As I expected my bank (Smlie) has decided it is not fraud and instead it is a dispute. They have told me to contact magic/Enhance and ask for a refund getting the name of the person and transcribe the phonecall (or details of etc). then if no result to contact them again. Peeving me that they can take this money months after I had said I didn't want to go ahead with it (If indeed they are the ones I gave my details to which I don't think they are)

I noticed on my statement today that yesterdya a payment of £67.74 and a visa charge of £2.00 went out yesterday to Enhance Financial. Never heard of them so I did a search and looks like an loan broker charge. Now this is confusing. In June I was looking for a loan and the only one I was on the phone for any length of time was Yes loans. When at the end of the call they spoke about the charge I told them I was not going to pay any money before I had in front of me confirmation of a loan acceptance and the T&Cs/APR. Basically I told them I didn't want a loan at that point. So I borrowed some money off my Mum instead. I DID NOT TAKE OUT NOR FOLLOW UP ON A LOAN Now 4 months later this charge appears. From reading others experiences mine is a little different because theirs are taken out within days of the phone call however mine is 4 months later. I have notified my Bank of it however I am concerned it may be a case where the bank sees it as me not understanding rather than an act of fraud. What do you guys think? Andy

From what I gather you have 2 years to file the claim. This was filed well in time but is still in process as bmi are playing hardball. If it were a 2 years and then too late bmi would just have stayed silent and waited for 2 years and then replied sorry too late When I sent many letters they refunded my replacement flight but refused anything else. I then passed it to EUClaim who within a couple of months managed to get the EU comp for my wife being denied boarding. They have been pursuing the case and detailing progress in a 'client case' portal on their site. I can see the correspondence back and forth etc. The case went into the court in the Netherlands as this is a european flight and they referred it to the Portuguese authorities as that is where the problem occurred. Will see what happens in the next couple of months AC

Well they have finally come back to me after I sent them a very long e-mail. They are performing a miracle by recalling the free gift that was a few days ago impossible to do!!! AC

I'll try that then. Andy

2 things then. Outsourcing. I know a little about this because I used to run one of the larger handling houses in the drinks industry. That was all promotional gear once orders were placed. We were always getting through details of cancellations though from the companies who's account we had and no problem even if they were 1 week leadtimes. We cancelled them. Wish I still had that job because then I could afford the one off payment. lol The other part is how would we stand on 'intent to pay' could we cancel the DD and then show intent to pay to protect ourselves then negotiate paymenti.e. £23 a month for 4 months? AC

Don't get me wrong. I agree with you entirely r.e. the payment. what I am arguing is their response that they have already processed the order and we will have to return the item when we receive it. They have plenty of time to cancel the depatch and therefore save themselves trouble and save us returning an items. In the old days of peperwork it may take time to find the relevant order but in these days of computers a simple search, and cancellation is all that is required. We aren't arguing over the payment aspect, thats fair enough, our fault, Its just the stance of the publisher that it is 'too late' to cancel. Yes we made a mistake but immediately upon noticing the mistake and within an hour or so of it we asked them to cancel. There is no way that it is too late to cancel any order. They won't be despatching until they get their money so they have 3 weeks until the transaction is complete. AC

I agree with your statement that I have made the association with 'stepped payment' but describing it as they have many others have made the same 'association!!! Also as the second poster says this same magazine used to take the payments quarterly. And as people on forums talk to each other and there is nothing to say they have chaged their payment frequency would it not be natural to assume it was still quarterly or stepped? It seems to me they understand this too as they have altered the wording. I have their reply from the initial complaint which starts The offer did state it would be a 24 month Direct debit so they have already alter the '24 month' to read '2 year' in the screen capture above!!! As for the pre wrapped statement I agree entirely however the purchase was made at 4-58pm. Once finding out it was a single payment the request for cancellation was sent at 5-39pm. less than an hour later. They are trying to tell me that they cannot reverse this order within that timeframe? They must be the most efficient company ever at processing orders. And I doubt anything will be despatched until they take the DD which is planned to be 18/10/10. thats 3 weeks away. therefore I assume they will take payment and then despatch. Also in their confirmation e-mail it suggest it will not auto cancel it says DIRECT DEBIT DETAILS: We will take your first direct debit payment on 18/10/2010 and then every 24 months thereafter This info was not detailed anywhere through the process of setting up the subscription. Not trying to criticise your post at all. I just want to find out where we actually stand. Seems to me their stance is hard luck just pay up and shut up when they could quite easily reverse and cancel the transaction which is not scheduled for nearly 3 weeks time!!! AC

There is a screenshot here, although looks like they have 'reworded' it to say 2 year now!!!: This is the first mention of the actual price and 'method' of payment. From this point on until confirmation thre is no variation from this 'description' always '24 month direct debit' It is only when you get the e-mail confirmation that you are told it will be a one off payment and then 24 months later the next payment will be taken for the next 2 years etc. I know UK law was tightened up a few years ago to catch 'fine print/small print' issues and wonder if that change would cover this. They aren't misleading us in what we will get or the price, nor are we having to pay for something we didn't know about in small print. It is just a question of thinking it was installments only to find out the kids will have to starve this month. lol I hope the DD appears on my banks account before they try and take it!!! AC

I saw a magazine subscription offer on the internet where it was giving away a free fish tank if you subscribed for 2 years to the magazine. I thought this was quite a good deal so I decided to have a look at how much it was. Advertised as £93 via 24month direct debit. This to me implied that the direct debit runs for 24 months. increments. Not necessarily monthly but the total period of direct debits would be 24 months. I could afford £4 weekly or £12 a quarter so I went further with this. On each page I looked for detail of the frequency and amount of the direct debits which never appeared in the page even in 'small print'. then I had completed it. Still no idea of how much or the frequency. Upon opening my e-mail and reading the confirmation it then tells me it will be a single direct debit payment taken this month. Now I can't afford that so instantly I e-mailed them back saying I wish to cancel. This was within half an hour of confirming the subscription. They have replied back saying too late the orders have been processed. (within a day for a subscription that doesn't start for another 3 weeks?) and that I would have to cancel payment with my bank and then return the free gift/magazines at my own expense. There are many of us in a thread on an aquatics forum that did this yesterday all about the same time, all assuming it would be increments and all wishing to cancel once we found out it was a single payment. We all see this as the magazine company's fault with misleading wording and also we do not understand why when these tanks/magazines have not yet been despatched they cannot just cancel the subscription and associated order. Our cancellation requests were about as instant as they could be. Is their terminology misleading? 24 month Direct debit? It isn't a 24 month direct debit. It is a single direct debit. It is the subscription that is 24 months. Where do we stand on this. Should they not have clearly detailed this prior to the final confirmation page? I know on all other sites pre confirmation there would be a page detailing frequency and amount asking if you wish to continue. I have replied to their reply saying I am quite happy to pay and quite happy to keep the subscription+tank but not by paying a single one off payment, asking them to make good their error in wording their site as they have and letting all of us (there are a few affected, some have said 'oh well') pay by installments. Any ideas guys? AC

Haven't updated this so I will do so now. AFter the initial refund of some of the 'costs' incurred (replacement flights, coach from lisbon to Faro etc) we ended up handing this case over to EU claim a no win no fee jobby. they take 27% of the winnings. A few months later bmi partly gave in and issued one lot of compensation insisting my wife was the only one denied boarding and therefore myself and the 2 babies were not eligible for compensations. Therefore suggesting that i should have left my wife behind and taken the 2 children back to the UK where we would be stuck in Birmingham as I don't drive. The wife drives and is her car at Birmingham Car Park. Since then EU Claim have now passed this onto the courts as bmi wouldn't accept the moral stance here. and therefore I have been advised it could be up to 6 months to be sorted. Originally it went throught to the dutch courts where EUClaim are based and it was then passed onto the Portuguese authorities. This 6 month period will end approx Jaunary so should be able to detail more then. It is 2 years since this all started now. lol. But hey ho. patience and all that AC

Their agents were in fact just the usual ANA airport staff. They didn't offer us anything because bmi just use the portuguese people. The ANA check in girl rang her superiors and then said we would need to contact bmi and gave us their number however this being the usual 'you are in a queue' line it took 20 euros before we had to give in as check in was closing and we had to get our bags back!!! bmi's letter says to me (word for word) I can confirm that due to a system error Mrs ****'s name was not showing on the check in agent's manifest Therefore they seem to be admitting liability however later they say I note your request for further compensation, however bmibaby cannot be held liable for consequential losses such as loss of earnings, arising from this event As of now they have refunded the replacement return tickets and the coach fares to the different airport but are refusing to pay any form of compensation or other costs we have no receipt for like taxis etc. What is an N1? AC

bump

If sending letters registered etc then the post office write the postcode on the receipts. These count as expenses due to Argos' error IMO. I am certainly claiming these costs from my claim against bmi!!! IME any costs incurred that are backed up by receipts are very easy to claim back. Theoretical things like hardship etc are harder to get. In my case and I assume in Mr Sharpmans Argos never sent me a notification they had passed the debt onto a DCA and Argos tell me that they have sold the debt to Moorcroft whereas Moorcroft say they are just handling the debt on Argos' behalf so I don't know who's debt it is. lol. Neither will send me a letter of assignment because they both say it is the other party that owns the debt!!! AC

Moorcroft 'acting on behalf' of Argos/Home Retail Group They kept ringing me after Argos defaulted me for not paying an agreed arrangement when in fact I had been paying by standing order and HRG telephone advisor had given me the wrong account number to pay to. Every day for a month Moorcroft rang me and asked for security data to which I replied What is it in connection with. their reply was we cannot disclose that information without first taking security data to prove I was the person they wanted to speak to at which point I always replied. I will not give you my data until you can tell me what it is regarding. Send me a letter. I never got a letter and I dealt directly with Argos r.e. informing them the dates of the payments. Then in Decmeber I got the 'notice of intended litigation' letter from Moorcroft so I rang Argos who said they could not deal with me as the account was not theirs it was now moorcrofts. So now having confirmation of who Moorcroft were I rang them and they say the account is not theirs it is Argos' and they are dealing with the debt on behalf of Argos. I am not debating with them wether the debt is owed or not as I am quite happy to pay what I owe and paid them £50. Can I get the debt transferred back to Argos and get the incorrectly applied default removed? I would rather deal with them than a DCA. AC

I'm watching your thread closely as I have an Argos/moorcroft issue in that when I got into trouble I contacted Argos and setup a standing order. Over the phone they gave me the incorrect account number and therefore I got the moorcroft calls where I refused to give my personal data to someone whom I didn't recognise. Argos have defaulted me for not paying and I have supplied them with bank statements showing the payments. I got the intended litigation letter but I am quite happy to pay what I owe. Would rather pay it to Argos than moorcroft though and of course I want the default removed as I didn't default. lol Hope you have success here and I shall follow the thread with interest. AC

A further advance on this today. Bmi have sent me a letter with a further cheque for £85.50. They say the total payment is for the replacement flight plus buses to Faro airport. They go on to say that they cannot be held liable for loss of earnings or other costs incurred as a consequence of the error made!!! I can produce evidence of the extra parking and phone calls made on my wife's debit card which I will send to them again to claim these. They make no mention of any compensation regarding this and seem very careful not to use the word in their letter. Is there anyone who can help me on this? AC

Well it's been 10 days now since bmi paid the money into my wife's account and they haven't sent me any letter of explanation as to what this payment is for or trying to tell me that they aren't going to pay the full amount. Should I write to them accepting the payment as an interim payment and push them for an explanation and the rest of the amount claimed? AC

A little update. I sent a letter by registered post (cost £4.25)to bmibaby on 2/12/08 detailing what had happened and a summary of costs and asked them to acknowledge receipt within 28 days. The costs detailed were: Taxi back from Lisbon airport to family residence £9.52 2 days extra parking @ Birmingham Airport £20.00 Phone calls to BMIs constant queue hotline £15.87 Exchange rate charges for these debit card phone calls £2.01 Telephone calls to bmi from landline in Portugal £47.62 Telephone calls to British embassy from landline in Portugal £6.35 Telephone calls to travel insurance from landline in Portugal £4.76 Telephone calls to my parents from landline in Portugal £7.94 Replacement flight from Faro £338.46 Taxi to Lisbon bus station £6.35 Coach from Lisbon to Faro £28.57 Taxi from Faro town to Faro airport £7.94 3½ days loss of earnings for me (not inc possible O/T) £173.25 1 days loss of earnings for wife (not in possible O/T) £35.00 This totals £703.64 I put in the letter that I would leave it to their discretion how much compensation they would pay for hardship relating to this saga They have not replied within 28 days however they have refunded £281.33 directly to my wife's debit card which is where we initially paid for the flight. What do I do now? This doesn't even cover the replacement flight which my mother paid for. Should I wait a few days more to see if they send a letter explaining this payment? should I write back to them and not accept this payment as compensation? Is that the end of the road and I have to put up with it? I have instructed my wife not to touch this money as firstly we have to pay my mother back and secondly if I refuse to acept it they may want it back before proceeding further. Any advice? Regards SC

We did book online and the confirmation email and the printout from their website has the correct name. Hence this is why we had no problems going out to Portugal. So all our paperwork is correct but the system at the airport had the incorrect name on it. AC

Hello I did started another thread but as the title was I am stuck in Lisbon it is now a little misleading. The basic story was that when we got to the airport we went to check in and the airports computer had a different forename than my wife's ticket and obviously it was different to her passport. They refused boarding and we tried to ring bmi for 20 minutes only to hear the "you are in a queue message". Needless to say We didnt leave my wife in Portugal. My 2 and 3 year old sons and I stayed as well. After contacting bmi the next day they basically said buying a new flight and then claiming back the money was the only option. I want to claim the replacement ticket costs, transport that we had to use for the wasted journey and to go to a different city for another flight, loss of wages, phone calls made on our father in laws phone to their premium rate number and hardship compensation. We are also now overdrawn when we were in credit so not only are we missing out on interest from our bank, we are now paying interest on the overdraft which I want to claim too. Can anyone help me r.r what I should claim for, how to do it and how I should word it as all there is on the BMI website is an address and no other info. Thanks in advance AC

First bit of good news is that we are now back at home in Lincoln after leaving Lisbon via coach at 1am on Thursday Morning we arrived at Faro after a change of coach and got to the airport via taxi from whence we waited 4 hours for the cheapest flight we were able to find and got back to the UK at 12-40pm on Thursday. arrived back in Lincoln at4-30pm after waiting for bags, clearing the extra days on the car etc. So now I am ready to start getting my claim together. I want to get it right so I shall take my time on it. I have receipts/tickets for everything except taxis. Another good thing is AUC have replied. I will need to send them any correspondence that I make with BMI. Hope this goes well and will be grateful for any help you can all provide. Andy

How do they determine grounds of hardship. I wonder if I would qualify as I have 4 loans/credit debts that I have negotiated lower payments on that I can only just cover but over the past year due to me losing my job (not my fault but unproveable) I encountered many many "commission" charges when the DWP didnt pay up the JSA on time without notifying me and this left me having DDs refused and "commissions" applied. This was over a 14 week period until I found another job. I did write a letter of complaint to the DWP (and cc my MP who sends me gleeful letters of replies shes received weeks after Ive forced the issues to get the replies) regarding their non notification of these dates and requesting compensation for charges incurred due to this plus constant telephone calls etc to the JSA to find out why I hadnt been paid but they have as yet not replied even though the letter was sent on 05/03/08!!! We are still paying all our money out on these agreed negotiated payments therefore not a lot of cash spare. I think I shall look through the correct section to see if I can get any further with the DWP one without bothering with our useless MP. Andy

Just read through the whole of this thread. What was the outcome. Did you get help? Did you respond to the judge? Andy

I have had loads of problems with Smile. I initially became a smile customer in 2000 enticed by the high interest on the current account. I changed all my bills and pay to go into this account. First thing I did was send them a message saying " I dont want a £500 overdraft, can you remove this facility please and make the account so that it will not go past £0" Their reply was "sorry sir. £500 is the minimum overdraft on this account and we are unable to put a limit that stops you accessing the money" Contradiction 1 - £500 is the minimum??? The fact is that recently they said that they wanted to reduce the overdraft from £760 (I had used it due to unemployment) to £280 1 month from the date of the secure message they sent me, to which I replied that this would bankrupt me. Fortunately the next day I had a back payment from tax credits of £1100. I sent them a secure message "Can you reduce the balance to £0, I no longer need it" to which they replied " Yes of course we can". They didnt though they reduced it to £280 as they had suggested. This is still contrary to their initial statement that forced me to have a £500 overdraft. Contradiction 2 - We are unable to put a limit that stops you accessing money When I am at the overdraft limit, I go to an ATM and guess what. "You have insufficient funds for this transaction." So they can stop me from accessing my money? Why could they not put my limit to £0 and stop me taking money out past this. They obviously can do it for an overdraft limit so why not for a zero balance. The next problem I have with them is their stupid arguments about cancelling direct debits due to insufficient funds. If I have a direct debit going out and am being paid the same day, then they both show up at the stroke of 2am on the said day. If the balance before 2am was insufficient then later in the day they remove the direct debit and charge me a commission charge of £30 stating insufficient funds. How can this be. Both the direct debit and the wages payment are automated I assume therefore if someone manually removes payments later in the day why can they not just see that the funds are there and pay the DD without charging me £30 per cancellation? I am next going to opt out of smilemore. I originally signed up for it for the travel insurance and green flag service. Green flag service is good but then its only £40 a year to go direct. First time I tried to use the travel insurance (see thread in holidays about BMI leaving me and my family stranded in Lisbon) they said "theres nothing we can do for you on this occassion. the insurance doesnt cover this. What exactly does this useless @10 (soon to be £12) cover. certainly in my case I am paying £120 for a service that I can get for £40. Rant over but as soon as can get into a positive and remove the credit card debt I shall be switching banks to someone who CAN stop me going over £0 and CAN provide accounts without OD facilities being mandatory. Andy