Apple (2)Owner’s powers in relation to a registered charge consist of— (a)power to make a disposition of any kind permitted by the general law in relation to an interest of that description, other than a legal sub-mortgage, and (b)power to charge at law with the payment of money indebtedness secured by the registered charge. How can a borrower charge at law debt secured by a registered charge ? Come on, use some common sense here... The registered charge already exists and has ben granted to the lender..... The lender can use it as security when it borrowers funds from 3rd party Don't confuse what things mean with what you think they mean.

Come on Apple this is really basic stuff we are talking here, put your interpretations to one side and just read what the law actually says. Let me help you to get a grasp on the topic you have been giving advice about. - It will have to be another time now, I am afraid Casualty finishes soon and it is now time to go back to the wife

Apple it is ok, I know that you just don't get it. s.23(1) are the borrowers powers and by s.23(1)(a) Owner’s powers in relation to a registered estate consist of— (a)power to make a disposition of any kind permitted by the general law in relation to an interest of that description, other than a mortgage by demise or sub-demise, and As it says - the owner of the registered estate has the power to make a disposition of any kind permitted by general law Shall we take a look at dispositions.... ? http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2002/9/section/27 (2)In the case of a registered estate, the following are the dispositions which are required to be completed by registration— (f)the grant of a legal charge. The grant of a legal charge, is a disposition which is required to be completed by registration and it is a disposition that is permitted at general law. Contrary to your fanciful ideas and wishful thinking a borrower can and does grant a charge to the lender Come on, just read it, it is all there in plain english for you as for s.23(2) they are the powers of the proprietor of the legal charge.. who is that again ? Oh yeah, the law confirms the lender is the proprietor of the legal charge.

You can start to understand, when you stop with your interpretations (it is written in english after all) and just read and accept what it actually says and not what you wish and dream it said

And one of those amendments was http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Geo5/15-16/20/section/87 87 Charges by way of legal mortgage. (1)Where a legal mortgage of land is created by a charge by deed expressed to be by way of legal mortgage, the mortgagee shall have the same protection, powers and remedies (including the right to take proceedings to obtain possession from the occupiers and the persons in receipt of rents and profits, or any of them) as if— (a)where the mortgage is a mortgage of an estate in fee simple, a mortgage term for three thousand years without impeachment of waste had been thereby created in favour of the mortgagee; and (b)where the mortgage is a mortgage of a term of years absolute, a sub-term less by one day than the term vested in the mortgagor had been thereby created in favour of the mortgagee. (2)Where an estate vested in a mortgagee immediately before the commencement of this Act has by virtue of this Act been converted into a term of years absolute or sub-term, the mortgagee may, by a declaration in writing to that effect signed by him, convert the mortgage into a charge by way of legal mortgage, and in that case the mortgage term shall be extinguished in the inheritance or in the head term as the case may be, and the mortgagee shall have the same protection, powers and remedies (including the right to take proceedings to obtain possession from the occupiers and the persons in receipt of rents and profits or any of them) as if the mortgage term or sub-term had remained subsisting. The power conferred by this subsection may be exercised by a mortgagee notwithstanding that he is a trustee or personal representative. (3)Such declaration shall not affect the priority of the mortgagee or his right to retain possession of documents, nor affect his title to or right over any fixtures or chattels personal comprised in the mortgage. [F1(4)Subsection (1) of this section shall not be taken to be affected by section 23(1)(a) of the Land Registration Act 2002 (under which owner’s powers in relation to a registered estate do not include power to mortgage by demise or sub-demise).F1] F1S. 87(4) inserted (13.10.2003) by Land Registration Act 2002 (c. 9), ss. 133, 136(2), Sch. 11 para. 2(8) (with s. 129); S.I. 2003/1725, art. 2

The fact that you don't even realise that you don't understand what is a mortgage today, is expected - let me help you to understand My offer of help is sincere Apple, I can help you

I am willing to work with you through all your incorrect assumptions to help you understand the applicable law.

From your posts (including this one), it is clear that you have no idea whatsoever what a mortgage actually is today. It is your lack of understanding of what a mortgage actually is today that has led you to invent all your fanciful ideas At least we are making progress, it is now clear where you are confused and how you dreamed up all these theories.

What I am saying for "for the benefit of the readers of this thread" is that on virtually every point you have made about property law you are wrong A borrower can grant a legal charge to a lender - the lender is registered as proprietor of that charge and as the registered proprietor of that legal charge, is permitted at law to exercise the powers as defined by statute - I hope that is clear enough, even for you.

Hello Caro You are correct the LPA 1925 (as amended) is still law. It has been amended over time but it has not been repealed

Thanks for your concern. However, she was watching the voice and now Casualty - so she is more than happy at the moment

ok looks like you still don't understand what a mortgage is - may be this will help http://www.propertyaddict.com/mortgages/ Mortgage by legal charge This is the only type of legal mortgage available at the current time in the UK, there was previously and older type of mortgage known as "mortgage by demise" but this type of mortgage was abolished in the Land Registration Act 2002. In Scotland this type of mortgage is also know as "standard security". A mortgage by legal charge means that the borrower remains the legal owner of the property in question throughout the mortgage loan period. However, the lender retains sufficient rights over the property to be able to enforce foreclosure and repossess the property if the borrower defaults on their mortgage payments. Apple, I am willing to help you learn the basics, I really am

This post clearly demonstrates that you do not, even at a basic level understand what a mortgage actually is today. You are stuck on what a mortgage was and not what it is today. Please read the following, it will help you to understand the difference, if you have any questions, let me know, I am willing to help you to understand "But with a mortgage by legal charge, the borrower gets title to the property. At the same time, the lender has some rights over the property which ensures that the loan is repaid. In the modern mortgage, lenders have a charge over your property. This gives them the right to get paid if there is a problem with your mortgage payments" You need to appreciate the difference between a mortgage by demise / sub-demise and a mortgage by legal charge - this is the point that once you understand and appreciate will let the light in (as per my signature) - It is a simple concept and not exactly rocket science. Why do you feel that you are in any position to offer advice, when you don't even understand the basic's of the topic you are offering advice about ? I can't explain it to you in any simpler terms - how can you not understand ? Anyway, the written decision of the property chamber will be issued soon, may be you will accept it in writing from the property chamber. You will soon discover that you have based all your fanciful ideas on your misunderstanding of what a mortgage actually is now. Please accept my reassurances that I am not posting the obvious, to make you look like an idiot or a fool. I am doing it for the benefit of the readers of this thread.

Oh dear, here we go again... When it comes to Property Law Apple, you do more twisting (interpreting and changing the meaning) than Chubby Checker in his song And even more than Sam Cooke did in his song http://youtu.be/ABnnY8PSk8M With all the twisting of the law you do, I am surprised that you are not dizzy... Then again may be you are.... At least even Is It Me? now says it is the lender and not the borrower that actually grants a sub-charge, I would call that real progress. Now we just have to work on you and your interpretations. What can we do, to help you too understand just how far off the mark your fanciful ideas really are.

But I have to thank you, your claims are becoming more and more comical each day. Thank you

You need to read what the law states and stop the interpretations. You can call that friendly advice if you like ;-) Not long now until the written decision is issued ;-)

On the contrary Apple, as with most things you have misunderstood. I had to post as, whilst reading your post, I nearly spat out my rice crispies in response to your fanciful claims. You never fail to amaze me, just how much you are willing to ignore the law and interpret the complete opposite to what it really states... In terms of the legal charge, it is, as much as you may not like it a disposition of a registered estate (an estate that is registered ) http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2002/9/section/27 (2)In the case of a registered estate, the following are the dispositions which are required to be completed by registration— (f)the grant of a legal charge. Please note the key words "registered estate" "disposition" and "grant a legal charge" http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2002/9/section/23 As confirmed 23 Owner’s powers (1)Owner’s powers in relation to a registered estate consist of— (a)power to make a disposition of any kind permitted by the general law in relation to an interest of that description, other than a mortgage by demise or sub-demise, and The owner of a registered estate does have the power to grant a legal charge as it is permitted by general law and is not a mortgage by demise or sub-demise. So keep working on your interpretation skills... Even by your standards, you are slipping. You need to speak with Is It Me? about what was actually said on 20 January, otherwise you might look even more foolish

I was referring to the fact that as he states RM has been homeless for 3 years and every one he has written too has dismissed his claims. He even relies on s.2 in regard to the deed. Not even Apple does that (anymore) So that is why I have said he wasn't successful, if you think he was successful, we have very different ideas of success Now I am going back to my wife

Hello Is It Me? Sorry this is another one of your recent posts I missed. You have said "Ben, I think you have got it wrong with respect, as the LENDER has sub charged the mortgage when they sold it" I think you may have misunderstood what has been said in this thread. I argue that as you have said the lender can grant a sub-charge. It is your friend Apple that argues that it is the borrower that grants a sub-charge If what you have posted is any reflection upon what was actually said on 20 January, it would be to the Lenders advantage and not the borrowers, as it confirms the powers (s.23(2) ) are as I have argued those of the lender Thank you for your post, it is appreciated Ben

I am supposed to be spending time with the good lady wife this weekend. However when I read this... Apple you almost had it, right up to the second you had to use your infamous powers of interpretation. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/cy/ukpga/2002/9/notes/division/4/14 Who does the law say is the chargee ? Click on the link, the answer can be found at 223. Creation of legal charge 223. Paragraph 8 relates to a newly created charge over a registered estate or a registered rentcharge. The charge must be recorded in the register relating to the registered estate and show the chargee (typically the lender) as proprietor of that charge. Despite the law saying the lender, Apple interprets this to say the borrower lmao - What ever interpretation course you went on Apple, I would ask for your money back And as you said above You said - "There is no 'ambiguity'...no fanciful ideas... just the LAW...." and the law says the lender is the chargee - for that matter even the english language confirms the lender is the chargee I have made the important points in large text as Is It Me? has said he is reading from a small screen

Even without Apples mysterious and magical powers of interpretation, I can see the answer was clearly no he wasn't successful

I am going to be running late but after I noticed your reply, I just had to respond (sorry I missed it when you posted it) So one of the two applications was that of your "friend" and you was at the hearing You also say the sec 23 didn't go well for the lender. Now that is very interesting to hear, may be you could share more of what happened and what was said for the benefit of the others that have applications waiting to be heard. I wonder if the written decision of the Property Chamber, when it is issued as scheduled will detail what you have said or something to the contrary. Of course I will come to your party and I will apologise. You have a good weekend now Is It Me? I look forward to seeing what else you have to say about what was and was not said during the application hearing.

the truth ? Was he successful yes or no ?

well time for me to go for the weekend - have a nice weekend everyone, catch up with you all again on Monday

Where is the one that shows they are worried ?