Thanks for all your replies. Seems like it's more complicated than I first thought! I did find this from ACAS:

You might be told that you’ll get extra pay on top of your hourly rate, instead of being given paid holiday leave. This is known as ‘rolled-up’ holiday pay.

 

The idea is that you store up the extra pay and use it when you want to take time off work.

 

Although the government and Acas recommend employers don't use rolled-up holiday pay, it's legal if your employer does it clearly. For example, they can’t say "You’ll be paid £8 an hour which includes rolled-up holiday pay." They must say "Your basic hourly pay is £7.20 per hour. In addition to this you’ll receive 80p per hour rolled-up holiday pay."

 

Your payslips must show the amounts separately. If they don’t, you should raise this issue with your employer. If you visit your local Citizens Advice, make sure you bring a recent payslip with you.

My pay slip just shows Daily Rate £xxx.xx - 20 days £xxxx.xx

There is no mention WHATSOEVER of Holiday Pay!

Hi all,

I've begun working with a teaching agency and have been on assignment since October 2016. The contract provided to me by the agency states that 'The Temporary Worker is engaged as a self-employed worker, although CT is required to make stautory deductions from the Temporary Worker's renumeration in accordance with clause 4(a)'. So I am self-employed but the agency deduct NI and PAYE tax from my pay - which is fine.

The booking confirmations I have received from the agency cleary state Daily rate, length of booking, place of booking. There is no mention of a separate holiday pay payment to pay slips etc.

I was under the impression that I was not entitled to holiday pay as I am now self-employed, however, from my reading online I believe I may be entitled to holiday pay as I am doing a job long-term that is comparable to a role that does include holiday pay.

I have questioned my agency regarding this and received the response that holiday pay is part of my daily rate and that 12.07% of my daily rate is set aside for holiday pay.

I find this misleading as firstly, this has never been explained to me and secondly because the contract they have provided me is very misleading in terms of entitlement to holiday pay:

Here's what it says:

Under the Working Time Regulations 1998, the Temporary Worker is entitled to 4 weeks' paid leave per leave year.

The Temporary Worker agrees that payment in respect of the entitlement to paid leave shall be made together with and in addition to the Temporary Worker's rate.

Payment in respect of any entitlement to paid leave shall be made as part of the Temporary Worker's rate.

Where on earth do I stand with all this??

I know I probably shouldn't have replied now that Ofgem are involved,

but I've saved it all and uploaded it to their evidence.

I'm just more intrigued with how CRS are going to prove this debt!

As they seem to be happy to chase me for money without any proof from First Utility that a debt exists...

Dear Mr Medved,

 

Thank you for your response to my letter dated 5th February 2016.

 

The final bill which you have attached, and that this matter relates to, shows that my account is £385.65 in CREDIT. I.e. I had overpaid by £385.65.

 

You have stated that the current balance, which you are chasing for, is £317.57.

 

To confirm, I have not made any payments to you or First Utility since November 2014 when the final bill was produced.

 

As far as I am concerned, you have NOT proved that a valid debt exists. You are prohibited by Law from continuing any collection activity until you have done so. Failure to obey the law in this regard will render you liable to prosecution for harassment.

 

If you have reason to believe that a valid debt still exists, please provide evidence in writing of this debt.

 

Little update..

Case is now in Ofgem's hands. I've had an e-mail from First Utility today stating that they are now providing information to Ofgem.

Interestingly enough, had a response from CRS regarding the 'prove-it' letter.

They reckon there is now a bill of £315.57 outstanding.

The bill they have attached (which is the bill First Utility have sent to them) is from November 2014 (the last bill)

and shows that the account is £385.65 in credit.

This is going to go down an absolute storm at Ofgem when I provide the files tomorrow!!

Now passed on to Ofgem. They have to remain impartial but the guy I spoke to thinks I have a very good chance of winning. Time will tell!

So I phoned First Utility (recorded the call) and asked to either send me a deadlock letter or call off the bailiffs. Apparently this has been arranged.

Today recieved the following e-mail:

'Thank you for your previous correspondence.

 

Firstly, please accept my sincere apologies for the upset caused as a result of the problems you have experienced with our service to date and the length of time it has taken to respond; we do strive to offer an exceptional service to all of our customers and we are extremely disappointed when we do not achieve this.

 

I have tried to contact yourself today by telephone, unfortunately I was unable to reach you, however I do hope that you received my voice mail message.

 

I would like to apologise for the time that this has taken to come to a resolution. I have looked through the account and have done a calculation in regards to how much energy you have used from your initial read to your final read.

 

You were sent a payment via cheque for the amount of £385.65, you made a total of £327.57 which means we over paid you £58.08. As you have had all of your payments back and the over payment this means there has been no payment made towards your usage.

 

As a goodwill gesture I am going to wavier the extra cost of £58.08, so the total amount owed is £277.73. Please see attached the manual calculation showing your consumption.

 

Once again I would like to apologise for the inconvenience and thank you for giving me the opportunity to resolve your complaint.'

and my reply...

Thank you for your e-mail.

 

I am not sure which correspondence you are referring to or what has warranted your e-mail response.

 

I spoke to Fatima at First Utility on 05/02/2016 who said that there was £316.75 outstanding on this account. Fatima confirmed that the last invoice on the account was for £10.82 as a credit balance. You have not billed me since September 2014, according to your own records and confirmed by Fatima.

 

I asked Fatima to supply me with a ‘deadlock’ letter so that I can get this matter escalated to Ofgem. Please can you supply this as soon as possible.

 

I have also written to you, via post, with a Subject Access Request. According to Royal Mail, this has been delivered and you have 40 days from 8th February to comply with this request. I also enclosed a £10 cheque which is the statutory maximum for releasing these documents.

 

Further to this, I asked Fatima to note on my account that all further correspondence should be made in writing only. As this matter shows no signs of coming to an end, I am now evidencing all my contact with First Utility for further action, if required.

 

Please note that all further postal correspondence should be sent to my current residential address: ------ I did provide this as a forwarding address in August 2014 along with the final meter readings, however I was informed by Fatima that this had not been recorded. To confirm, I have no access to 10 ------, so have not received any postal correspondence from yourselves and will not do if you continue sending correspondence to that address.

First Utility have informed me that I was last invoiced on September 2014, which I was £10.22 in credit.

Since then, no invoice has been raised for the £316.75 I apparently owe.

As there has been no invoice in over 12 months,

does this mean that I have nothing to pay under the backbilling code?

Thanks for the info fkofilee. It is easy to see how people get intimidated to pay it straight away when a DCA get involved!

So even though First Utility are now chasing me 17 months down the line, and they admit the error was their fault,

I am still liable to pay this back?

I am not trying to second guess your legal knowledge at all, just trying to fathom how this all is going to end up

Hi newuser789

Having a similar problem with First Utility and CRS.

Do let us know how you get on

Hi All,

In October 2013, I moved into a shared property in Norwich as a student sharing with 3 other guys.

I organised/paid the bills and they all paid me.

In August 2014, we moved out of the property.

We had paid monthly to First Utility and had overpaid on our final bill.

I had to chase First Utility and eventually they refunded me £350

(not sure to the penny as was a few years ago and I don't have the bank account anymore).

However, during this chasing, I was told that I also had a £400 (ish) credit on my account

and would refund this as a cheque.

I did think this was strange, however, didn't keep a close tab on the bills

and presumed this was right as they had taken the previous refund into account.

Both refunds eventually processed and in my bank account.

Move forward 16 months,

in December 2015 I started receiving texts from First Utility telling me my bill was 400 days overdue.

I ignored these texts, but tweeted them asking for them to stop texting me

seeing as the account had been closed and finalised.

I then got a call from a Complaints handler who told me that the second refund was in error

and that I now owe them this money back.

After repeating to her that I will not be paying this back, as it's been over 12 months and this is their fault,

I was then told it would be passed onto a debt collection agency.

Yesterday I received a text from CRS Debt Collectors telling me that they had been instructed by First Utility to resolve an outstanding matter, and to contact them with the reference number.

Obviously I have not contacted them, but now am not sure where to go to...

Luckily, First Utility do not have my current address and therefore I believe the chance of CRS turning up on my doorstep is minimal. And I know that they have no legal powers and to send them away.

So in summary...

- First Utility refunded me 2 different amounts (why they were different we won't know), one after the other.

- First Utility are now trying to claw back the second refund even though it was their fault.

- First Utility have my phone number and e-mail address,

however, have not tried to contact me between August 2014 and November 2015 about this overpayment.

- I am refusing to pay this back.

- CRS have now been instructed to collect this from me.

What do I do???

I would send them a letter but I am loathed to give out my current address.