Will do, and "Thanks" once again for your advice. Cheers, BOF

Hi Elsa, Thank you. I will change the letter as you suggested. I am looking forward to their reply, if I ever get one. Looking at some of the posts about this DCA really give the impression they are at the lower end of the market, where honour and integrity are words they have never heard of, let alone understand. Cheers, BOF

This will be in the post tomorrow, sent by Recorded Delivery: Dear Sirs, Your Reference: Client Reference: Client: I have received a number of letters addressed to my son xxx at this address in relation to the above alleged debt. I am surprised to have received letters addressed to xxx as your client, xxx xxx Plc, is fully aware that my son has not lived at this address since 1999 and has been resident overseas since 2002. In 2006, following a complaint to the Chief Executive, xxx xxx Plc offered a full apology for the continued use of my address in relation to this matter. I was assured my details had been removed from their files. As this is obviously not the case, I will be making a complaint to the relevant authorities. As a Debt Collecting Agency, you will know that under the Limitation Act 1980, Section 5 “an action founded on simple contract shall not be brought after the expiration of six years from the date on which the cause of action accrued”. You will also know, under its Debt Collection Guidance on Statute Barred debt, the OFT say that “it is unfair to pursue the debt if the debtor has heard nothing from the creditor during the relevant limitation period”. I do not know the date of this alleged debt, but as my son has been resident at a number of temporary addresses within the United Kingdom since 1999 and permanently resident outside the United Kingdom since 2002, it is highly unlikely that your client or any of its agents has had any contact with him within the six year limitation period. Therefore, as you are no doubt aware, the alleged debt is now Statute Barred. The OFT also states that continuing to press for payment for a debt that is Statute Barred could amount to harassment, contrary to CPUTR2008. Unless you can provide documentary evidence of payment or written contact from my son in the relevant period laid out under Section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980, I suggest that you are no longer able to take any court action against him to recover the alleged amount claimed. Please note, sending computer generated letters to my son at an address which is known to be incorrect, does not count as ‘documentary evidence’. I await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed and that no further contact will be made with us or our son concerning the above account. Yours etc. -------------------------------------------------------------- Any comments or advice? Cheers, BOF

I presume because this is a 'fishing trip'? Cheers, BOF

Point taken. I have no idea if he did make a payment; probably not because he spent most of his time chasing women and grazing through the kitchen! Thanks for the advise. Cheers, BOF

Thanks folks, a very interesting read! A slight hitch in the timings has come to light. I had forgotten that in early 2006 my son came home for a short break between contracts and within a few days was offered a very well paid job in the UK. He opened a load of letters gathering dust in his room, one of them from another DCA about his Graduate loan. He responded and said he would clear it within a month or two (the offered job was that well paid!). I do not recall if he ever had a response to his letter. However, when he actually started the job, it turned out the actual salary was not a 'salary' but an "estimated earnings" based on a whole host of factors. Lesson Number 1, read the small print! Lesson Number 2, listen to your dad! He resigned the same day, made some phone calls to Europe and went back over there a week later, more the wiser I hope. So the 6 year rule does not appear to be relevant in this case. I am still going to write to Buchanan, but will leave out the those bits. Cheers, BOF

Hello, My son left home in 2000 and currently works overseas, he has not been back to the UK for more than two weeks a year and not at all some years. He has not been shown at this address on the Electoral Register since 2001. About 6 years ago, Abbey started sending letters to him demanding the repayment of his Graduate Account overdraft. Despite numerous letters to Abbey saying he no longer lived here, the letters continued, followed by letters from DCAs. Eventually, again after numerous letters to all and sundry and the Financial Ombudsman, Abbey apologised and we heard no more. Until this month. So far three letters have arrived, the last being a FORMAL DEMAND, all from this Buchananclark + wells DCA. I was about to write to them but decide to look them up on the internet first. I was not surprised to find them on this site. My questions is, should I go ahead and write to them, explain that my son no longer lives here etc etc; or should I just leave it? Regards, BOF

FINAL UPDATE – WIN! My apologies for the very long delay in closing this thread, so much has happened since the court case that it dropped off my radar. We had our day in Court, once in an actual Court and again in March this year, at our home on a site visit. It would take too long to give all the details, all the twists and turns, but we won our case. There is a lot of excellent advice on this site about what to do before and when you get to Court, so these are just a few notes of what we experienced and what may be of interest. 1.When you state your case, watch the speed of the Judge as he or she writes their notes; slow down if necessary. 2.If the Judge says something you do not like, keep it to yourself. Upsetting the Judge will do your case no good. 3.You know you are telling the truth and the other side is lying through their teeth, but if they are more convincing, better prepared, the court will believe them. It is a sad fact, but a court has more to do with ‘image’ and who comes across the more professional than with the actual truth. The people who tried to screw you with shoddy workmanship and materials will have no scruples about lying to a Court. 4.Lawyers are often no better than the pond life they are representing, just more articulate, so do not lose your temper or react openly when you hear the lies, that is what they want you to do. State your case as clearly as you can; listen carefully to the question before you answer; be polite and courteous to the other side, even though you want to rip their lying heads off! 5.Dress appropriately. We turned up clean and smartly dressed, with two binders of evidence and a large amount of photographs. The Claimant, apparently a Director, turned up in jeans and with a crumpled single piece of paper as his evidence. 6.Do not directly quote the Law to a Judge. They will allow lawyers to do so, that is part of the ritual, but they can get a bit prickly if a civilian does it. Try to be a bit circumspect and vague, lots of “As I understand it…” tend to go down well as it lets the Judge impress everyone with his or her knowledge. 7.[Giving someone a few minutes at the end of the work being completed is not sufficient time for them to make an informed decision as to the quality and correctness of the work, and therefore any such signed pieces of paper are worthless.] The Claimant’s entire case was that my wife had signed to say she was satisfied with the work. The Judge immediately ruled it out and said that the Claimant’s company would be well advised to reconsider their procedures in this matter. 8.[Did you know that if you are sued for the value of a cancelled cheque, you would lose?] We certainly did not. The judge explained that a cheque is considered the same as cash. By signing and issuing a cheque to the Claimant’s company at the time of completion of the work, then later cancelling it before it can be honoured by our bank, no matter what the reasons, we had effectively ‘stolen’ the value of the cheque from the Claimant. What we should have done is either not issued a cheque at the time, or honoured the cheque and sued the company for our money back. However, said the Judge, “that is not what we are here for today”. 9. You can never have too many photographs. 10. Try somehow to get the Judge to undertake a site visit. We were lucky, the Judge having seen the photographs actually suggested one. Although you are still under the Jurisdiction of the Court, you have ‘home advantage’ and no one is going to stop your wife having her say in her own kitchen. In the end, it never came to that; the Claimant, realising that once the Judge saw the work he could no longer pretend it was to an acceptable standard, bottled out and never turned up. 11. Before showing the shoddy workmanship, point out the basics first. We demonstrated that the kitchen floor was level, the walls were vertical and that the kitchen units were installed correctly. Then we went on to show that the worktop was higher at one end than the other, it was thicker at one end than the other, how the units had been knocked about, the poor sealants used etc. 12. Listen very carefully to what the Judge is asking and try to identify what he or she is actually wanting as an answer. Again, consider your answer before you reply. Having seen all the problems with the worktop, having made copious notes, the Judge gently led us on to say what we wanted the outcome to be. Finally, a. Keep detailed, contemporaneous notes of everything. b. Avoid talking to ‘the other side’ on the telephone. Write to them to say that you will not discuss this matter on the phone and all contact must be in writing, this way both sides can be sure of what was said and what was not said. If they do call, state again that you are not prepared to discuss the matter on the phone and hang up, do not be caught up in a conversation. Make a note of the date and time of this call. c. Send all correspondence by Royal Mail Special Delivery, a bit costly but it pays off in the end. The claimant denied the receipt of a letter, until I produced the signed receipt. The look on his face was priceless! Cheers, BOF

Hi, Red Castle will not take any cognisance of your current financial situation, they are only interested in 'their' debt. However, they are very unlikely to take you to court for £400, it is not financially viable for them. So whatever you do, do not let this bunch of genetical engineered failures frighten you. They will try and bully you into paying, either verbally or by sending you official looking documents that look like court papers. Do not pay them a penny until you establish exactly what the debt is. Red Castle will probably have bought the debt from Ann Summers, hence the discrepancy between what you think you own Ann Summers and what Red Castle want from you. However, your debt is with Ann Summers and you need to check with them what the exact debt is now that you have sent your 'kit' back. Did you send it back by Recorded Delivery? From now on you should avoid at all costs telephoning Ann Summers or Red Castle. Telephone calls can be denied, conversations that you did not have can be created and agreements that you have no knowledge of can be attributed to you. Remember, they have no interest in life other than collecting the debt. Always write to them and send your letters by Royal Mail Special Delivery. It will cost you just under £5, but they have to sign for your letter and give a name. They can deny any telephone calls, but they can not deny receiving your letters. You will notice that none of the letters you receive from Red Castle and a lot of other businesses, banks, insurance companies etc have an actual signature, it is often just a squiggle or a fictitious name. Play them at their own game; do not sign your letters as you would normally. There is always a chance that your actual signature might later appear on a photocopied document that you have no knowledge of. Go to this web site and get yourself a computer generated signature that you can paste into your letter. Online Personal Signature Maker - MyLiveSignature - Free Personal Signature Generator Write to Red Castle and ask for full details of the alleged debt. Tell them that you will only correspond with them by letter to avoid any misunderstandings. Also tell them that any telephone calls made by Red Castle after receipt of your letter will be classed as harassment and will be reported to the relevant authority. It will probably not bother them a bit, but you will have a record that they have been warned. Write to Ann Summers and ask them to confirm that they have received you 'kit' and to give you the exact figure you still owe them. When both have replied you will then know exactly where you stand. From there you can make your plans to repay what you owe. Good luck! BOF

I've lost the plot on who the defendant is and who the claimant is!!! The company is suing me for the balance of their bill. I am counterclaiming against them for the reasons stated above. So who exactly is who now? Cheers, BOF

I thought they had already done that as their claim was issued by the Northampton Bulk Centre, but I had to return the Allocation Questionnaire to my local County Court. On that form was a question asking me if I was happy to have my local County Court deal with the matter. I said "Yes". Not that it will be a problem, but is there a possibility the other party will try and get it transferred to their local court? BOF

Very strange! I use Western Union to send money to my son in Europe and have never had a single problem. I set up an online account with WU and it is very easy to use and, so far, very secure. I set the amount to be sent, who to and where it is to be picked up. I then get an email with a free telephone number to call; I answer some questions and the money is released. I get a reference number which I then text to my son. It takes about 10 minutes in total. I do not know what happened here, but there is definitely something wrong somewhere! BOF

Well what do you know! I received a letter last Friday, 25th July, from the solicitors acting for the company, saying they had received my counterclaim and asking for my agreement to a 28 day extension. On Monday I replied to their letter, agreeing to their request. On Tuesday the solicitors wrote to say they were no longer acting for the company and I should address all correspondence to them direct. On Wednesday I received a letter from the company with a copy of their defence against my counterclaim. No covering letter, just the copy. Apart from the appalling English and grammar, it is factually incorrect. They claim this is the first they have been told of the 'damage' to our kitchen; We are a pair of crooks trying to avoid paying their invoice; We refused them entry to try and repair the 'damage' they did not know about and did not cause (?); We are a pair of crooks; We are refusing to have any contact with them other than by letter (??); We are a pair of crooks; They only received a 'token' payment; We are a pair of crooks; We refused to give them any photographic evidence; We are a pair of crooks; etc., etc. The really stupid thing is, all the allegations they make can be easily answered by producing the emails and letters they received and for which we have their signatures and the dates of receipt. Why do they think we only correspond with them by letter? Do you suppose they are naturally dumb, or is there a special government course they have to attend in order to be awarded a Certificate of Stupidity? I wonder why their solicitors have pulled out? I was not planning to respond to their defence now, I will leave that for Court as and when we get there. I have completed the Allocation Questionnaire and sent it back to my local County Court where the case has been transferred to. I presume now we wait until the Court sets a date? BOF

Ramone, It is fun! Have these pond crawlers actually told you what the debt relates to? Is it finance on the car? If so, who's name was on the Financial Agreement papers, your's or your partner's? Have you received anything from Red Castle at all, other than their computer generated "we are going to sue you" letters? Cheers, BOF

Ramone, It is sad, but not surprising, that Red Castle are still up to their old tricks. There are a number of ways of dealing with these pond crawlers. Always remember though that you are dealing with socially challenged individuals who are unable to find work elsewhere, hence the rude and ignorant manner they adopt. These are some links to other sections of the CAG site where you can get advice from the real experts. I am fairly new to this site and I cannot fault the advice I have been given. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/99361-you-being-harassed-telephone.html Harassment by telephone - Consumer Wiki These links will also take you to the ‘Telephone harassment’ letter you should send to Red Castle. When dealing with them you must send everything by Royal Mail Special Delivery, where they have to give a name and signature. Send the 'Harassment' letter and any other letters separately. I found that if my letter dealt with two or more matters, they picked the one they wanted to deal with and ignored the rest. In the short term, put an anonymous caller bar on your telephone line. That will slow them down, but they may resort to sending SMS messages to your home number. (That's also covered in the links) This next bit is very childish and petty, but I had a great time doing it and it felt good to be getting my own back. If you do answer the phone to them, ask them to hold for a moment, rattle around a bit as if you are plugging something in, then tell them you are recording the conversation. Do not let the caller start asking for your “security” details. Immediately ask the caller, “for the purposes of the tape”, to state their name and office location, and do they agree that it is now HH:MM on the **/**/****. If they have not hung up by now, state that you wrote to them on the **/**/**** and asked them to only contact you by letter as you consider their calls to be harassment. Your letter was received by them on **/**/****. So, and again for the tape, in the light of Red Castle receiving your letter, would they please state who authorised them to call you, clearly stating the name of the person and their position in the company? If they still have not hung up and are by now, as they were with me, getting rather rude and aggressive, ask them to hold for a few moments, put the phone down and go and make a cup of tea. At some point go back and simply hang up the telephone. I know, sad! But it was fun! Do not give in to them. Remember, there are a lot of people on this site who have been in your situation and have learnt a great deal. They will willingly give you some excellent advice. They have for me. Regards, BOF

I have replied to the solicitors and sent another copy of the Royal Mail delivery notice in a separate letter. Both letters were sent by Royal Mail Next Day delivery. Now let them try and claim they did not receive anything! I have asked the solicitors to go back to their clients and, after speaking to the person whose name and signature is on the delivery receipt, ask them if they still want to claim they only received my cheque? The solicitors signed for my letters on Friday and I submitted my counterclaim on line on Saturday. The Court will action that on Monday. We are counterclaiming for just over £3,000; Against their claim of £1,450 (which is mathematically wrong in so many ways!) Should be a interesting week! BOF

Hello Honey, I have been reading your thread and I am horrified with the way you have been treated. I cannot offer any better advice on your benefit claims than you have already been given, but I do think you should appeal against the HMRC ruling. In cases of the recovery of overpaid allowances/credits or underpayment of tax, HMRC has a lot of discretion in what it can agree to. Of course if you are rich, can afford expensive ‘Bean counters’ and sharks and ‘move in the right circles’, HMRC will, under its new senior management group, willingly do a deal. If you are not in that group, then you may have to fight a bit, but they will do deals. What they want on their records is a tick in a box that says that your ‘Overpayment’ is being recovered. Getting it all back within 12 months is a bonus, not the absolute requirement. Try and avoid telephoning them. HMRC no longer have 'local' offices where you can speak to the same person each time you call; someone who might actually know about your tax situation. The government ‘Bean Counters’ decide this was too inefficient, so they set up call centres and you will never speak to the same person twice. You are dependent on the person you speak to putting ALL the information you have given onto the central system. Unfortunately, they are under pressure to answer calls within certain time frames, so only the briefest details will be posted. Not all calls are recorded, so keep your own notes. If you do have to call HMRC about anything, before you start explaining why you are calling, give your name, take their name and location, confirm it, agree the date and time you are talking to them. That acts as a ‘Heads up’to them that you are taking this seriously. When you have hung up, write up your notes and sign them. If you can, scan them into your PC so if there is a dispute in what was said, you can send HMRC a copy. Again, you are showing them that you are serious and will not just roll over. Write to HMRC at the address you have been given on the correspondence you received. Clearly mark your letter as “REQUEST FOR RECONSIDERATION” in red. The “Appeal” bit might have to come later. All correspondence is automatically scanned on receipt, but if they have to sign for a letter it is processed separately and tends to be fast tracked to someone (not sure who!). So always send your letter by Royal Mail Special Delivery (next day by 1pm). Never accept their first response as the final word. If it is not what you want, go back to them and mark your letter this time as “APPEAL” in red. Your letter will be bumped up to the next level of management. Emphasis the points you feel they have “Not given full weight to” and highlight any errors in their original decision. If you can, give some extra information that was not in your original letter/telephone call. At the bottom of your appeal letter, give HMRC a time scale to reply before you take your appeal to your MP. I would suggest 14 days from receipt of your letter. HMRC hates MPs becoming involved with complaints/appeals and has a separate office that deals with MP’s correspondence. Any complaints/appeals sent in via an MP are highlighted and dealt with asap. If after the 14 days are up, write to your MP and enclose copies of all your notes and correspondence with HMRC. Send a copy of your letter to HMRC. This might just be enough to encourage HMRC to agree to your request and when your MP writes in, they can say it has all been sorted. The bottom line is, do not give up or give in! I hope this has been of some help. Good luck! BOF

We received a reply from the solicitors today, after nearly three weeks, and its a pearler! The solicitors claim that their clients only received our cheque, not the accompanying letter that stated “If you cash this cheque, you accept it as full & final settlement etc”; Therefore they are not bound by the terms of my letter! The solicitors then go on to claim they did not receive the copy of the Royal Mail signed Proof of Delivery I enclosed with my letter to them. What are the odds of both the company claiming against us, and the firm of solicitors acting for them, not receiving important documents relating to the case? On the balance of probabilities, not very high. It will be interesting to see how they answer this in Court. I am about to submit our counterclaim via the internet. Do I just state a total figure we are counterclaiming, or should I break it down into sections such as our costs so far, the cost of the independent inspection and the cost of the repair? The full cost of the repair is difficult to give until the worktop is removed and the floor units examined properly. Once that is done we will know how many units will have to be replaced. If the worktop comes off cleanly, it could only be a few. If there are problems getting it off, then it could be all of them, as well as requiring the wall to be replastered. Should I put the ‘Worse case scenario’ figure in my claim? Also, what hourly rate would the Court accept for my time trying to sort out the mess caused by the worktop company, dealing with all the correspondence that has been flying backwards and forwards, as well as putting together our counterclaim? I am retired, but I worked out what my employer was happy to pay me at an hourly rate and have claimed that. Is that reasonable? Cheers, BOF

UPDATE: I have received an acknowledgement from the solicitors, briefly saying they are seeking their client's instructions. I have been in contact with the other customer again. They still have had no contact from this company and are of the opinion that they never will. They have refused to pay the balance of the invoice and have demanded their deposit back. However, they believe that is never going to happen without court action, and even if they were to win the action, the company would just ignore the ruling. There is the possibility that this company has previously done a 'phoenix', so I will register my counter claim via the court website, but wait and see what the solicitors come back to me with before I confirm any dates for the independent survey. There is little point in paying out money if the chances of getting it back are slim. Cheers, BOF

Well they are not hanging around! In this morning's post were the claim forms from Northampton County Court 'Bulk Centre'. The issue date on the forms is shown as the 20th June. I have 14 days from the 'Date of Service' (5 days from the issue date) to either role over and pay up, or send in the 'Acknowledgement of Service' and then submit my defence to the Court no later than 28 days after the 'Date of Service' (9th & 23rd July). Right then! I was going to go on line and acknowledge the service, ticking the box that says 'I intend to defend all of this claim'. I presume the solicitors will be informed of this by the Court? Has anyone any suggestions as to the layout if my defence and counter claim? I can use separate sheets of paper, so do I insert photographs at this point, or leave them until we get into the Court? I am still waiting to hear back from a number of kitchen fitting firms and fitters; if I can get them to produce their report within the 28 days, do I include this with my defence or keep it for the Court? I got bored with watching England get stuffed again by the All Blacks, so I started to draw up a list of costs incurred so far. For my 'Rate Per Hour' I used my old annual salary (I took early retirement), divided that by 52 weeks and then by 41 hours. I have used this figure for my hourly rate. Is that reasonable? What does a solicitor charge for reading and answering a letter? I know that is a bit like “how long is a piece of string?”, but what is a solicitor at the lower end of the market likely to charge? Should I go on the attack and send a copy to the solicitor saying, “these are my costs so far sunshine, and they are increasing daily!” BOF

I spoke to the other customer yesterday. We had a long and interesting conversation, the gist of which is that they have had no contact from the company since they refused to pay the balance and demanded their deposit back and that they are happy to give evidence on our behalf if this should ever get before a Court. We agreed to keep each other informed of any developments. My letter will be delivered tomorrow morning, Monday 23rd, by Special Delivery. This could be an interesting week! BOF

OK, Thanks. I will amend the letter accordingly.

This is what I propose to send to the solicitors: 20th June 2009 Dear Sirs, Your Reference: ********** Limited I am in receipt of your letters dated 12th and 19th June 2006 in which you threaten to commence legal proceedings on behalf of your client unless I pay the balance of their invoice within seven days. I wrote to your client on the 9th June 2008, the letter being delivered to their offices on the 10th June. A copy is enclosed for your information, along with a copy of the Royal Mail delivery notification. I would draw your attention to paragraph 1, page 2 of my letter. For ease of reference I have reproduced it below: By cashing this cheque you do hereby accept the £175 VAT as full and final settlement of our account and agree that all financial matters between Domostone and ourselves have been completed and that no further claims for monies or compensation will be made by either party. Following the receipt of my letter on the 10th June, the cheque was cashed on the 11th and processed through my bank on Friday 13th June 2008. By reading my letter and cashing my cheque, I consider your client has accepted my offer and as far as I am concerned, all monies have been brought to account and the matter is now closed. However, as this does not appear to be the case, my letter of the 9th June 2006 is now revoked. I consider we have suffered considerable damage as a result of their poor workmanship and will be seeking a professional independent report that we expect will support our view. I further expect that the conclusion of this report will be that they have repudiated the contract by their breach. I will be in contact with you once the report has been completed. If your client wishes to proceed with their action prior to the report being completed, then I will be filing a counter claim against them and we can let the Court decide the matter. Whilst I believe the product supplied and the workmanship of your client falls well below an acceptable standard, I did not believe they would be so dishonourable as to cash my cheque and then, reneging on the agreement, try to frighten me with a Solicitor's Letter and the threat of court action. As you will no doubt explain to them, they must accept that their credibility with the Court will be severely damaged if they choose to carry out their threat. I would like to think that you received your instructions before your client opened my letter and then forgot to inform you that they had accepted my cheque as the full and final settlement of my account. If that is not the case and they wish to act in a dishonourable fashion, then I will see them in Court. Yours faithfully, Any suggestions would be welcome. Regards, BOF

I was in the middle of writing the letter to the solicitors as suggested by BF when this morning's post arrived. In it was another letter from the solicitors. This one also appears to be a computer generated and says: As you have failed to pay our Clients' outstanding account of £1292.50 we have today forwarded the appropriate details for the purpose of issuing a Claim. The Claim request details have been sent to the Lord Chancellors County Court Bulk Centre which is situated at:- NORTHAMPTON County Court COUNTY COURT BULK CENTRE 4th Floor, St Katharines House 21-27 St Katharines Street NORTHAMPTON NN1 2LH If the Claim against you is successful the Court may order you to pay the scale costs. If you wish to avoid further action, it is necessary to pay the full amount shown in the remittance advice at the bottom of this letter which includes costs and interest which will be endorsed on the Claim. Your cheque should be sent direct to the address shown on the remittance-slip at the bottom of this letter. The-remittance slip should be detached and sent with the cheque. Debt 1292.50 Interest 5.04 Court Fee 65.00 Fixed Costs 80.00 1442.54 Issuing Court NORTHAMPTON County Court - Claim Reference No : 8XJ20370 PI/700927/2 Is this just the solicitor ratcheting up the pressure in the hope I will roll over and pay up? I will post a copy of my response letter before I send it. Cheers, BOF

Righty Ho! It is just as well I have not been able to get hold of the other customer! I will sort out an independent assessor and write to the solicitor as suggested. Cheers, BOF