for the likes of Cabot / Mackenzie Hall, or is there currently a trend building in these difficult times where they're searching that bit harder than before to nail down creditors? Many, many thanks for any advice received.

It's not reached court yet, but I'm about to hit Nationwide with what should be the last letter before it goes that way. My last letter gave them a 14 day notice on court action, with me stating they'd get no further notice should I decide to pursue the matter by way of the courts from here on. I just wanted to make sure I had my facts straight on this aspect before putting in for any charges accrued since I initiated the case. Thank you for the advice

Hi I'm currently locked into a battle with Nationwide over bank charges I believe should be refunded to me. I first initiated a claim against the bank in March 2009, at which point I totted up all the charges for the six years prior to then and informed the bank this was the amount I wished to claim. Since then, they have wriggled out of being pinned down and the case is ongoing. Because the case hasn't been officially shut to date, I believe all the charges I originally requested a refund of are still relevant to the claim. My question therefore is, are charges accrued since March 2009 something I can add onto the total I want back from them? Many thanks in advance for any advice.

Okey dokey. I have just sent them an email stating (amongst other things), that I acknowledge the original totals due, as in £1642.50 including interest, and as a gesture of goodwill I am willing to round the final total due up to £1800, subject to us reaching an agreement. I have also outlined my proposals for repayment and I have gone to great lengths to avoid mentioning the actual legal state of play as things stand, as I believe at this stage mentioning such things will only serve to inflame the person concerned and I'd rather we, (as expressed in the email concerned), reach a mutual agreement without things deteriating any more than they already have. However... if the gloves end up off, yes... I shall use all of the above and tell them what to do for the whole amount. Cheers!

Regardless of the fact I have a valid claim to hardship at the present time, it doesn't reflect the hardship I endured at the time some of the charges were applied to the accounts concerned, nor the stress I endured in relation to the way NW refused to listen to me at times when I was not well enough to deal with my finances. Given the standardised reply I received from the bank in reply to my last letter, as in one whereby they've only acknowledged the hardship element of the case, I am concerned that NW will aim to wriggle out of the claim purely on the basis of hardship, and continue to dismiss what I feel are the more compelling aspects of the case, as in my circumstances at the time in terms of health etc, and the banks attitude towards that and the actions they then took in relation to my accounts. With this in mind, I'm not looking to abandon the hardship element of the case, I'm more looking to ensure the other elements of it are not overlooked and would like to know if the other elements are something I can push for them to focus on... and I can confirm I'll happily push the hardship element as well should it prove necessary to do so. In answer to some of your questions: Yes, both accounts are still open and active. I stated I reserved the right to launch an action in the county court after 14 days without further notice if they failed to comply with my request for a refund of charges, about 14 days ago - note, I used the term 'reserve the right' rather than stating this would definitely be happening. My last contact with the bank was by letter... 14 days ago or thereabouts, and I received their reply about 7 days ago. In relation to the charges, they relate to the period March 2003 to March 2009, which is when I first wrote to the bank and asked them to refund them. The reason I am still pursuing the charges for this set period is because the bank have effectively not closed the case at any point, meaning that we're still effectively bickering in relation to my original request for a refund of charges. The charges all relate to bounced direct debit charges which in turn then led to me ending up in an unauthorised overdraft with more charges incurred by way of this - in other words, the bank has not be deprived of any funds, every penny that built up and which I'm asking for, was generated by way of charges they applied to the account. Many thanks for any light you can shed.

Excellent. I've been stressing myself out over this for the last week or so... Ahhh... that's better. Many thanks once again for the advice.

Any advice would be gratefully received - I need to respond to the bank asap and want to make sure I keep control of the situation from a position of relative knowledge rather than one akin to 'stabbing blindly into the dark and hoping'.