Thanks Planner

Hi

We recently left a rented property that we had for the past 2 years approx. The deposit is held in a TDS and the letting agent/landlord has just advised us that they are retaining the deposit.

Whilst I accept that there has been some damage because i have 4 teenage daughters so pretty unaviodable I would like to find out where I stand and what I do regards the dilapadation list I have been given.

First thing that I would like to ask is that I was never invited to the check out, this took place between the LA and the LL and I wonder if there is a requirement that the tenant should be invited?

Secondly, the list I have been provided with is as follows ( with my observations):

1. Property needs cleaning not left in satisfactory condition. (pretty ambiguous..my wife and 4 daughters spent all day cleaning the place so what specifically needs cleaning?)

2. Decor in front room damaged (Accepted..there was approx 6" x 6" of wallpaper damaged by computer chair)

3. Bed left in bedroom (Accepted..this was a fairly new bed and we assumed the LL might be able to make use of it rather than dump it..obviously not the case)

4. Carpet from loft left in outside store needs cleaning in order to reinstate (Carpet was in very poor condition in the first place that was the reason it was replaced)

5. Several holes in brickwork to accom additional aerial cables - brickwork needs repointing ( I ahd these professionally fitted and to be honest I would have thought the LL would want to keep them - not the case however but how much brickwork needs repointing? )

6. Glass to bathroom needs replacing (Accepted)

It goes on to say that quotes are being arranged for the work required. My questions are as follows:

I am a builder by trade so could do most of the things required.

I can easily get rid of the bed in my own van.

Why should I pay for a carpet to be cleaned that was in a poor condition in the first place?

Should I now formulate a letter to the letting agents stating all of the above?

What are the procedures for this when the deposit is held in a TDS, are there timescales involved for the LA to get quotes etc and for me to reply to them?

I would be happy for any comments, observations,criticisms that anyone has. I just hope it all makes sense

I have been dealing with cabot since 2007 trying to get a valid agreement from them over a disputed debt to monument.

Now i do the same as ashmk and file their letters. They obviously can't conform with my request so they really are like a dog with no teeth to me..they have already defaulted me but i can live with that..i'm b*ggered if i am paying them any money until they prove it though

Thanks for your reply Sidewinder. As far as i'm aware there never has been anything in writing since she started the job. The only reason he seems to have come up with one now is cause of the dispute over break times. I will try and obtain more info on the dispute if it will help.

I will also tell her to contact ACAS as has been suggested as well as the CAB.

Thanks for your reply As far as i can gather the new contract came about cos there was some misunderstandings over break times. There is no way she can accomodate the saturday working as she has 3 children and she has just given birth to our grandson.

Obviously her main concern is that she will lose her job if she fails to sign the new contract. Apparently he is asking her every time she picks up her maternity pay and she is feeling pressurised into signing.

I have already told her to get along to the CAB but I am trying to get some information together so as to settle her fears as she has enough problems with coping with the baby and her children without this hanging over her.

Thanks again

My eldest daughter, who is a single mum with 3 children. has been working in a shop for the last 5 years. The reason for her accepting the job in the first place was because it didn't involve weekends and fitted around school times.

Just recently, after an upset about hours of work etc. from other employees which didn't involve my daughter as she is currently on maternity leave, her employer has come up with a new written contract of employment which states that my daughter has to now work saturdays.

I have told her not to sign anything at the moment ( she is due to start back to work in july) as i'm fairly sure he can't do that without discussion etc.

I don't know to much about employment law and would really be grateful for any advice you can give me

Many thanks!

Thanks fellas I shall now send it of to them and see what they have to say.

Hi all

Apologies for the delay in replying but I have been laid up with the flu

Good advice from all concerned as usual. I know it's difficult to get defaults removed but that's not to say they can't as has already been said. To be honest I never expected them to write it off so miracles do happen it would seem.

I might be seen as pushing it here but to me personally the excuse that it's a 'commercial decision' is a load of cr*p imo and the reality is that they don't have a regulated agreement.

I'm not thinking as far as courts just yet..that's not to say I won't be..first I'm gonna keep batting the ball back by using their inhouse complaints procedure as they have suggested and quite simply see what happens. If I have to involve the FOS as well but that's later on down the line.

This is the reply I have come up with. Comments/Obs always welcome

HSBC Finance Limited

Customer Relations Team

P.O. Box 3607

Birmingham

B1 2XJ

29 November 2008

Dear Sir/Madam

Following a letter received from your in-house collectors, Metropolitan Services Ltd, I have been referred back to yourselves as, despite the lack of conformance with regards to my consumer credit agreement request under s. 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and the fact that the debt has now been written off, there still seems to be some reluctance to remove the unlawful default notice placed on my mother’s credit file, and I have been advised to use your internal complaints procedure as advertised on your own website.

I have been informed that the reason for the debt being written off was a ‘commercial decision’, implying that it had nothing to do with the fact that you or your in-house people failed to conform to my CCA request.

That being the case can I therefore assume that a valid credit agreement does exist, and the reason you have failed to provide me with a copy of it is only known to your good selves?

If that isn’t the case then may I respectfully suggest that you are acting outside of the law. The ability to place a default against someone’s name is only allowed where a regulated agreement exists under the CCA 1974 under the following conditions as stated within the Act under s.87:

(1) Service of a notice on the debtor or hirer in accordance with section 88 (a "

default notice ") is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor or hirer of a regulated agreement:

(a) to terminate the agreement, or

(b) to demand earlier payment of any sum, or

© to recover possession of any goods or land, or

(d) to treat any right conferred on the debtor or hirer by the agreement as

terminated, restricted or deferred, or

(e) to enforce any security.

Therefore it is perfectly clear that the default clause can ONLY be used if a regulated agreement exists and if it did not you had no right to serve a default notice in the first place.

If the case is that you do have in your possession a regulated agreement between yourselves and my mother would you please be good enough to conform to my original request and provide me with a true copy of it or, failing that, remove the unlawful default record placed against my mother’s name.

If you fail to abide by my requests I can assure you that I intend to pursue this complaint to it’s fullest extent and, If I have to, I will be involving the Financial Ombudsman and the courts if required.

Yours sincerely

The saga continues 8)

Recieved this in reply to my letter last week asking them to remove the default entered against my mother's name. This follows the letter from them informing me they were writing of the debt

Any observations/comments would be welcome. I'm forming a reply and will upload it for comments later.

Thanks in advance

Hi kirklanw

Unfortunately it would seem that the lack of a valid CA means very little to these people and they will still persue the debt ...that's the bad news!

The good news is that it's a bit like a dog with no teeth...the lack of a CA leaves them very (if any) leverage specially if it does come to court. In my situation I was acting on behalf of my elderly mother and despite them obviously having no CA they still chased for the debt by sending template letters etc. My answer to that was to simply refer them back to my previous correspondence and point that they had yet to conform to my CCA request, also pointed out (as if they didn't know!)that it was/is an offence to persue a debt that is in dispute.

Amazingly enough I had a letter last week informing me that they could see no point in persuing the debt and therefore they have written it off

So my advice would be stick to your guns and keep batting the ball back into their court. They know full well that they have no legal clout so there is very little they can do for now. Given enough time it will be obvious (if it isn't already) that they don't have a valid CA and then is the time to decide your next action..perhaps take them to court if that's what you want to do. It's what I was prepared to do but fortunatley I haven't had to go through with it and I hope a you have a similar conclusion.

I still have templates of letters I have written so if they would be of any help just pm me and I will let you have a copy.

Hope this helps

Ok thanks CB

Thanks you fellas I'm not sure I could have done it without you all though.

If I could just run this past you as well...just me thinking out loud really

They have declared in writing that the debt is now to be written off, i'm assuming it's because of the lack of a valid CA.

That being the case, the default that they placed on my mums credit file was /is unlawful if not illegal as they were obviously operating outside of the CCA but using it's instruments as and when it suited them. So i am quite within my rights to ask (order?) them to remove it?

Observations welcomed

Hi all

Sorry for the dealy in updating but the whole thing reached a bit of an empasse' as they have a habit of doing.

However the latest is that after receiving yet another template letter and a strong response from me referring them to my previous communications (lack of valid CA etc etc) I have just received a letter today with the news that they are no longer feel that anything can be gained from persuing the debt and the debt will be written off!!

So there you go! it would seem that due to the complete lack of a valid CA they have backed down. All that's left now is to get them to remove the default HSBC placed on my mother's credit file so I will be winging a letter off tomorrow to that effect.

I would like to say a BIG thank you to all that offered their help and advice..you are true angels imo and I would like you to know that you have made an 80yo pensioner very happy and very relieved!

For those that are still in battle with these people please don't give up.. they can be taken on and they can be forced to back down when confronted with the knowledge and power that is abound on this forum.

God bless you all

Ok thanks for clearing that up

thanks for your input MrShed. I am due to meet the property manager on thursday to see what needs doing.

Whilst I'm aware that they need to re-let the property I merely wanted the opportunity to see what needs doing and whether I could do at least some of it..and I am aware they can just go ahead and deduct what they need to with the deposit...but whether it's reasonable or not is a different matter..my experience so far with these letting agents hasn't been particularly good and all I want from them is to be fair.

Also wasn't aware that we would still be laible for rent, My mother had a periodic tenancy and my understanding was that she is/was only liable for the rent up to the date of quitting the tenancy having given the appropriate notice... perhaps I am wrong and someone here can clear that point up for me?

Thanks again

Thanks for your reply help_me I have done as you suggested already and delivered a letter asking them to deal with me direct and also for a delapidation list.

As you say there is a fair amount of wear and tear within the property as it has never been decorated by the LL during the tenancy and anything that has been done has been carried out by myself. I have asked to meet a representative on site to discuss the problems. As my business deals with property development and maintence I am hoping I can do most things required myself given enough time. I will let you know how the meeting went.

Thanks again

Hi

My mother has recently moved to a new sheltered bungalow (she is 80) from a privately let house she occupied for 10 years.

The letting agent has telephoned her since with a list of defects that they want attending too which i'm happy to consider prior to the return of deposit but they are putting pressure on my mother in that they have told her that these things need attending to urgently priior to the new tenants moving in and if they are not then they will call in professionals and bill us. As my mother can't possibly do anything and I have my own business to run they don't seem to be giving us much time to discuss things.

Whilst I appreciate that we have to enter a dialogue with these people i don't see why we should be bullied or rushed into doing anything just so they can re-let the place. There are things on their list that I don't agree with and imo are fair wear and tear bearing in mind that the tenancy was 10 yo and the place was never decorated by the LL in that time.

My questions are:

Do they have to supply me with a list of defects in writing?

Is there a period of time given to negotiate and perhapscome to agreement about these alleged defects?

Thanks very much in advance

Hi

My mother who is 80 yo is moving into a sheltered bungalow having lived in a privately rented house for the past 10 years.

I am helping with the move and changing services, notices to quit etc. and we have just had a letter following our notice to quit and it states that it is a requirement that my mother provides copies of final account statements of all utility bills to ensure the release of her deposit. As most of the utilities are being transferred to the bungalow i'm not sure how this is gonna be possible.

Am I right in thinking that they can't request or require that this be done? I'm sure I have read somewhere that the utitliy bills are nobody else's business other than between the utility company and the account holder?

My mother is ony on a pension and she could really do with the deposit to help pay for removal fees etc and i'm concerned that the LA are gonna play hardball with her so any help/advice offered would be most grateful

Still keeping a close eye on your thread Chris Wishing you all the best and can't wait to see thier defence too

Just because they cant it does not mean they wont.

 

Several of my CCAs are either unenfourcable /not complied with and they are still trying to enforce then debt by sending me statements.

Agreed. I was merely stating what's contained in the CCA. Two companies I have dealings with failed to supply a CCA and seem to have gone to ground but still placed a default on my record .

A simple read around this site tells you that non-conformance means nothing to these characters and they jump in and out of the CCA as and when it suits them.

You don't have to do anything - the debt is now in default and they cannot take any action to enforce it until they produce a true copy of the valid agreement

Any chance you can post the letter sam? I have a sneaky feeling it will go along the lines of the reply I received from them after they sent me an unenforceable CA.

Have you reported this to the Financial Ombudsman? and as in your letter the OFT and TS?

Ok.. thanks for answering my questions. As has been said it looks enforceable and I think you might find it difficult to prove that she didn't request the medicare and ppi unless she has her own copy of the agreement, which I'm assuming she hasn't?.

No I don't think this is enforceable. As you have said it doesn't contain the presribed terms on the signature page amongst other things and looks very much like just a pre-contractual application form to me

Yep a complete joke.. which is nothing unusual for Goldfish it would seem.