Just a quickie, Noomill... Again this whole thing's been on hold for a few weeks - MSc stuff and my life taking priority .... In my letter before action do I set out all the numbered points or do I leave all that for the actual court summons? Thanks Jayney

Thanks, Noomil... There are 7 months' worth of arrears in total - split into 1 month and 6 months: One Month One month was from several years ago (I would have to look up the date) when they didn't send me the deferment forms so I called them to get some. I completed them and sent them back within the 3-month backdating period allowed. They chose to process the deferment after the three months, thereby going into the fourth month... hence one month in arrears. (They have confirmed that they received them within the 3 months.) Shortly after this is when the letters and phone calls began, pestering me for money. 6 Months The other 6 months' worth is from 2005 when my deferment form came through just after I'd changed jobs. I phoned the slc and they said that a letter from Personnel confirming my employment and salary would be fine. I got a letter from personnel and sent it off with the form. Then I received a standard form from the slc telling me that I hadn't enclosed any proof of income with my deferment form. Annoyed, I phoned the slc to tell them that I had sent in a letter form Personnel as agreed. They said they hadn't received it. I probably then hung up on them out of frustration. I couple of weeks later (took me this long to calm down enough) I phoned them again. This time they told me they had received the Personnel letter but they couldn't accept it as it wasn't dated. I asked why they hadn't told me this in the first place and it could have been sorted out very easily, rather than telling me they hadn't received it... By this time I had been working in my job long enough to have a payslip and I didn't want to go bothering Personnel again. I asked the slc whether I could send in my one payslip and a copy of my contract which contained all the salary and dates they could possibly need. They agreed. I sent them copies of the above and heard nothing more from them, assuming my deferment had been accepted. Several months later the phone calls started again and I thought it was about the one month's arrears - the only one I knew about - but they said I had 7 months' arrears. It is only then that it came to light that they were claiming they had never received my payslip and contract. Just after this conversation, having changed jobs again, I sent them sufficient information for them to defer my account. Since the above, I have deferred in time every year. There has been at least one occasion when they have claimed I've sent them only one payslip when it transpired that they hadn't scanned the two underneath... and other examples of incompetence. Sorry for the wordy reply. What do you reckon? Thanks Jayney

Hi Noomill Yes, I have a list of all the charges. I'm planning on sitting down with it all this weekend and trying to sort it. The only problem (well, one of the only problems) is that I'm asking for the charges to be removed as they're unlawfully punative, but what do I do about the arrears which they have erroneously charged onto my account? The charges are there because of the arrears, and the arears shouldn't be there in the first place. Strictly speaking, shouldn't I be going for the arrears?... if I can show that they've been accrued in error then the charges will disappear too. I know I can get the charges removed by following your advice and it may be the easiest way to go, but then I'm faced with either addressing the arrears separately (which makes addressing the charges first a waste of time) or coughing up, seeing as though it's money I'd probably end up payng back anyway. What do you reckon? I'm tying myself up in knots with this! Jayney

Hello human, When I got all the stuff in response to my SAR it was pretty incomprehensible and certainly not separated out into different loan numbers. Although I have 6 loans they've always been lumped together - I only have to defer once per year so it suits me.... I just wish their info was better organised. I've never asked them for copies of the original agreements... it's tempting to start getting all Perry Mason and think that if they can't produce one of them then they can't claim anything from me, but, in my case, I've never once suggested to them that I didn't take out the loans so I'd probably be on thin ice trying it now. If my case does end up in court - highly unlikely, apparently, as the slc always cave in at the last minute - I wouldn't want the judge to get the impression that I was relying on tricks or loopholes to win my case.... I don't need to resort to them as it's all clear and true! I'll keep plodding on with mine and post updates as and when. Good luck with yours! Noomill's been through all this already and has really helped and encouraged me to keep going and not be intimidated. Good luck! Jayney

Update... I've been up to my eyes in MSc work so this SLC malarky has had to go on the back burner for a while so not much to update except... I sent a holding letter to the SLC today (recorded, of course!) telling them they'll hear from me by the end of the month with a view to recovering any charges and arrears. Coincidentally I had a letter in today's post from "Banner Jones Solicitors"... except NOT!!!!! It's such a brief letter, I'll quote it: "We have received details of your account and we are now preparing this case for legal action. We will be instructing the court to commence formal recovery proceedings for the outstanding amount. Official documents will be sent to you in due course, however if you wish to avoid this action at this late stage then it is imperative that you contact our office on 0845 337 5126 within the next 48 hours. No futher correspondence will be issued prior to commencement of legal action." Well... I phoned them on the 0845 number and spoke to the same sort of muppet that I've spoken to at NCO, Westlea, etc etc... whose only job is to ask for money. I asked him if he was a solicitor and he said he wasn't prepared to answer that question. I asked what company I was calling and he said they work on behalf of Banner Jones. So I asked again what company I was calling and he said I was calling Banner Jones! I said that I didn't believe him as he'd just told me he worked on behalf of BJ ( amused myself with their initials!). Eventually he hung up! I phoned back and a female answered. I asked her what company I was phoning. She asked for my reference number. I said she didn't need that to tell me what company I was phoning! She asked me to hold and then came back and, after repeating the above, eventually told me I was phoning CCM! Further prodding revealed this to be Close Credit Management! So, yet another debt collection company trying to scare and harrass me... fan-blummin-tastic! Anyone else come across these jokers? If anyone out there has any proper legal knowledge, could you tell me whether it is illegal to effectively pass yourself off as a solicitor? The letterhead is from BJ solicitors with all their contact info on it, but it's actually CCM! The letter threatens action that they cannot carry out purely to intimidate me into making payments... this can't be legal! Sorry for long update - I'm very grrrr with the SLC and everyone associated with them and can't wait for this whole farce to be over! Jx

Thanks Noomill, I'll definitely use your version with the necessary amendments. Sorry for sounding all desperate and panicky ~ I thought that a LBA was an official legal thing that had to be worded in legalese... glad it's not! Yes, I've read your WON thread a few times - sounded very exciting/exasperating... and I'm still intrigued to find out what was in that mystery letter ! One last (for now!) question... I've got 6 loan numbers - (I was a student for too long!) - so which should I use as my account number at the top of the LBA? Smith Lawson tend to just use the first one but the SLC list all 6 at the top. Perhaps I've answered my own question... I'll quote all of them and will send my letter to them timeously

I don't know what to do now! I know I should be sending a letter before action but I don't really know what to put in it and no one's sent me a link to a template Someone, please help me... I'm at my wits' end with this

Can you direct me to a template for the Letter Before Action please? All our posts seem to be littered with hyperlinks to a law pack that costs £20 rather than links to templates which I know exist somewhere! Cheers J

Please see post above... I'm all prepared to make my next move this weekend but do I write to the slc first or do for the smail claim straight away? Thanks, J

Sorry... our posts crossed! Do I write to the slc first or just go straight for the small claim?... and is there a template/letter etc somewhere?

I'm looking forward to it (just like when I took a landlady to court for the return of my deposit... and won!) So, what do you think my next step should be?... I've been thinking since my long email earlier that it's more important to get the charges wiped seeing as the arrears are part of the loan so I'll end up paying them back at some point (if I ever earn enough - actually quite unlikely, working for the local council!). I'd still want to fight the bar stewards (ha!) over them though and get them added back into the loan. Btw they haven't sent me copies of my loan agreements with the SAR bumf. Is it a red herring to think that my loans aren't valid if they can't find these? J

Hi Noomill Thanks for your replies. I've just realised that the total of the charges on the statements was probably correct at the time - they've added a bit since I received them. J

Hi Noomill I've finally been through all the paperwork the slc have sent me in response to my SAR but it's incomplete! (typical) Their database seems to have no record of conversations between January 2005 and September 2008, but then some print outs from "Tallyman"(?) show some records for this period. The records of conversations and letters they have supplied are very brief and generally an inaccurate summary! They've sent me some statements but the charges recorded on them total less than what they say I owe in charges, and they've sent me (poor) copies of some letters but there were definitely more... in fact one of the Tallyman records refers to a letter they sent me which isn't included! When I last deferred I enclosed a letter demanding that they cease contacting me about any supposed arrears and charges as the account is in dispute. I told them I would be writing again once I'd been through their paperwork which would hopefully be by the end of March. Since then they have continued to harrass me by phone and letter, even calling me at work! Sorry for the rant but what do you advise I do now? Apart from the incomplete SAR info, I was wondering which way is best to proceed: 1. seeing as though the charges have been accrued due to the arrears, if I could prove the arrears were not appropriate and get them added back into the loan then it should follow that the charges would have to be wiped.... or 2. continue to try to have the charges wiped and then address the arrears later - just concerned that by addressing the charges I may be inadvertantly admitting that they were correctly applied, albeit unlawfully high... As always, your advice and help would be very much appreciated. It's so good to know you've been through this and understand it - otherwise it would be quite a lonely place to be! J

Sorry for being a pedant but the title of your thread should read: Pre 2006 Students, why should we pay back debts that on today's system would have been given in grants? Pedantry is such a terrible affliction!

Hi Noomill Thanks for your quick reply. I'll get my highlighter out! I can't do anything for a week or so though - got an MSc assignment to do and working full-time so I'm far too busy for the slc hassle but I'm determined to sort this out asap. I'll add up all the charges and let you know. Thanks again.

Hi everyone! I've been reading various threads on this website for a while now and thought it was about time to start my own... and hopefully get some help and support if I need it . I'm trying to claim back unlawful charges from the SLC which have been accrued due to some arrears they claim I owe... which I dispute as they are due to the slc's incompetence or "muppetry", to quote another poster on here. So far I've submitted my Subject Access Request to the slc and received a huge bundle of paperwork back from them. Before I go through it all with a fine tooth comb I need to know what my next step should be and if anyone can direct me to a template for my response. I'm getting to the end of my tether with the slc and their various pseudonyms/agents (Smith Lawson, NCO, etc), and their incessant phone calls. If anyone can help me with my next step I'd appreciate it. As an aside, a woman at Smith Lawson tried to tell me that there isn't an automatic deferment backdating period of 3 months. She said that the later someone sends in their deferment forms within the 3 months after their deferment expiry date, the more likely their forms will be processed AFTER the 3 months and therefore accrue a month of arrears. She said that it depends on their backlog as to when a deferment is processed! I said that the backlog isn't my problem, and that if my form is RECEIVED within the 3-month period then the deferment should be backdated for the full 3 months. The date of the deferment actually being processed is irrelevant! Anyone else have any issues with this 3 month backdating period? Thanks everyone, Jayney x

Hi Noomill It's been really interesting and useful to read about your success with reclaiming charges, and I will be sending the SLC a SAR on Monday. The reason the SLC have added charges to my account is because they claim I have arrears which, in my strong belief, are not valid as they have been accrued due to their own incompetence - long story which I won't bore you with! Any ideas how I can get them to remove the arrears and, in effect, add them back into the loan? Can I do this as part of court action for the charges or treat it separately somehow? This is getting quite urgent now as the latest letter I've had is from Westminsters Solicitors, headed "Notice Before Legal Proceedings". I've already been through the Smith Lawson and the NCO Europe stress!

I've had an on-going problem with the SLC for years... it's two problems really: The first problem arose when they didn't send me my deferment forms so when I realised I phoned them to ask for more. I filled them in with all the proof of income etc and they received them within the three month backdating period but decided to process them just after... making me one month in arrears!... I've refused to pay this and tried to explain it all but all they do is whack on the charges and bombard me with letters and phone calls... Last year I had another problem when they reckonned they hadn't received my proof of income (a letter from HR as I had just started new job), although they agreed they'd received my deferment form... hmmm. During a phone call a couple of weeks later they said they had in fact received the letter from HR but it was undated. This annoyed me... why didn't they tell me this before rather than saying they hadn't got it at all? I then send them a copy of my contract and 2 payslips and thought that would all be ok. Months later they say they didn't receive it so I was months in arrears... Now they won't leave me alone, and keep demanded money which I haven't got and don't believe I owe. I've tried writing several times and no one's interested... what should I do next? Any advice would be muchly appreciated.