Hi Guys, Can anyone please post up all relevant sections of the Unfair Contract Terms Act (1977) in relation to business claims. A friend of mine has had a letter from Barclays Bank plc singing the tune of the fact that the penalty at common law argument is likely to no longer be applicable. In addition Barclays is confident that the same approcah will be taken to the historic terms and conditions. They may turn out to be right or wrong, however in the mean time we need everything we can get our hands on in the Unfair Contract Terms Act (1977) to support the legal avenue for business claims. Any help appreciated. TheyrCriminals

Hi Jill, It's impossible for me to know what your paying money to the bank for. If you have all the statements/paperwork which shows all the activity on both your accounts (personal account and loan account) then thats your starting point with all this. If you don't have them to hand however it is not a problem. You can write to the bank making a data subject access request under the Data Protection Act 1998 requesting your statements for the last 6 years. As both your accounts are with the same financial institution you can request for both accounts and pay only one charge of £10. The bank is legally allowed to charge this under the Act. They will then have 40 days to supply you with the information. Once you have all your statements go through them extracting all of the penalty charges. Add them up and work out your statutory interest entitlement (and any debit interest you may think your entitled to). Then write to the bank requesting it refunds the money. As I know you are claiming on at least one business account you may get an offer. If not don't be disheartened. You can then put in a court claim and await the result of the OFT test case which we are all waiting extemely patiently for! Hope this helps (if it does please click my scales at the bottom left). TheyrCriminals

Hi Jill, When did you close your business bank account with HSBC? And are you still paying this off as a debt? Also when did you take the 10k loan out? TheyrCriminals

Hi Jill, It would be helpful if you could clarify some of the figures you mentioned and what they relate to exactly. Firstly you should note that most people are simply reclaiming for the last 6 years because the Statute of Limitations applies which means legally you can only go back for the last 6 years. However some are reclaiming back further than the 6 years and some have been successful. Secondly you say you have incurred 4k in interest alone, can you explain where the 4k of interest has come from? Thirdly yes you can reclaim charges (late or missed payment charges) on a loan account. Lastly can you tell us the capacity in which you were trading, i.e limited company, partnership or sole trader. TheyrCriminals

Hi Guys, Thanks Photoman and Zootscoot. I had heard so many things about the 'concealment' issue but finally I'm beginning to understand it more. More research for me to do!! Thanks Again, TheyrCriminals

Hi Guys, Off topic but could anyone please tell me if Payment Protection Insurance is subject to the Statute of Limitations (1982), i.e can we only go back 6 years for reclaiming PPI? Thanks. TheyrCriminals

Hi Parkvale, Thank you for that. TheyrCriminals

Hi Guys, I read (from a link on CAG) that the test case judgement has been delayed by three months. However I can not find any official authority on this, can someone please tell me who has said there is a three month delay. Thanks. TheyrCriminals

LOL @Photoman, I was shocked reading it, now at 2.25am on PM's post. That made me laugh though imagine that, you never know stranger things have happened. It sort of begs the question really I wonder if the owner/s of CAG would be prepared to accept a price from the banks!! Anyway regarding my PoC for a business account in relation to a company now dissolved, thank you very much for the above posts they have given me more than enough to consider and I am very grateful to you guys. As soon as I have pieced together something I will post it up for analysis. TheyrCriminals

Hi Andrew, So far I have found two of Photoman's Poc's for business accounts, and whilst they look good, they do not appear too relevant to claiming on company that is now dissolved. So I'm still struggling really. TheyrCriminals

Hi Again Goldlady, Thank you very much for that. Any ideas for a suggested PoC? TheyrCriminals

Hi Goldlady, Yes there are other ongoing creditors because the business is still trading it's just that they are no longer a company, instead they are a partnership now. TheyrCriminals

Hi Sarah, Thank you very much for the above post, it is very helpful. I guess I will get researching and give it my best shot! Thanks again. TheyrCriminals

Hi Andrew, Thanks for the reply. The company was not liquidated it was dissolved. I phoned a solicitor in the Yellow Pages a while back, in all fairness he was pretty good he spent at least half an hour on the phone to me giving me free legal advice. I know it is more difficult and I know how the account was funded is paramount to any claim. I would be gratfeul if you could post up something from your PoC and I coul dmaybe delete and/or amend any details that are not relevant to mine. Thank you. TheyrCriminals

Any thoughts anyone? TheyrCriminals

Hi Medusa, I sent the Bailiffs a letter citing Miah v Westminster (2005) and stating that any requests for payment at this stage would be treated as an unlawful demand for money. Having read the case, thanks to you, I see that the PCN was rescinded as the Local Authority new full well they should not have invoked enforcement proceedings if the appeals process had not been exhausted, and the Claimant WAS pursuing the appeal avenue. I'm just wondering if now perhaps I fall into the same category. I sent Torbay Council my Letter Before Claim in accordance with the Pre-Action Protocal for Judicial Review but as explained previously Torbay Council did not respond and instead I received a letter from the Bailiffs asking for payment. What's the chances that I can get the ticket rescinded? Do you think my scenario is the same as in the case of Miah v Westminster (2005)? Any advice appreciated. TheyrCriminals

Hi Guys, I saw somewhere on here that business account claims for a limited company are difficult to claim from if the company is now dissolved. However if a lot of personal finance had been credited to the account then there might be an avenue for recovery. My sister's husband wants to know if someone has posted, or if not could post up, a Particulars of Claim for this situation. Thank you. TheyrCriminals

Hello Everyone, There is clearly a lot of confusion regarding business accounts and stays being imposed and lifted. It appears the policy of HBOS plc is to make offers on business accounts. It appears that Royal Bank of Scotland Group plc (the second biggest bank in the UK and owner of NatWest) are not just making offers but going a step further and expressly stating the current OFT test case does not relate to business accounts. As we know in most cases it seems now that stays are not getting lifted by citing the 'business account' reason. The Financial Services Authority has explicitly stated in its Waiver Review Report that small businesses are not covered by the waiver. Yet the courts continue to stay claims involving business accounts and appear to justify this, which they are, in actual fact, probably doing correctly. In the agreement between the banks which I have now read (and should have read a long time ago), the penalty at common law issue is raised by the banks. The banks, as part of their counterclaim, want a ruling on this too. Therefore it does appear that the penalties issue will be decided, despite not being detailed in the OFT Particulars of Claim. Therefore business accounts ARE part of the test case, and if their is a pending case in the system that will decide business accounts too Judges will stay these claims. However there still seems to be some reconciliation needed with the FSA Waiver Review Report and the courts. This is still slightly confusing, but explainable. On the one hand the FSA are saying dont suspend complaints that are small business claims as they are not covered by the waiver. The courts however seem to be more independent of this and it appears that the Waiver Review is not binding on them, but more importantly with business accounts effectively part of the test case the courts see every reason to continue the stay on business claims. This now, in my mind, does seem logical. If business accounts are to be decided in the test case, which I do not doubt any longer, the FSA stating that business accounts are not covered by the waiver means very little in court when a precedent may only be around the corner. The Waiver Review I think would be more helpful if you are pursuing a complaint throught the FOS. But if your thinking of pursuing the legal avenue don't be surprised if the judge considers the Waiver Review Report nothing more than a waste of his/her time, and in all honesty I don't think we can actually blame him/her. This is just obviously my view on the matter, but having gone through the whole process myself and indulged in a plethora of reading I think it may advance the issue further. Any thoughts welcome. TheyrCriminals

Hi hsbcfiddled, Thank you for that. TheyrCriminals

Anyone, Where can we get a copy of the agreement between the OFT, FSA and the banks? Thanks. TheyrCriminals

Well said empowered. If anyone ever knew what he was talking about can they contact him urgently...with a translation. The best of British to you Josh! Please think before posting! TheyrCriminals

Hi Zoot, If the banks are counterclaiming what is it they want from the OFT? Thanks TheyrCriminals

Josh, Are you drunk? TheyrCriminals

Josh, I haven't understood what you have been talking about from the word go! Of course I have been pursuing my claim in the civil courts, namely the County Court! I haven't commenced action in the Magistrates court and asked for a commital to the Crown Court in the hope of a successful prosecution and get Mr. Lloyds TSB Bank plc CEO into jail (although the thought is probably quite justified)! But Josh your advice has been totally confusing and I really don't know what you are talking about. Zootscoot are you there? TheyrCriminals

Hello Again Zootscoot, In addition to my question to you, did you mean to say counterclaim? Are the banks counterclaiming? Or did you mean defence? TheyrCriminals