Hi all, I am currently helping my step daughter sort out her pdl with The Money Shop.

We became aware of the problem in July 2013 when she moved back in with us. She received a default notice dated 16/07/13 claiming she owed £582.83. I sent TMS a letter, recorded delivery, on the 23/07/13 explaining she was currently unemployed, applying for JSA, could they freeze interest, provide their account details so payments could be made when her financial situation improved, and also included a SAR. I simultaneously obtained all 3 CRA reports. I changed her bank account as well.

Received SAR from TMS dated 29/08/13. She was by now in employment and due to be paid on the 30/09/13. She started to receive daily phone calls which I told her to ignore. I wrote to them on 01/10/13 stating she was in employment, willing to settle the account over 9 months but still needed their account details, and to desist from calling and deal in writing.

So, to the help I need. I am trying to work out how much they are due. From the SAR, the last loan she had was from 21/04/13 for £370-00, for 9 days, with an APR of 2235784.0% variable (no typo btw), and a total amount payable of £473-56 by 30/04/13. She has made no payment towards this, and the CRA report, updated 30/06/13, shows a balance of £497-00. They have so far not replied to the letter dated 01/10/13, and have continued to call, last week alone, 32 times.

She will by 31/10/13 have saved enough to pay in the region of £500-00, and I could do with being shot of this bunch of clowns on her behalf, any help/advice greatly received thanks

Evening uhtbk,

firstly I'm sorry to hear you and your son are going through this, but please bear in mind this is all sortable !

Bazooka Boo's advice is all good and I would add the following...

Plan of action is key, firstly I would suggest changing bank accounts regardless, and if possible change your son's mobile number but retain the old sim in an old phone so you can keep a log of calls made to it. This should ease his mind about answering calls, and hopefully yours too.

Whilst it sounds like p2p have been grossly negligent, you need to find out exactly what has gone on. As such you need to write to p2p and MH stating that you require a full Subject Access Request under the DPA 1998, I can post up a rough draft if you like. This will cost £10 per company, if money is tight, then just send it to p2p first. Postal Order would be best, and make sure they understand it is for the SAR, not to be paid against the debt. Coupled with this should be an "In dispute" letter in which you will tell them to freeze any activity on the account. They will have 40 days to respond to the SAR, and if my experience is anything to go by, will take all of that time. You will need to put your sons name on it, and get him to sign.

Speaking from experience, I would also suggest getting a folder and copying all correspondence into it, and make your son read all correspondence before filing it. I only say that as I know how difficult a conversation about the seriousness can be. I sightly reminder needs minimal words, and worked wonders with my stepdaughter when dealing with her debts (I still am).

I hope that helps, possibly someone else with even more insight will pop along and help some more, but as I said at the start IT'S ALL SORTABLE

Regards

vselym

Evening, the following went to MyLoan.co.uk today,

My loan

5300 Lakeside

Cheadle Royal Business Park

Manchester

SK8 3GP

THIS IS A FORMAL COMPLAINT

Dear Sir/Madam

Thank you for your swift response to my letter dated 24th July 2013. I am however disappointed that you either didn’t understand what I said, or chose to ignore it.

Whilst I did enter my debit card details into your website, I was under the impression this was for credit checking purposes, and not explicit authorisation to take a fee of £69.99 for a brokerage service or membership of your company.

As such I request a full refund of £69.99, and as you have clearly acknowledged by replying to my initial letter that you know who I am, a cheque made out to me and sent to the above address will suffice thank you.

As this is a formal complaint, I am aware that you have up to 8 weeks to complete your investigations and reply, should however you conclude your findings before then and are unable to acquiesce to my request, then please indicate this in your response, to allow me to escalate my complaint further with the FOS and OFT, without delay.

I look forward to your response,

Have also completed complaint to FOS re Lloyds final response, see previous post

Received letter from Lloyds on 2nd August, dated 31st July in response to above letter, their reply reads ;

Thank you for letting us know your concerns about your debit card dispute. We always welcome customer comments as it helps us to put things right for you.

As you mentioned, two payments to My Loan caused your account to be overdrawn and our Debit Card Disputes department refused to raise a chargeback. A member of staff informed your stepfather that her decision was based on her experience.

We appreciate how this situation has made you feel, however, our review shows no mistake was made.

Companies offering a loan broker service, as is the case with My Loan, will charge a one-off fee. The terms and conditions on http://www.myloan.co.uk state in Section 5 that the company will take a fee of £69.99 within 62 days of a customer signing up for their service. As the payments taken from your account on 3 and 10 June were taken in line with My Loan's terms and conditions, we are unable to recover the money back from the company.

I understand your concern that your account has been overdrawn as a result of the payments in question. If items are presented for payment and you don't have enough money in your account, we make a decision about whether to pay them or not. We usually work on the basis that customers want us to pay items, rather than return them. When My Loan requested payments we could not have known that you would look to dispute this.

I trust I've explained the reasons for our decision. If you wish, you now have the option to contact the FOS, so long as you do this within six months of this letter. Please find a copy of their leaflet enclosed. I've also enclosed a copy of our complaint information which gives you details of our commitment to how we deal with complaints.

It's important we've resolved your complaint fairly. If you feel we've misunderstood your complaint, or you've any questions or further information, please contact me.

yadayada Megan McCann

Firstly, I'm glad Megan had some free time to fully investigate and type a response in one day, so obviously customer services are currently kicking their heels !

Secondly, Ms Pascoe's "experience" clearly counts for far more than my "belief" that I didn't agree to being charged, but was hoodwinked into data harvesting and conned !

Thirdly, luckily Megan has got her head around My Loan's t's and c's Section 5, an extract of which I will now share,

With regards to payments set up by debit or credit card we will attempt to take £69.99 when you make your application. If this payment declines we will immediately attempt to take a payment of £1 in order to validate your card details, should both of these attempts fail we will continue this process until You notify Us in writing that you wish Us to cancel such attempts or a period of 62 days has passed. Should the £1 validation payment accept at any stage during the 62 days then we will attempt to take £68.99 once per day until you notify us in writing that you wish Us to cancel such attempts or a period of 62 days has passed.

So if I understand Megan correctly, Lloyds "usually work on the basis that customers want us to pay items, rather than return them", so why did Lloyds return My Loan's £69.99 application request ? Surely that's what I wanted ? Apparently I didn't, what I really wanted, was the initial £69.99 request declined, because I had insufficent funds, but subsequent £1.00 and £68.99 requests paid because I "weally, weally wanted it" !

And Fourthly, as I requested, they have failed to "state" this is their final response, but I could dilly dally with a few more letters........ or maybe not

I have reference numbers already with the FOS, so that's my Monday morning spoken for.

Does anyone see this differently to me ? Am I pushing £70 too far ?

Evening, sent this today, and received "cancellation form" from myloan. Letter to myloan will be drafted tonight and sent tomorrow, any comments greatly received ta

Xxxxx name xxxxxX

xxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxx

Address

XXXX XXX

30th July 2013

Lloyds Banking Group

Customer Services

BX1 1LT

THIS IS A FORMAL COMPLAINT

Acc. No: xxxxxxxx

Sort Code: xx-xx-xx

Dear Sir/Madam

This relates to two entries on the above account, dated on the enclosed copied statement as the 3rd and 10th June 2013.

I recently attended the xxxxxxx branch, 87-34-xx, on Wednesday 24th & Thursday 25th July, in an attempt to remedy the situation that had arisen. I was accompanied by my stepfather, and on both occasions spoke to the Branch Manager, Mr xxxx xxxxxxx. I sought to have both amounts charged back to my account.

On the Wednesday, Mr xxxxxxx spoke to the call centres concerned, and I spoke briefly to confirm some details. The conclusion was that no action could be taken, as the company to whom the payments had been made, had not been informed or given the opportunity to refund the amounts themselves. We then arranged an appointment for 14.00 the following day, Thursday 25th July.

Again, I attended with my stepfather and spoke to Mr xxxxxx. Mr xxxxxx called “Debit Disputes” and spoke through the problem. I then authorised my stepfather to speak on my behalf. The call took place at approximately 14.15hrs and was with a Deborah Pascoe. Ms Pascoe pointed out that the bank had dealt with cases like this before, refused to attempt a chargeback, told my stepfather she knew what the regulations stated and refused to continue the conversation, asking to speak to Mr xxxxxx again. Consequently I feel we have reached an impasse at branch and call centre level and need to escalate the matter to Head Office.

My complaints are twofold, being firstly that under the Payment Services Rules 2009, you failed to adhere to Regulation 61 by simply dismissing my assertion that the transaction was unauthorised, without proper investigation and relying on, in Ms Pascoe’s words, “previous experience”, a phrase I am sure many original PPI claimants heard too. Secondly, that under the Financial Conduct Authorities, Principles for Business, PRIN 2.1.1 No. 6, you failed to treat me fairly by authorising both payments and taking me into an overdraft position.

The redress I seek is that my account be restored to the original balance prior to the two transactions that caused me to be £69.58 overdrawn.

As this is a Formal Complaint I am aware that you have up to 8 weeks to investigate and would appreciate all communication in writing to the above address. I also request that if you find that Lloyds cannot meet my demand, that you indicate in your answer that, that is your final decision, thus allowing me to escalate the matter to the FOS for adjudication.

It is worthy of note that, Mr xxxxxx’s handling of the matter is to be highly commended, being diligent, courteous and professional at all times.

Yours faithfully

xxxxxnamexxxxx

I have searched the forum extensively re myloans, and yes I could hang around for a while and collect £64-99, but that doesn't answer all the questions.

Now a dog with a bone, here are extracts from myloan t's&c's

5. Fees

We charge a fee for providing a service of acting as a finance broker. We specify the fee as part of our communications with You. If You do not enter into a loan offered by lender or financier within the 6 months that we act for You. We will refund the fee less than the £5 brokerage fee provided for by the Consumer Credit Act

1974. Refunds must be requested in writing to avoid repayments being sent to a wrong address. To facilitate Us processing payments and repayments You authorise Us to retain your charge, credit and debit card details. With regards to payments set up by debit or credit card we will attempt to take £69.99 when you make your application. If this payment declines we will immediately attempt to take a payment of £1 in order to validate your card details, should both of these attempts fail we will continue this process until You notify Us in writing that you wish Us to cancel such attempts or a period of 62 days has passed. Should the £1 validation payment accept at any stage during the 62 days then we will attempt to take £68.99 once per day until you notify us in writing that you wish Us to cancel such attempts or a period of 62 days has passed.

Under the Financial Services (Distance Marketing) Regulations 2004 you have the right to cancel your agreement with us within 14 days of receiving these terms and conditions, you will be entitled to a full refund which will be made within 30 days of receiving your request. If you would like to cancel You must Inform us in writing by email to [email protected] or by writing to My Loan, 5300 Lakeside, Cheadle Royal Business Park, Manchester, SK83GP.

6. Cancellation

Under the Financial Services (Distance Marketing) Regulations 2004 you have a right to cancel your application within 14 days of receiving these terms and conditions and receive a full refund. If You wish to wish to cancel your application, You must write to Us. In this event We will refund your fee within 30 days of the date of which We receive your written request to cancel your application. If you would like to cancel You must inform Us in writing by email to [email protected] or by writing to My Loan, 5300 Lakeside, Cheadle Royal Business Park, Manchester, SK83GP

14. Membership and Fee's

After paying your initial membership fee of £69.99 you will enjoy membership benefits to both myloan.co.uk and mycreditsaver.co.uk.

With regards to payments set up by debit or credit card we will attempt to take £69.99 when you make your application. If this payment declines we will immediately attempt to take a payment of £1 in order to validate your card details, should both of these attempts fail we will continue this process until You notify Us in writing that you wish Us to cancel such attempts or a period of 62 days has passed. Should the £1 validation payment accept at any stage during the 62 days then we will attempt to take £68.99 once per day until you notify us in writing that you wish Us to cancel such attempts or a period of 62 days has passed.

Under the Financial Services (Distance Marketing) Regulations 2004 you have the right to cancel your agreement with us within 14 days of receiving these terms and conditions, you will be entitled to a full refund which will be made within 30 days of receiving your written request. If you would like to cancel You must inform Us in writing to [email protected] or by writing to My Loan, 5300 Lakeside, Cheadle Royal Business Park, Manchester, SK83GP

19. Card Payment Terms

● These are the terms set out by My Loan with regard to future payments set up by Credit or Debit Card.

● If your payment for £69.99 declines on the day of your application, we will attempt to take £1 on the same day to validate the card details. This process will be repeated until you notify us in writing that you wish to cancel your application or a period of 62 days has passed. If the £1 card validation payment is successful at any stage during the process we will attempt to take £68.99 from the card once a day until you notify Us in writing that you wish to cancel or a period of 62 days has passed.

● You can cancel a Credit or Debit card payment at any time by simply contacting My Loan by email to [email protected] or by writing to My Loan, 5300 Lakeside, Cheadle Royal Business Park, Manchester, SK83GP

● Remember, we won't know when you have had a loan paid out, so you will need to let us know if there is a problem.

So in clauses 5&6 I'm employing a broker with a right to cancel whilst they can carry on for 60 days

By clause 14 I'm lucky enough to be a "member", still with a right to cancel, but myloan get 2 extra days to raid my account, obviously preferrential treatment for being a "face" down myloan way

Sadly by clause19 I'm back to clause 14, just not a "member"

Can t's & c's include different timescales for "a" singular service ? Did I miss something ?

This is from the OFT's guide to Unfair Contracts

Group 6(a): Unequal cancellation rights

Schedule 2, paragraph 1, states that terms may be unfair if

they have the object or effect of:

(f) authorising the seller or supplier to dissolve the contract on a

discretionary basis where the same facility is not granted to

the consumer …

6.1.1 Fairness and balance require that consumers and suppliers should be on an

equal footing as regards rights to end or withdraw from the contract. The

supplier's rights should not be excessive, nor should the consumer's be

over-restricted. This does not, however, mean a merely formal equivalence

in rights to cancel, but rather that both parties should enjoy rights of equal

extent and value.

Question, is 14 days for the consumer to cancel yet 30 days to refund the fee equal

Not necessarily clutching at straws, just putting it out there ?

Thanks RI, but Lloyds are insistent this is not a CPA. I would beg to differ, myloans t's&c's state they will attempt to take "their fee" of £69-99 first, if this fails they will attempt a £1-00 transaction to validate the card, then try for a further 60 days to collect the balance of £68-99, and as I see it that is so they can catch anyone's payday regardless. I would have thought as they are selling a service, brokering, if they failed to collect at the first attempt then they don't provide the service, simples ?!

This raises questions in my mind which I'll list briefly;

Do their t's&c's constitute an unfair contract in that they can continually request payments for 60 days ?

Did they attempt to collect prior to the £1-00 transaction, and then between that and the £68-99 transaction, and how could I find out ? from them SAR ? or Lloyds ?

Still not clear as to how the payments were authorised as there were insufficent funds in the account for even the £1-00 transaction, and had been like that for 23 days so no issue with payments clearing late ?

Can Lloyds refuse to accept my belief that this is fraud, because they have previously found in favour of PDL Brokering companies, my reading of the FCA is refund then investigate ?

It may be only £69-99, and in many cases they apparently return £64-99, eventually, but I know I am in the fortunate position to pay this, and the people they are royally f*st*ng, cannot !

ok, am I complaining about lack of compliance with FCA chargeback guidelines, allowing transactions to process therefore maybe invoking breach of BCOBS, was looking for the best line of attack ...

Oh well, this is going to get messy methinks.

Lloyds TSB Scotland Visa Debit Disputes simply refuse to chargeback, as they know that by clicking on myloan's website, my sd complied with their t's&c's and agreed to pay £69-99. The "experienced" call centre "agent" actually said as I was trying to explain the FCA position on chargeback, "I don't want to talk to you anymore, pass me back to the Branch Manager"

In fairness to him, he filed a complaint against her handling of the situation, whilst I was there with him, and apologised that he couldn't do more.

He also couldn't answer as to why the payments were allowed to be processed with just £0-29 credit before myloan started.

Not sure where to go now ? Write to Lloyds ? FCA ? or just head off to court ?

Any input greatly received

Am I barking up the wrong tree, or do we have a case for unfair treatment under BCOB ?

With an opening balance of £0-29, if my sd had used her card to buy a £1-00 item at asda, the branch manager yesterday agreed that the transaction would have been declined. She has no od facility.

So by allowing a transaction to take her into an unauthorised od situation could it be argued this was unfair treatment ?

Surely fair treatment would be any and all transactions declined ?

That is tomorrow's mission, I have an official appointment at 14.00. Forgot to mention in 1st post, the account balance before the £1-00 transaction, stood at £0.29 credit, absolutely woeful of Lloyds to authorise that payment, let alone the subsequent £68-99.

Evening all,

brief background, my step daughter obviously got herself into financial difficulties, and hid letters in drawers rather than tell her mum and me. She has over this last weekend fessed up, and so here I am back on CAG (my how it's grown), my once second home !

Amongst numerous issues was her Lloyds TSB account, which was in arrears due to two transactions from myloan. After half an hour on here I had the picture, thanks go to all unfortunate CAGgers who have crossed their path and posted about it.

I went to see the bank with her today, and met with a pretty clued up Branch Manager who had his own issues with the call centre. I have now fired off a pay it back letter to myloan with all the usual threats, as the call centre point blank refused to treat the matter as fraud, and I had not given myloan opportunity to deal with the dispute.

After my own research I am more than convinced that this could constitute fraud. I am aware that some may say by entering details which would allow them to take money from the account would constitute agreeing to their t's&c's, but this does not explain why they took a £1-00 debit first, then a week later a debit of £68-99. Without entering any details on their website, they do make clear they are a broker, they do not anywhere without entering details explain how much. The fact they took £1-00 first suggests to me they were phishing, as clearly if they had an explicit agreement they would have taken their brokerage fee in one fell swoop ?

Anyway letter sent, gave them 7 days, told them no questionnaire to be completed and no reminder of deadline ...... we'll see

Evening, it's been awhile

Just a heads up in case it helps, apologies if posted before, but I was dealing with Lloyds today near Aberdeen.

Having explained the problem my step daughter was having with a certain "my loan", to the branch manager, he very diligently rang Lloyds TSB Visa Debit Disputes. He waited patiently for the next agent to become available (25 mins), explained the problem and then let them speak to my step daughter who was present. The phone call then ended after approx. 1 min, so he asked what had been said, she told him and he uttered an expletive and immediately hit redial. He, not so patiently, waited a further 10 mins, explained the situation all over again and that he wasn't happy with the previous phonecall outcome then sat with the phone while the new agent investigated the situation. Hands up who can guess what happened next ?

Pardon was uttered more than once ! ................... as was "FFS" when the call ended !

THE CRUX OF THIS POST IS !

It appears there is a differentiation between call centres for Lloyds TSB Visa Disputes and Lloyds TSB Scotland Visa Disputes that even Branch Managers weren't aware of. This is after Lloyds TSB Scotland became a company in it's own right, so I would suggest any calls start with questions about the date of your complaint and whether that is the call centre that can deal with it.

TBF the Branch Manager was clued up as to our rights and was as miffed as I would have been had I called from home.

Right, off to start a thread with some detail on ongoing step daughter issues

thanks andydd for your prompt response, i assume the max fee of £10 still applies ?

I have a friend who has been landed with a £7k+ bill, with Scottish Gas insisting that this be repaid over 10 months.

He cannot remember when he started paying by direct debit and has had more than one current bank account in that time, so my thinking was an SAR to Scottish Gas would be quicker and simpler than separate SAR's to the various banks.....

Any thoughts ?

Regards vselym

Unless i'm mistaken, you can only buy a lottery ticket with a DEBIT card, so where does a CREDIT reference agency obtain any rights ?

Rebchappers

the defaults will more than likely remain for six years from the month you pay off the accounts, it does depend on the company involved.

i would doubt very much that your credit score would improve at all.

what are the accounts ? current account/credit card/loan ? are there any reclaimable charges ? are they with dca's ?

you may want to consider sar'ing the accounts and seeing whether they have followed the correct procedures in dealing with your defaults and trying to apply leverage to get the defaults removed as part of the settlements

stevieb52

in the first instance is there any chance of scanning in the letter explaining why a CCA isnt required ?

WL1888

PT2537 OTT ????!!!!!!?????!?!!?!?!??!?!? Never, just concise and to the point, i totally agree with what he says !

In terms of "finding yourself", towards the top of each page you should see the following

User CP FAQ Calendar New Posts Search Quick Links Reviews Log Out

just click on User CP and scroll down, any thread you have posted on will appear

Evening pipin

A CCA request costs £1.00, i would pay by Postal Order, dont sign your name print it and send it recorded/special delivery so it has to be signed for at the other end.

By all means add the harrassment letter to the CCA request and just pay one postage.

As for what to pay them, do an income/expenditure sheet (available on here), and pay them what you can afford.

If they do fail to comply with your CCA request, you would no longer be obliged to pay them, for as long as they remain in default.

pt2537

nice letter, is there any validity though in including an element of "write the debt off AND REMOVE ANY DEFAULT MARKERS" ?

many people on here seem to think of it after the event, and we all know just how difficult the cra's make it to remove such markers

Notcher

Do it now, as they have 40 days to reply to that one !

I would also stipulate "ALL" data they hold on you, not limited to the last 6 years

Sorry i thought youd done them both at the same time

Hi Notcher

Quel surprise, all 3 CCA requests in default, well i never !

Whilst they remain in default of a CCA request, they are not entitled to chase or enforce the alledged debt, and the lack of one would provide a total defence should they atempt to take you to court.

If they have replied with the SAR's then calculate any charges that could be reclaimed whilst you wait another 30 days for them to commit an offence.

I wouldnt at this stage communicate with them either on the default of the CCA request, or any reclaimable charges.

However if they completely fail on the CCA request and there are charges that can be reclaimed, then your bargaining position for F&FS including removal of default markers, would be strengthened greatly IMHO.

I dont know if anyone else could add to this advice ??

Hope that helps a bit though